Yeah horrible dumb episode.
Moving on. Should we ask to change the name of the thread to reflect the season or going forward a new thread per week?
The AV Club’s review did point out one good thing: the Doctor’s great line, “With crayons and a half a can of Spam, I could build you! Now get out of my way!” That’s the arrogance we’ve been looking for.
Other than that, poorly-written, poorly-plotted, poorly-paced. Just a crap ep.
I’d say, just make this a thread for the whole season.
I’m watching the current episode about Tesla right now, and the only thing that could possibly redeem it is if he turns out to be a fake.
It was better than last week at least. Yeah faint praise.
They do go for the heavy handed when they have a point to make. But the thing is in their parallel of Edison with the scorpion aliens, Edison as the idea stealer is the one remembered, with more, as the characters in the show, thinking of Tesla as a car.
And the portrayal of Tesla would have been more interesting if it captured more of the tragedy of the man, which was not just that he died penniless and with his substantial genius poorly recognized, but also his significant mental illness.
DSeid: Yes, I was thinking the same thing. Well, it’s better than Orphan 55 but that’s not a standard to use!
I keep feeling like they don’t know what they want to do with the stories. Do they want to tell a fun adventure? Do they want character growth? Do they want to teach history?
This one felt like the TNG episode with the Paklids. (“We look for things.”) But worse. I mean, I can forgive the scorpion queen (is that even a thing for that species?) and the drones. Okay, interesting. How did they even get this far if they steal technology and don’t understand it? How would a non space faring race be able to fix their spaceship, cobbled together by different species with different tech?
(This was the problem I had with the Wraith from SG Atlantis. I probably have a bad idea of how an advanced species should act and hissing and spitting and preening isn’t on the list.)
Again, feels like the companions could have been switched around and it wouldn’t have changed much.
And after stopping Ryan, in this episode, from using a weapon, the Doctor’s plan is to make a weapon and shoot it?
But there were some gems.
I did like Tesla and I like that actor, who is from the same place as Tesla.
I do think that while Tesla isn’t as well known as he should be. I did like how they portrayed Edison and Tesla.
I did like the Doctor used a different trick on the queen to get the queen where she wanted her.
So … better. A long way to go. 
Thanks for the discussion!
[Moderating]
Edited title
Well that’s standard NuWho formula - we always give them a chance to leave peacefully before destroying them. Oh they never do but we have to give them the chance to.
Tenant did a nice version of it, asking those around if they heard it, that he gave them the chance, that they leave him no choice …
Sometimes there’s been more anger or sadness or even smirk to it. This version just powered through it without changing gears in any way. The words were disgust and anger with them but the affect was still the same slightly pressured speech as is her baseline.
Same complaint on the interaction over destroyed planets. That should be some emotional reaction, a raw nerve hit, from The Doctor dealing with processing her home planet destroyed and having just finished seeing a future with Earth as an orphan planet … but no gear change at all.
I like that she is more in charge and the smartest in the room though!
The episode should have had The Doctor save Topsy.
I liked the Tesla episode actually. Sure, a lot of it made no sense, but it really felt like an honest-to-goodness Who episode. Whittaker took a while to find her legs as the Doctor, IMO, but suddenly I’m really feeling her.
Part of what I’ve always liked about the Doctor (and I hope I’m putting this clearly) is that knowing more than everybody else often paradoxically makes everything more confusing. In other words, when Doc sees things not acting as they should, or something previously unencountered, it’s more jarring to the Doctor than the average Joe. So there’s always that fumbling in the dark for a bit, even by the smartest person in the room. Then, when the “ah-ha” moment finally comes, look out. Whittaker and the current writers seem to be getting that, finally.
(Did anybody else catch the shout-out to the “Teeming Millions”?)
DSeid: Hmm. Good points.
I saw something recently that said if you are peaceful but not capable of great violence, you are harmless. The Doctor is not harmless. I feel like they have tried to make it a big deal when the Doctor is willing to do violence. But, yes, given how much he inspires other to do violence, maybe it’s hypocritical. And, yes, he does give them a chance, as you said, with the sycorax.
I love Jodie’s Doctor but am not happy with the writing. Haven’t been for years now.
I did mostly enjoy the Tesla episode, to be clear. Of course, after Orphan 55, not too high a bar. Fewer things to nit pick in this one and I could sit back and enjoy it.
