# Does animals have gay sex in the wild? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 12, 2001, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037 "2001-10-12T14:02:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2001, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/21 "2001-10-13T18:18:52Z")
Can we get some cites, rather than just “I read something once?” Smaft and DDG give us some leads, but I find Jimbrowki’s questions salient (if a bit wordy). Periodic activity does not establish an orientation. Here is some of the info from Bagemihl. Note the archive to the left. [http://www.qtonline.com/columns/birdsandbees/](http://www.qtonline.com/columns/birdsandbees/) ---
**Author:** ![hidon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/d78d45/32.png) [@hidon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hidon)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2001, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/22 "2001-10-13T21:13:26Z")
Well, all I know is, I once saw two male giraffes in the zoo, umm…, stimulating each other, and that’s the only experience I have on this subject, thankfully. ---
**Author:** ![Enola\_Straight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dec6dc/32.png) [@Enola\_Straight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enola_Straight)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2001, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/23 "2001-10-14T14:14:17Z")
The question IS… Does any Male animal allow himself to be… um… ah… penetrated? ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2001, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/24 "2001-10-14T18:07:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by hidon \* > \*\*Well, all I know is, I once saw two male giraffes in the zoo, umm…, stimulating each other, and that’s the only experience I have on this subject, thankfully. \*\* Necking, no doubt. Ah, I crack myself up. ---
**Author:** ![smaft](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c2a13f/32.png) [@smaft](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smaft)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2001, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/25 "2001-10-15T00:44:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Enola Straight \* > The question IS… > > Does any Male animal allow himself to be… > um… > ah… > > penetrated? Yes. Unfortunately I don’t remember where I read it, but a pair of male giraffes were observed doing the deed, including what appeared to be ejaculation by the mounting male (there was considerable debate about whether it really was). There were pictures, but… ---
**Author:** ![smaft](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c2a13f/32.png) [@smaft](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smaft)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2001, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/26 "2001-10-15T01:02:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by manhattan \* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by hidon \* > > Well, all I know is, I once saw two male giraffes in the zoo, umm…, stimulating each other, and that’s the only experience I have on this subject, thankfully. > > Necking, no doubt. > > Ah, I crack myself up. Actually, necking (rubbing their necks on each other’s neck and body) is something male giraffes do with each other, and usually leads to sexual arousal. Females apparently don’t do it; neither do heterosexual pairs. So that cartoon image of giraffes wrapping their necks around each other in love- those are all males! FTR, I am, for a change, posting from home at the moment, so I’ve got my copy of Bagemihl’s book. More coming… ---
**Author:** ![smaft](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c2a13f/32.png) [@smaft](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smaft)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2001, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/27 "2001-10-15T01:54:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jimbrowski \* > Show me, then, the male animal (remember: non-human animal) that completely, unfailingly _does not_ under any circumstances engage in sexual relations with females of it’s species it’s entire life but _does_ with other males. Likewise any female animal: show me the one that is born, sexually matures, grows to old age, and dies while \* unfailingly \* rejecting all advances of males in her species and instead “getting off” exclusively with other females. Greylag Geese males will form lifelong pairs. Sometimes one will mate with a female and the males will raise the goslings together, but often neither male mates. There are Canada Geese male pairs who have never been observed mating with females, even though they have plenty of opportunity to do so. Snow Geese female pairs will mate with a male and lay eggs, but will not maintain any relationship with him (not standard goose behavior). Black Swan male pairs don’t have young by mating with females; rather, they often adopt heterosexual pairs’ nests and eggs by chasing the parents away. Otherwise, both male and female pairs ignore the opposite sex completely. Male lions form companionship groups (2 or 3 individuals) that sometimes join existing prides of females. About half the members such groups never join females at all. Young male African elephants bond and mate with older males in lifelong pairs. Such pairs keep themselves isolated from other elephants; they never mate with females. Many male zebras join “bachelor herds” as young adults and will have sexual relations with those other males. Some join full-fledged herds after a couple years; but about half spend the rest of their lives in the bachelor herd. Killer whales are often bisexual; however, there are clear behavioral distinctions between individuals engaging in same sex activiy and individuals actively seeking it. Male ostriches who court other males are generally solitary birds and rarely, if ever, court females, even though females are present. Female Barn Owls often remain together for life, ignoring all males and laying infertile eggs side-by-side. Many animals have same-sex sex when young, becoming bisexual in later years (Mountain Sheep, American Bison, Dolphin, Crow, etc.). While many animals form pair bonds with and mate with members of the same sex, it is not uncommon for them to mate with the opposite sex; however, they often raise their offspring with their same-sex mate as surrogate parent instead of the biological parent. This is true even in species with strong parent-child bonds. I’m tired of typing. I think that’s enough for now… ---
**Author:** ![Emperor\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c2a13f/32.png) [@Emperor\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emperor_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2001, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/28 "2001-10-15T02:02:46Z")
Well, here’s a link to a story about two gay vultures who have successfully raised two young. [http://www10.cnn.com/NATURE/9909/18/gay.vulture.parents/](http://www10.cnn.com/NATURE/9909/18/gay.vulture.parents/) Pretty cool, actually… ---
