# Doctor Who Series 10 ongoing discussion (open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 16, 2017, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543 "2017-04-16T03:38:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![Penfeather](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penfeather/32/384_2.png) [@Penfeather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penfeather)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2017, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/261 "2017-06-25T20:17:02Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > The real crime was revealing both Simm and the Mondasian Cybermen in the “next time” promo last week. Why is the BBC spoilering their own show? It ruined the cackling Russian guy as soon as you twigged that it was John Simm. I did like Missy making her heroic entrance, but having her call Bill and Nardole Exposition and Comic Relief is leaning a little too heavily on the Fourth Wall: it’s not a tragic downfall if Macbeth cracks jokes about the flimsy scenery. I’m going to miss Capaldi and Mackie as a team, though: the scene where they were hanging out shooting the shit about the Doctor’s upbringing made you believe these people were real friends. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2017, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/262 "2017-06-25T21:07:29Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > The real crime was revealing both Simm and the Mondasian Cybermen in the “next time” promo last week. Why is the BBC spoilering their own show? Because it works, more people are interested in watching than turned of by spoilers. ---
**Author:** ![Penfeather](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penfeather/32/384_2.png) [@Penfeather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penfeather)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2017, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/263 "2017-06-25T21:28:51Z")
Other pluses: I really liked the idea of the ship where time passed differently at opposite ends, where the rear had developed its own post-war Britain themed 1950s underclass. The retro feel of the medical technology made the conversion of the Cybermen genuinely scary: the post-op ward with the hooded guy endlessly tapping out PAIN was authentic horror. Unfortunately, the psychological horror looks like it might turn to shit getting blowed up good next week, with phalanxes of shiny Cybermen hurtling about. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 9:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/264 "2017-06-26T09:15:42Z")
> [@Penfeather](#): > > It ruined the cackling Russian guy as soon as you twigged that it was John Simm. I did like Missy making her heroic entrance, but having her call Bill and Nardole Exposition and Comic Relief is leaning a little too heavily on the Fourth Wall: it’s not a tragic downfall if Macbeth cracks jokes about the flimsy scenery. Also, the “Doctor Who” thing makes very little sense, and was pretty much milked for what little it could yield under Matt Smith. Please, _Doctor Who_ writers - please stop doing this. It’s not big and it’s not clever. ---
**Author:** ![MrAtoz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@MrAtoz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrAtoz)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/265 "2017-06-26T13:55:16Z")
Between the cameo appearance of Alpha Centauri last episode, and all of the old-school fan service in this one, it seems like Moffat has decided to do a deep-dive into original series continuity as he leaves the show. I’m not sure how I feel about that. Let’s see if I’ve got all of the classic series shout outs. The biggest one is the mention of Mondas, the original home of the Cybermen, and the fact that the appearance of the Cyberman that Bill turns into is identical to their very first appearance back in “The Tenth Planet” in 1966, complete with the hands that are still human. But then there are smaller things as well. There’s Pertwee’s “Venusian Aikido.” There’s the Master wearing a ridiculous disguise until right before the cliffhanger. There’s the words “Genesis of the Cybermen,” which is probably what this episode would have been called if it had been made forty years ago. Even all that nattering on about “Doctor Who” is a reminder that, for most of the original series’ history, the character was identified that way in the closing credits. Much as fans like to complain when people call the character “Doctor Who,” the fact is that the show itself used to do so regularly. I’m not sure that this level of continuity is really a good thing. Much of it comes across as nothing more than (ostensibly) clever shout-outs. I can’t help but remember that one of the things that brought down the original series, under John-Nathan Turner, was that it seemed to become obsessed with its own history, to the point that it became alienating to new viewers who wouldn’t get all the continuity references. I don’t think that’s the path we want to be going down. That said, I did rather like the origin (or “genesis”) of the Cybermen as presented here. They’ve always been about body horror, on one level or another, and this episode does that remarkably well. The image of the nascent Cybermen endlessly tapping out “Pain” and “Kill me” on their voice synthesizers was genuinely chilling. The constant awareness that Bill had some kind of cybernetic unit in her chest that she was afraid to look at worked well for me, too. It’s sometimes too easy to see the Cybermen as just a bunch of robots. I like the way this episode reminds us that they are actually extremely mutilated human beings. And it does so not by showing us people quickly made into Cybermen by some outlandish sci-fi machine, but by a process of multiple agonizing surgeries that take months before they’re finished. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/266 "2017-06-26T14:10:27Z")
> [@Penfeather](#): > > Other pluses: I really liked the idea of the ship where time passed differently at opposite ends, where the rear had developed its own post-war Britain themed 1950s underclass. The retro feel of the medical technology made the conversion of the Cybermen genuinely scary: the post-op ward with the hooded guy endlessly tapping out PAIN was authentic horror. Unfortunately, the psychological horror looks like it might turn to shit getting blowed up good next week, with phalanxes of shiny Cybermen hurtling about. When they “fixed” him by turning down his volume was one of the scariest things in Dr Who. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/267 "2017-06-26T14:29:47Z")
