# Does America have the world's oldest constitution/government? If so, why? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 6, 2005, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-america-have-the-worlds-oldest-constitution-government-if-so-why/334396 "2005-12-06T19:34:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2005, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-america-have-the-worlds-oldest-constitution-government-if-so-why/334396/41 "2005-12-08T03:39:28Z")
> [@Usram](#): > > 😃 > > So that’s why so many Americans come to see Stonehenge _Eald enta geweorc_. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2005, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-america-have-the-worlds-oldest-constitution-government-if-so-why/334396/42 "2005-12-08T11:27:56Z")
> [@Usram](#): > > 😃 > > So that’s why so many Americans come to see Stonehenge Megalith shmegalith. You want to see big stone circles, you go to Avebury. 🙂 Polycarp: “Ancient giants did it”? /blatant guess ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2005, 11:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-america-have-the-worlds-oldest-constitution-government-if-so-why/334396/43 "2005-12-08T11:35:41Z")
> [@Bookkeeper](#): > > I think one of the problems with defining this question is that the US seems to have a much stronger attachment to the **idea** of their constitution than other countries. I think that, in a way, many Americans believe that their Constitution _is_ their country. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2005, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-america-have-the-worlds-oldest-constitution-government-if-so-why/334396/44 "2005-12-08T12:32:16Z")
I’m biased, but I’ll go for Great Britain. Yes, our government has evolved - but so has America’s. And both have evolved more or less **peacefully**. How many constitutional amendments has America had? We had our last major Civil War in the 1600s whereas America had hers in the late 1800s. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2005, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-america-have-the-worlds-oldest-constitution-government-if-so-why/334396/45 "2005-12-08T15:43:40Z")
> [@John Corrado](#): > > On the complete luck part: There were plenty of periods in American history where incompetence on certain people’s parts, or competence on others’, would have doomed the government. Had Abraham Lincoln not been a brilliant politician _and_ completely unskilled in war; or had Jefferson Davis not been a poor administrator _and_ very versed in Napoleonic techniques, then the Civil War could easily have ended up with a seperation of the CSA. How is being “completely unskilled in war” an asset? The only possible answer I can think of is that someone more skilled at war would have decided to screw it and let the CSA go – but that would only make sense if subduing the CSA was in fact impossible, which clearly turned out not to be the case. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2005, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-america-have-the-worlds-oldest-constitution-government-if-so-why/334396/46 "2005-12-08T17:27:01Z")
> [@Steve MB](#): > > How is being “completely unskilled in war” an asset? The only possible answer I can think of is that someone more skilled at war would have decided to screw it and let the CSA go – but that would only make sense if subduing the CSA was in fact impossible, which clearly turned out not to be the case. Jefferson Davis, the Confederate president, was skilled at war. He was a graduate of West Point, a lieutenant in the US army, a colonel in the Mississippi militia during the Mexican war (and a hero at the battles of Fort Teneria and Buena Vista), and was Secretary of War under President Pierce. However, this knowledge of war served him badly during his time as President of the CSA, because, since he was so military, he always second guessed his generals, argued with them, and kept them on a short leash. Lincoln, who had almost no military experience, or knowledge, tended not to micromanage the army as much, trusting in his generals to do the right thing. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2005, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-america-have-the-worlds-oldest-constitution-government-if-so-why/334396/47 "2005-12-08T17:36:16Z")
Hmmm… my previous post may seem like a bit of a contradiction, given the reference to the American Civil War. I should, of course, have bolded the _more or less_. But my point was that generally, both Americans and Britons have found their own solutions to their own problems, and apart from the odd instance, done it peacefully - after their foundations, of course as the pretty violent English Civil War established the supremacy of Parliament over the Crown and the pretty violent American War of Independence established American independence from Britain. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2005, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-america-have-the-worlds-oldest-constitution-government-if-so-why/334396/48 "2005-12-08T17:45:44Z")
Well, he left McClellan in, which was a bad thing, which dragged the war out, which meant that when it ended, the South was _really_ beat, and not likely to rise again. … That’s all I got. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2005, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-america-have-the-worlds-oldest-constitution-government-if-so-why/334396/49 "2005-12-08T20:50:08Z")
Putting McClellan in was considered a good idea all around the North the first time, and Little Mac _was_ a great organizer during the war. The Second time, Lincoln out him in simply because there was no one else. Despite his general uselessness, the soldiers opted for McClellan over his even-more incompetent replacements. > [@](#): > > by **Brainglutton** > Are you sure just-off-the-boat immigrants were conscripted into the U.S. Army? Or were they merely recruited? They weren’t conscripted off the boat, though in a few cases they were kidnapped by the kind of shady draft-dodge operators who caused so much trouble for both sides. IIRC, the draft didn’t affect non-citizens in the North. It did in the South, which got to be a huge problem. People often fled the South rather than be drafted. Plus, many were expert German artisans, who were critical to the South’s war production of swords and guns. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-america-have-the-worlds-oldest-constitution-government-if-so-why/334396.md?page=2)