# Does a Philly Cheesesteak need Cheez-Whiz? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 29, 2010, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525 "2010-09-29T21:44:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/81 "2010-10-05T20:42:45Z")
> [@Darth\_Nader](#): > > Jeez. If it had a name like “Bill Penn’s Philly Special Sauce” I bet folks wouldn’t be so against it. Would _Bill Penn’s Philly Special Sauce_ still substantially resemble silicone caulking with a little food colouring in it? If so, I’m pretty sure I’d be agin’ it. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/82 "2010-10-05T22:37:29Z")
> [@Larry\_Mudd](#): > > > [@Darth\_Nader](#): > > > > Jeez. If it had a name like “Bill Penn’s Philly Special Sauce” I bet folks wouldn’t be so against it. > > Would _Bill Penn’s Philly Special Sauce_ still substantially resemble silicone caulking with a little food colouring in it? If so, I’m pretty sure I’d be agin’ it. Cheez-whiz doesn’t even make good caulking. :DOTOH, Velveeta makes excellent fish bait and stays “good” even on a multi-day hike. I rate Velveeta a solid 9 out of 10 for “survival” purposes then. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/83 "2010-10-05T22:51:53Z")
I prefer the wiz, but it can be easily overdone, that’s for sure, and when that happens it is absolutely horible. Provolone is very good and it is much harder to put too much on. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/84 "2010-10-05T23:37:27Z")
I have had Phillyp Cheesesteaks in Philadelphia, and they are simply nothing special…and cheesewhiz is vile (tastes like spoliled milk). The best Philly Cheesesteak I had was in Delaware. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/85 "2010-10-06T12:03:49Z")
I think the last real cheesesteak I had was about 10-15 years ago at Mr. Spots cheesesteaks. They don’t use cheezewhiz, just american or provolone slices. It was a pretty good cheesesteak, good size, good bun, gooey with cheese and overfilled for the college crowd. Didn’t blow my mind or anything… I guess we here in the western OH tradition have been the most successful ones to give Philly a run for their cheesesteak money, with Great Steak and Potato Company being founded in Dayton in '82. Mr. Spots came not long after and is a BG institution. My guess is that’s the case for most “foreign” cheesesteaks outside of philly, their individual styles were probably built around a college town. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/86 "2010-10-06T12:22:48Z")
[quote=“ryobserver, post:72, topic:555525”] > [@Chronos](#): > > I have a weird compulsion to try “Philadelphia” cheesesteaks when traveling, just to see what the out of towners get wrong (besides the roll, which is a given; the proper long Italian roll seems hard to get outside of Philadelphia). Apparently the local Cheesesteak place uses Philly’s [Amoroso’s Rolls](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amoroso%27s_Baking_Company). Are those up to snuff? ---
**Author:** ![rockle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/73ab20/32.png) [@rockle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rockle)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/87 "2010-10-06T12:38:25Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > Apparently the local Cheesesteak place uses Philly’s [Amoroso’s Rolls](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amoroso%27s_Baking_Company). Are those up to snuff? Oh God, YES. They’re the ones I like best. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/88 "2010-10-06T14:08:12Z")
I like a steak sandwich with Swiss. Heck, I’d eat one with Asiago if the meat is good. ---
**Author:** ![Neptunian\_Slug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ce7236/32.png) [@Neptunian\_Slug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neptunian_Slug)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/89 "2010-10-06T14:46:05Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > I think the last real cheesesteak I had was about 10-15 years ago at Mr. Spots cheesesteaks. They don’t use cheezewhiz, just american or provolone slices. It was a pretty good cheesesteak, good size, good bun, gooey with cheese and overfilled for the college crowd. Didn’t blow my mind or anything… I guess we here in the western OH tradition have been the most successful ones to give Philly a run for their cheesesteak money, with Great Steak and Potato Company being founded in Dayton in '82. Mr. Spots came not long after and is a BG institution. My guess is that’s the case for most “foreign” cheesesteaks outside of philly, their individual styles were probably built around a college town. From my time in Dayton, I thought the western Ohio food tradition was thin pizzas with no crust. Not sure that I would consider mall food court cheesesteaks to be along the same lines as some of the better places in Philly though. That said, 80% of places here make a pretty so-so cheesesteak. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/90 "2010-10-06T14:51:34Z")
> [@Neptunian\_Slug](#): > > From my time in Dayton, I thought the western Ohio food tradition was thin pizzas with no crust. Well, that’s part of it. But you thought that’s the only food they have in Dayton? ---
**Author:** ![Loisseau](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/2bfe46/32.png) [@Loisseau](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loisseau)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/91 "2010-10-06T14:54:58Z")
In Massachusetts, more than a few Philly students at the local colleges have declared Carl’s in Waltham to have a better cheesesteak sub than Pat’s, Geno’s or Jim’s. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/92 "2010-10-06T15:51:43Z")
IME the true Philly cheese steak has provolone. The cheese-wiz sandwich is the Camden Cheesesteak, and you can tell Pat I said so. . . Wait, is Pat a big guy? Does he know how to throw a punch, because maybe you could just keep it on the DL, you know . . . ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/93 "2010-10-06T18:59:24Z")
Quoth **Dr Deth** : > [@](#): > > Which is just about a patty melt, ain’t it? Except a patty melt used different bread and often hamburger- which is of course a type of Grilled chopped beef. Again, minor variations. > > Here in CA, they often use a Bolito (sp?) roll, which is soft, white and with a little crustyness. Lettuce, Tomato, Pizza sauce, etc are all only options, often with different names. According to the reviews, the local Philly Steak places are often very close to Phila places, and quite good. > Calvin’s World Famous South Philly Cheesesteaks are/were tasty as are other local places. > > And I have had steak sandwiches at places like Original Joes that were nothing but a nice slice of steak on a roll with grilled onions. The difference being the thinly sliced or chopped beef on the Philly and the addition of cheese. > > So, since even the “Original” has local variations, there’s no “originator” of something which has been around for hundreds of years. I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make. Those things all have some similarity to the Philadelphia cheesesteak, but they’re not “variations on the original”; they’re different dishes. There are indeed many different kinds of meat sandwich, one of which (which is found almost exclusively in the Delaware Valley) is the the Philadelphia cheesesteak. **devilsknew** , Amoroso’s is the standard cheesesteak roll, and should be used if available (almost everyone in Philadelphia uses them). I only referred to “a firm, crusty hoagie roll” in generic terms because Amoroso’s isn’t available most places. I’d be wondering about freshness, though, getting them in California. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/94 "2010-10-06T20:50:09Z")