Why wasn’t this two-parter called “Genesis of the Cybermen”? ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/268 "2017-06-26T16:20:47Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > “Cool”, as long as you are willing to accept complete and utter jibberish pretending to be science. Why yes, for some unknown reason, I can accept fiction as fiction. > [@DigitalC](#): > > When they “fixed” him by turning down his volume was one of the scariest things in Dr Who. That reveal was pretty, “Oh shit”. Especially how nonchalant and a bit annoyed the nurse was about the “noise”. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/269 "2017-06-26T17:00:43Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > Why wasn’t this two-parter called “Genesis of the Cybermen”? To keep it a surprise? I didn’t see the “next time on” so I had no idea it was going to be a Cybermen. Although it did get ruined by the mid-episode teaser. Speaking of which, anyone else really hate those? I don’t get the point. I’m already watching the episode. I don’t need teaser of what’s going to happen in five minutes. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/270 "2017-06-26T18:22:21Z")
I recall hearing that Steven M. was a big Doctor Who fan in the 90’s. Very active in the early fan forums. This season is his chance to geek out and honor the original series. I’ve enjoyed it. I don’t always get the obscure references until after reading comments here. ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/271 "2017-06-26T19:08:14Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > “Cool”, as long as you are willing to accept complete and utter jibberish pretending to be science. I watch Doctor Who, so…yes. Yes, I am. ---
**Author:** ![Penfeather](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penfeather/32/384_2.png) [@Penfeather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penfeather)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2017, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/272 "2017-06-26T20:19:33Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > When they “fixed” him by turning down his volume was one of the scariest things in Dr Who. Such a tiny thing, and it was the most frightening part of the episode. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/273 "2017-06-27T04:08:36Z")
I never see any “Next time” trailers, every episode this season has gone directly into Orphan Black, they don’t even run the end credits! This one didn’t even say anything about it being a two-parter. Isn’t it the same for anyone watching BBC America? (They do have these idiotic mid-episode spoilers during the commercial breaks, which piss me off so much, as they always give away upcoming scenes as I am _already watching the damn episode_!) This was the best episode of the season by far!! Finally I’m interested in the story again! ---
**Author:** ![Infovore](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/infovore/32/420_2.png) [@Infovore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Infovore)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/274 "2017-06-27T05:13:13Z")
> [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](#): > > I never see any “Next time” trailers, every episode this season has gone directly into Orphan Black, they don’t even run the end credits! This one didn’t even say anything about it being a two-parter. Isn’t it the same for anyone watching BBC America? I think they run them sometime during the next show (Class or Orphan Black). I usually just look them up online right after I finish the episode. ---
**Author:** ![TYphoonSignal8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e99b99/32.png) [@TYphoonSignal8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TYphoonSignal8)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/275 "2017-06-27T06:36:14Z")
> [@Penfeather](#): > > Such a tiny thing, and it was the most frightening part of the episode. That really friggin’ creeped me out. ---
**Author:** ![Paintcharge](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/paintcharge/32/7946_2.png) [@Paintcharge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paintcharge)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/276 "2017-06-27T14:55:39Z")
Simm really seemed to be channeling Bob Maloogaloogalooga from [Big Man on Campus.](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0096925/) ---
**Author:** ![TwoCarrotSnowman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/twocarrotsnowman/32/15879_2.png) [@TwoCarrotSnowman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwoCarrotSnowman)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/277 "2017-06-27T18:52:04Z")
Hi. My name is TwoCarrotSnowman, and I didn’t realise it was John Simm playing the Rasputin-like character until the big reveal. /Hangs head in shame. Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Infovore](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/infovore/32/420_2.png) [@Infovore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Infovore)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/278 "2017-06-27T19:44:28Z")
> [@TwoCarrotSnowman](#): > > Hi. My name is TwoCarrotSnowman, and I didn’t realise it was John Simm playing the Rasputin-like character until the big reveal. > > /Hangs head in shame. Don’t feel too bad - I didn’t either. And I knew he was going to be in the episode. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/279 "2017-06-27T19:49:22Z")
> [@TwoCarrotSnowman](#): > > Hi. My name is TwoCarrotSnowman, and I didn’t realise it was John Simm playing the Rasputin-like character until the big reveal. > > /Hangs head in shame. I didn’t either. A good make up job. I’m a bit behind with Who news this year, and this may be a bit spoilery, so Are we just a few days away from a regeneration with no idea who the new Doctor is? ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543/280 "2017-06-27T19:57:43Z")
> [@Baron\_Greenback](#): > > Are we just a few days away from a regeneration with no idea who the new Doctor is? That is what I asked up thread and it seems like: They will hold off on the regeneration until the Christmas episode. Or not, and it will be awesomely shocking. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-who-series-10-ongoing-discussion-open-spoilers/784543.md?page=15)