# Doctor Who "Dark Water" and "Death in Heaven" (spoilers after it airs) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 29, 2014, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906 "2014-10-29T14:24:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Cinnamon\_Imp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/58956e/32.png) [@Cinnamon\_Imp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cinnamon_Imp)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2014, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/161 "2014-11-12T15:58:59Z")
> [@Algernon](#): > > I am somewhat of a Dr Who newbie. While I’ve watched all the episodes of this season, and dozen or so selected episodes of the “new” Dr Who, I know I am missing a lot. > > Can someone fill me in on the back story of Osgood? Imagine a fan somehow travelled into the Who-niverse and got a role as a character, sooking up to try and be a companion - or what they say here at [Petronella Osgood | Tardis | Fandom](http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/Osgood_%28The_Day_of_the_Doctor%29) 😉 ---
**Author:** ![leahcim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b4bc9f/32.png) [@leahcim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leahcim)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2014, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/162 "2014-11-12T17:49:47Z")
> [@Cinnamon\_Imp](#): > > Imagine a fan somehow travelled into the Who-niverse and got a role as a character, sooking up to try and be a companion Basically, she’s a “take that” to all of the fangirls David Tennant and Matt Smith brought to the franchise. ---
**Author:** ![Small\_Hen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ad7895/32.png) [@Small\_Hen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Small_Hen)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2014, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/163 "2014-11-12T19:57:13Z")
> [@leahcim](#): > > Basically, she’s a “take that” to all of the fangirls David Tennant and Matt Smith brought to the franchise. I don’t consider her to be much of a “Take that!”, mostly because she’s a quite likable, smart, and overall positive character. I felt the same way about Elton and the members of LInDA (whatever you may think of the episode). if you want a real “Take that!” character, check out Becky the Superfan from Supernatural. ---
**Author:** ![Small\_Hen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ad7895/32.png) [@Small\_Hen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Small_Hen)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2014, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/164 "2014-11-12T21:33:31Z")
Sorry to double post, but I didn’t think to ask this earlier - in her “I’m the Doctor” lie, Clara states, “I’ve been married four times, all deceased.” I count three: his wife on Gallifrey pre series, River Song, and Queen Elizabeth. Who am I missing? ---
**Author:** ![Infovore](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/infovore/32/420_2.png) [@Infovore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Infovore)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2014, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/165 "2014-11-12T21:55:24Z")
> [@Small\_Hen](#): > > Sorry to double post, but I didn’t think to ask this earlier - in her “I’m the Doctor” lie, Clara states, “I’ve been married four times, all deceased.” I count three: his wife on Gallifrey pre series, River Song, and Queen Elizabeth. Who am I missing? Apparently at some point he was briefly married to Marilyn Munroe. ---
**Author:** ![Flutterby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Flutterby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flutterby)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2014, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/166 "2014-11-12T22:46:12Z")
Christmas well episode, night before Christmas type, they’re is talk of him marrying Marylin when he took the scrooge guy and the cute girl out every Christmas Eve. S5, just watched it the other day. But BF and I had that discussion after watching The Doctor’s Wife last night. Wasn’t that referring to the TARDIS? So is she (the TARDIS) considered his wife also? ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2014, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/167 "2014-11-12T23:23:45Z")
> [@Infovore](#): > > Apparently at some point he was briefly married to Marilyn Munroe. Also Idris, [The Doctor’s Wife](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Doctor%27s_Wife), deceased. ---
**Author:** ![Small\_Hen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ad7895/32.png) [@Small\_Hen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Small_Hen)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2014, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/168 "2014-11-12T23:34:40Z")
> [@Flutterby](#): > > Christmas well episode, night before Christmas type, they’re is talk of him marrying Marylin when he took the scrooge guy and the cute girl out every Christmas Eve. S5, just watched it the other day. But BF and I had that discussion after watching The Doctor’s Wife last night. Wasn’t that referring to the TARDIS? So is she (the TARDIS) considered his wife also? I thought he was only engaged to Marylin. I might be wrong, though, it’s been a while since I’ve seen that one. And though the episode was called “The Doctor’s Wife,” at no point in the episode did he marry the TARDIS/Idris, so I don’t think that counts. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2014, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/169 "2014-11-13T00:14:04Z")
> [@Small\_Hen](#): > > I don’t consider her to be much of a “Take that!”, mostly because she’s a quite likable, smart, and overall positive character. I felt the same way about Elton and the members of LInDA (whatever you may think of the episode). if you want a real “Take that!” character, check out Becky the Superfan from Supernatural. The “take that!” is the part where they kill her off, not the character. I think telling Clara “STFU he was never your boyfriend” on the first episode was basically the same thing also. ---