Definitely appreciate that a bit of arrogance and being the smartest in the room is back.
Does anyone know how the ratings are? Is it slated for another series yet?
Thanks for the discussion!
Well, darn. Ratings are down. (Wasn’t sure how much I could find while at work.)
This one is an episode behind. https://tvseriesfinale.com/tv-show/doctor-who-season-12-ratings/
Overall, seems lower and I don’t like that as they will blame the first female Doctor for it and I don’t think that’s the case.
Every once in a while, I go to YouTube to rewatch some of my favorite Doctor Who scenes; usually, the emotional highlights, like the last five minutes of “A Good Man Goes To War”; or really strong performances by the cast (the master class in nonverbal acting that Alex Kingston and Peter Capaldi put on in the “Hello, sweetie” scene of “The Husbands of River Song”, for example).
I was watching Capaldi’s monologue to Jenna Coleman and Jemma Redgrave on war, in “The Zygon Inversion”, when I realized that what we haven’t yet seen from Chibnall and Whittaker is any depth in the Doctor. The character’s always had a goofy, manic, manchild aspect, and Whittaker is very good at that; she can do fish-fingers-and-custard. But she hasn’t shown us any of the Doctor’s gravitas. Can you imagine her giving Capaldi’s “Doctor…I give you up” speech? Or Smith’s speech to River in “The Name of the Doctor”: “You’re always here to me. And I always listen. And I can always see you.”? I believe Whittaker has the chops for drama; I’d like to see her get a chance to display them.
he wrote some great stories (“The Day of the Doctor”, “Heaven Sent”, “Listen”) and some not-so-great stories, but, as you said, even the less successful stories had great moments in them.
definitely true. from 1963 on, meh writing has always plagued Doctor Who, especially post-2006. Moffatt and RTD generally contributed the best scripts.
I’ve thought about this. it would please me if Doctor Who ended for a while without the current Doctor regenerating. then they retcon away the last couple of seasons and pretend that Capaldi regenerated into someone else. that’ll never happen because… oh no, sexist! but it would please me because Chibnall doesn’t work and neither does Whittaker, at least playing the part in this particular way.
(articles suggesting things like that used to appear in fanzines in the '80’s. I guess I’ve turned into one of those fans who can’t stand the current era of Doctor Who.)
Doctor Who has usually centered around the Doctor but not all eras have gone that route, starting in the late '70s. never mind that when Doctor Who first came out in 1963. it had an ensemble cast with the Doctor as the most important character, but not the “main” character. the Doctor got more and more prominent with time, in part because the audience fell in love with him.
personally, I like the show to center around the Doctor but Moffat didn’t invent the idea. RTD deliberately made Rose the focus of Series 1, for example, because the audience could relate to Rose more. with Series 2, he moved the focus back on the Doctor.
by “old school”, the OP clearly meant the Eccleston and Tennant eras.
Series 10 showed that Gallifrey had left the pocket universe and returned to the main universe, only in the far distant future.
So far we’ve had post-apocalyptic monsters in Russian subway tunnels followed by alien raiders who steal technology because they can, threatening death and destruction if they don’t get what they want and they don’t really understand how any of their acquired technology works. What’s next?
I rate the Moffat era massively highly. I can easily imagine Jodie Whittaker in some of my favourite episodes like Extremis, Vincent and the Doctor, Flatline, and others.
I can’t imagine Smith or Capaldi salvaging anything from crap like Orphan 55. That’s how I know the problem is the writing. Get some better writers in and all the other problems will fix themselves.
But the last ep?
I can imagine some range in that one. Some greater irritation at Edison, both at his lack of actual inventiveness and at the unfairness at knowing that he becomes the one rich and remembered while Tesla dies penniless and largely forgotten. Something other than a continued hypomanic response … maybe something slowly measured, clearly controlling a reaction, to the Scorpion Queen’s flippant ask if The Doctor, wit the current destroyed Gallifry arc in place and just after seeing destroyed Earth, has ever seen a destroyed planet. Some depth of some sort, any sort, to the traditional giving a chance to leave peacefully and then knowing that they will now be destroyed stating that they will just be forgotten … disgust, anger, pity, something other than the same fish-fingers-and-custard affect.
I know she’s got the chops for it, so I blame the directing.