> [@Neptunian\_Slug](#): > > > [@devilsknew](#): > > > > I think the last real cheesesteak I had was about 10-15 years ago at Mr. Spots cheesesteaks. They don’t use cheezewhiz, just american or provolone slices. It was a pretty good cheesesteak, good size, good bun, gooey with cheese and overfilled for the college crowd. Didn’t blow my mind or anything… I guess we here in the western OH tradition have been the most successful ones to give Philly a run for their cheesesteak money, with Great Steak and Potato Company being founded in Dayton in '82. Mr. Spots came not long after and is a BG institution. My guess is that’s the case for most “foreign” cheesesteaks outside of philly, their individual styles were probably built around a college town. > > From my time in Dayton, I thought the western Ohio food tradition was thin pizzas with no crust. > > Not sure that I would consider mall food court cheesesteaks to be along the same lines as some of the better places in Philly though. That said, 80% of places here make a pretty so-so cheesesteak. Never heard of thin pizzas with no crust? Some places make thin crust pizzas, if that’s what you mean? One thing about The Great Steak and Potato Company before it was conglomerated and corporately homogenized is that it was a pretty damn good and fairly small franchise without the foodcourt reputation back in the 80’s. …When they only had a few stores they were really good and much different than the current model. Probably very similar story to the original Pete’s Submarines in Bridgeport Connecticut and the nine headed monster it has now become- Subway. That said, I said we have been most successful with the cheesesteak in franchising and building on it… not necessarily the best or most traditional. ---
**Author:** ![ryobserver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b2d939/32.png) [@ryobserver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ryobserver)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/95 "2010-10-06T23:21:02Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > Apparently the local Cheesesteak place uses Philly’s [Amoroso’s Rolls](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amoroso%27s_Baking_Company). Are those up to snuff? Oh yes. Amoroso’s is the gold standard cheesesteak roll. **foolsguinea** , if the meat is good enough, who needs cheese? Nothing wrong with a plain steak sandwich; it’s leaner and better for you than a hamburger of equivalent meat mass (at least 6 up to 8-9 ounces of meat, depending on the steak shop). ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2010, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/96 "2010-10-07T01:54:15Z")
However, I do verily and truly repent and ask for forgiveness for this venal sin - Behold, [The Philly Mac and Cheesesteak](http://www.thegreatsteak.com/promotions/index.html)- A Great Steak Cheesesteak topped with Macaroni and Cheese. I guess this was only to be expected with the last couple of years of the trending Mac and Cheese Comfort Food Fad… Deepfried Mac and Cheese, and now this. Anybody ever had one of these, I’m curious if it’s any good? ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2010, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/97 "2010-10-07T02:32:32Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > **devilsknew** , Amoroso’s is the standard cheesesteak roll, and should be used if available (almost everyone in Philadelphia uses them). I only referred to “a firm, crusty hoagie roll” in generic terms because Amoroso’s isn’t available most places. I’d be wondering about freshness, though, getting them in California. I perused their website a little and Amoroso’s distribution area includes 36 states and depending on where you are at, they are available either fresh or frozen. Now I don’t know how that works, if they come partially baked, or fully baked and frozen, or what? But I have worked with some refrigerated and frozen commercial Italian bread that had a hearty crust and when thawed/ baked/finished in the oven they were just as good as fresh bread. ---
**Author:** ![Neptunian\_Slug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ce7236/32.png) [@Neptunian\_Slug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neptunian_Slug)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2010, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/98 "2010-10-07T03:33:18Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > Never heard of thin pizzas with no crust? Some places make thin crust pizzas, if that’s what you mean? Since I moved from Dayton, I have not seen anyone that has served the flat pie with no crust the way Cassanos or Marion’s cooks it. Other than that I would say that there is nothing that I would consider “traditional” Dayton food even in the loosest sense of the word. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2010, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/99 "2010-10-07T03:52:12Z")
Yea, I hate to say it, as a proud Ohioan, I can think of nothing really distinguishable that sets Dayton apart in the food category. Although you could tell me about this curious crustless pizza, if you wanted to. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2010, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525/100 "2010-10-07T05:31:55Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make. Those things all have some similarity to the Philadelphia cheesesteak, but they’re not “variations on the original”; they’re different dishes. There are indeed many different kinds of meat sandwich, one of which (which is found almost exclusively in the Delaware Valley) is the the Philadelphia cheesesteak. > > **devilsknew** , Amoroso’s is the standard cheesesteak roll, and should be used if available (almost everyone in Philadelphia uses them). Well, you see- exactly what ingrediant makes a Philly cheesesteak a Philly Cheesesteak? Not the cheese, clearly (that’s the debate here). The beef also varies. The roll varies (well out here in CA we don’t have the Amoroso), and it ain’t the onions. And certainly CA and even San Jose has great Philly Cheesesteak places, where even Philadephians have said the sandwiches are as good as the originals. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-a-philly-cheesesteak-need-cheez-whiz/555525.md?page=6)