**Author:** ![Algernon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a183cd/32.png) [@Algernon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algernon)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2014, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/170 "2014-11-13T15:15:26Z")
> [@Cinnamon\_Imp](#): > > \ - or what they say here at [Petronella Osgood | Tardis | Fandom](http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/Osgood_%28The_Day_of_the_Doctor%29) 😉 Ahh. I should’ve guessed there would be a Dr Who Wiki. Thanks! (also thanks to **Infovore** for responding) ---
**Author:** ![MrAtoz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@MrAtoz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrAtoz)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2014, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/171 "2014-11-13T15:46:44Z")
> [@Algernon](#): > > Ahh. I should’ve guessed there would be a Dr Who Wiki. Thanks! > > (also thanks to **Infovore** for responding) I like that in the little quick info box, they include the following very helpful information: > [@](#): > > Sister: Osgood’s sister. ---
**Author:** ![Toucanna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3bc359/32.png) [@Toucanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toucanna)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2014, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/172 "2014-11-14T21:04:03Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > [New Spin-off coming this summer…](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9uGeLygnBQI) Oh, please, oh yes, oh please please please, Santa I promise I’ll be good please I want this _so-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o_ bad!!! ---
**Author:** ![Penfeather](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penfeather/32/384_2.png) [@Penfeather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penfeather)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2014, 7:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/173 "2014-11-16T07:54:14Z")
> [@Nobody](#): > > No, he’d tell Yates, and Yates would tell Benton. Canonically - and iconically - not true: [Quote=The Brigadier in The Daemons] Sergeant, chap with the wings - five rounds, rapid fire! [/Quote] ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2014, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/174 "2014-11-16T17:20:50Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > [New Spin-off coming this summer…](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9uGeLygnBQI) His sidekick should be the good Dalek from the beginning of the season. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2014, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/175 "2014-11-16T18:31:11Z")
> [@Small\_Hen](#): > > The select few people able to buck off Cyberman assimilation, with no explanation. It was explained, though. Missy has changed the way the Cybermen are created. They don’t rely on the inhibitor to suppress human emotions anymore. Rather, they’re tricked into deleting their emotions in the elaborate “heaven” scam. Danny never agreed to the deletion, though - his mind was downloaded back into his new Cyber body intact. Presumably, the Brigadier likewise declined, possibly because he’d been around the Doctor long enough to spot that something fishy was going on with the whole “afterlife” deal. Which is pretty impressive, given that the persuasion largely involves torturing the person until they sign. Clara does eventually activate Danny’s inhibitor, and he still doesn’t turn into a killing machine. But it was established back in the season 2 finale that a sufficiently strong will can override the inhibitor, when the director of Torchwood’s intense loyalty to the UK allowed her to turn on her fellow Cybermen. Presumably, Danny loves Clara at least as much as Ms. Hartman loved England. On a side note, I get a lot of fund raising spam from the Democratic party. A lot of it comes from someone named Missy Kurek. Ever since last week’s episode, every time I see an email from her, I picture Michelle Gomez acting like a lunatic. ---
**Author:** ![Nobody](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/94ad74/32.png) [@Nobody](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nobody)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2014, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/176 "2014-11-16T21:23:32Z")
> [@Penfeather](#): > > Canonically - and iconically - not true: I know, I was just making a joke. On a side note, multi-quote is on, but the second quote didn’t show when I hit reply. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2014, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/177 "2014-11-17T14:28:10Z")
[Doctor Who catches Ebola.](http://mobile.nytimes.com/2014/11/18/us/martin-salia-omaha-ebola-dead.html) 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2014, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/178 "2014-11-29T18:54:04Z")
> [@LawMonkey](#): > > I missed what the hell 3W stood for, if they ever said it; it seemed to go from that to “Don’t cremate me!”. > [@DSeid](#): > > Yeah, I think 3W = “three words” = “Don’t cremate me.” That’s not really it but rather what they lead any visitors to believe. The real explanation has got to involve where the minds are stored. Think “triple-W”. ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2014, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/179 "2014-11-29T22:21:07Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > That’s not really it but rather what they lead any visitors to believe. The real explanation has got to involve where the minds are stored. Think “triple-W”. The world wide web is made of people!?!!? ---
**Author:** ![Toucanna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3bc359/32.png) [@Toucanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toucanna)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2014, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906/180 "2014-11-30T20:57:31Z")
I’m still not sure what to make of “the three words” plot point. Is it a call-back to the Great Intelligence’s evil plan in _The Bells of Saint John_? The Mistress ripped off the GI? Dunno… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-dark-water-and-death-in-heaven-spoilers-after-it-airs/702906.md?page=10)