**Author:** ![Jimbrowski](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9a140/32.png) [@Jimbrowski](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimbrowski)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2001, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/29 "2001-10-15T14:37:53Z")
Touché, **smaft** , never know what I’ll learn around here. Yes, the OP asked about “gay sex” and not “gay animals”. Well then, yes, indeed, animals do engage in sex acts us humans consider “gay”. In humans, "human having gay sex” often equals “gay human” (not always, but often). So… in the OP, I confused “…does gay sex happen in the wild…” with “…are there gay animals in the wild having sex?” Clearly my mistake. The question I attempted to address was “Are animals that engage in ‘gay’ sex acts doing so because they are gay?” (Guess I should just answer the question and not make up my own, huh?) Clearly, whether or not animals are gay is a Great Debate. **smaft** , you give some very good examples, although for the types of behavior you describe there are several plausible explanations, none of which is “because they’re gay”. But like I said, that’s clearly a story for another day. Of course if some joker came along to debate these were actually \*\*bi-\*\*sexual animals… ---
**Author:** ![jab1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ee7513/32.png) [@jab1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jab1)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2001, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/30 "2001-10-15T18:48:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Duck Duck Goose \* > **Bonobo chimps… don’t have anal penetration or fellatio, they just rub their scrotums together, butt to butt, or have “penis dueling”, where they evidently hang by trees face to face and bang their erect penises together. So, is that “gay sex” or not? It actually sounds more like “kid sex”, “playing doctor”, to me.** It sounds like pro wrestling to me. Is “penis duelling” anything like cockfighting? ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_The\_Bold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/41988e/32.png) [@Dale\_The\_Bold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_The_Bold)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2001, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/31 "2001-10-15T22:54:26Z")
What I think should be considered is whether or not there is an individual among any non-humn species that chooses exclusively same-sex partners. Anything else would be bisexual, but is there such a thing as an exclusively gay monkey for example. ---
**Author:** ![edwino](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@edwino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/edwino)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/32 "2001-10-16T04:07:26Z")
I witnessed two male Cape Buffalo going at it last May in South Africa. I don’t know if it was a one time thing, but the guy in the back was definitely on top and doing a pelvic thrust. Alas, it was too dark to take a picture for my Big Picture Book of Animal Behavior (namely elephants makin dookie and zebras with erect penises). ---
**Author:** ![jharding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e480ec/32.png) [@jharding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jharding)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/33 "2001-10-16T11:40:42Z")
In an effort to add some more information that can be found in **hard** copy (hehehe… now _I_ crack _me_ up). The following books on assorted animal behavior all address the issue at **hand**. (Tee hee hee.) When Elephants Weep: The Emotional Lives of Animals by Jeffrey Moussaieff Masson and Susan McCarthy. New York: Delta Books. 1995. Divorce Among the Gulls (An Uncommon Look at Human Nature) by William Jordan. New York: North Point Press. 1991. The Emperor’s Embrace: Reflections on Animal Families and Fatherhood by Jeffrey Moussaieff Masson. New York: Pocket Books. 1999. Granted, while these are all trade books and not written for a scientifically-minded audience, they each offer examples that might answer the OP’s question. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/34 "2001-10-16T18:59:04Z")
From the QT link by smaft: > [@](#): > > Intersexual or hermaphrodite Grizzly Bears occur in some populations. These individuals are genetically female and have female internal reproductive organs, combined with various degrees of external male genitalia. In some cases, they have a penislike organ (complete with a penis bone or BACULUM) that is not connected to the internal reproductive organs, while in others the penis is more fully developed, serving as both a genital orifice connected to the womb as well as a urinary organ. Most transgendered Bears are mothers, mating with males and bearing offspring. Some individuals actually copulate and give birth through their “penis”: their male partner inserts his organ into the tip of the intersexual Bear’s phallus, and the resulting offspring emerge through the penis as well. OUCH! :eek: And you ladies thought regular childbirth was bad. ---
**Author:** ![Sofa\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/58956e/32.png) [@Sofa\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sofa_King)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037/35 "2001-10-16T21:02:04Z")
[Does this count](http://www.thehumorarchives.com/humor/0000816.html)? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-animals-have-gay-sex-in-the-wild/87037.md?page=1)