# Does Anybody Actually Find "A Handmaid's Tale" Remotely Plausible? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 27, 2017, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357 "2017-04-27T13:09:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2017, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/181 "2017-05-01T11:53:24Z")
> [@jtur88](#): > > The fact that Orwell never used the word “USSR” in the text of the novel is not proof that he did not have that in mind. Well, he actually kind of did… there’s a passing reference in Part 3, where O’Brien is torturing/lecturing Smith: > [@](#): > > The German Nazis and the Russian Communists came very close to us in their methods, but they never had the courage to recognize their own motives. I gather Orwell saw these totalitarian forms as just early versions of what could be. Plus there’s a brief reference in _the book_ about the evolution of the current global political divide: > [@](#): > > With the absorption of Europe by Russia and of the British Empire by the United States, two of the three existing powers, Eurasia and Oceania, were already effectively in being. … but there’s an argument that within the context of the novel, this is a fabrication. In any case, the prevailing political philosophy of the regime is _Ingsoc_, named for “English Socialism”, rather than anything suggesting a direct American or Soviet influence. I don’t know if Orwell viewed the U.S. as anything more than a plot device when writing _1984_. ---
**Author:** ![Barrett\_Bonden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5e9695/32.png) [@Barrett\_Bonden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barrett_Bonden)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2017, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/182 "2017-05-01T12:40:50Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > … but there’s an argument that within the context of the novel, this is a fabrication. In any case, the prevailing political philosophy of the regime is _Ingsoc_, named for “English Socialism”, rather than anything suggesting a direct American or Soviet influence. I don’t know if Orwell viewed the U.S. as anything more than a plot device when writing _1984_. This reminds me of an amusing C. S. Lewis observation, possibly pertaining to _Screwtape_. He said he directed his criticisms at Americans because British readers would accept the message better if they could look down their nose at someone else’s behavior rather than their own. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2017, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/183 "2017-05-01T12:47:56Z")
Has anyone posted this yet? > **[I Grew Up In A Fundamentalist Cult - 'The Handmaid's Tale' Was My Reality](https://theestablishment.co/i-grew-up-in-a-fundamentalist-cult-the-handmaids-tale-was-my-reality-fae2f77263d9/)** > > I was raised to be a helpmeet in a world like the one from Margaret Atwood’s chillingly prescient book. Thought it might be relevant. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2017, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/184 "2017-05-01T14:33:34Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > Has anyone posted this yet? > > [I Grew Up In A Fundamentalist Cult - ’The Handmaid’s Tale’ Was My Reality – The Establishment](https://theestablishment.co/i-grew-up-in-a-fundamentalist-cult-the-handmaids-tale-was-my-reality-fae2f77263d9) > > Thought it might be relevant. What is it? ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2017, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/185 "2017-05-01T14:35:06Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > Has anyone posted this yet? > > [I Grew Up In A Fundamentalist Cult - ’The Handmaid’s Tale’ Was My Reality – The Establishment](https://theestablishment.co/i-grew-up-in-a-fundamentalist-cult-the-handmaids-tale-was-my-reality-fae2f77263d9) > > Thought it might be relevant. Very relevant. BTW, presently a fundamentalist mormon leader in British Columbia is [in court over child-wife he impregnated at age 15](http://www.stcatharinesstandard.ca/2017/04/24/winston-blackmore-told-police-he-didnt-know-wife-was-15-trial-hears). He’s the same fundamentalist mormon leader who previously this year was [convicted for trafficking a 13 year old child-bride of American fundamentalist Mormon leader Warren Jeffs](http://www.torontosun.com/2017/02/03/former-bc-couple-guilty-of-taking-girl-13-to-us-to-marry-polygamist-warren-jeffs). Another current link worth reading is “[Margaret Atwood on What ‘The Handmaid’s Tale’ Means in the Age of Trump](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/10/books/review/margaret-atwood-handmaids-tale-age-of-trump.html).” Margaret Atwood, March 10, 2017, New York Times. It addresses both differing approaches to feminism and the difference between prediction and anti-prediction. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2017, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/186 "2017-05-01T14:41:29Z")
The appeal of The Handmaid’s Tale is that some people simply like to fancy that things are much worse, or will be much worse, nationwide, than they really are. They love imagining how awful something will be. They \*like \*bad. It reminds me of right-wingers who claimed Obama was a socialist Muslim who’d take everyone’s guns away. I think at some point they were \*disappointed \*that Obama didn’t turn out to be anything like that. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2017, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/187 "2017-05-01T15:12:08Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > The appeal of The Handmaid’s Tale is that some people simply like to fancy that things are much worse, or will be much worse, nationwide, than they really are. They love imagining how awful something will be. They \*like \*bad. > > It reminds me of right-wingers who claimed Obama was a socialist Muslim who’d take everyone’s guns away. I think at some point they were \*disappointed \*that Obama didn’t turn out to be anything like that. Clarification: do you mean that the appeal is primarily to people who love imaging how awful something will be, or do you mean that the work appeals to a broad audience of which a subset love imagining how awful something will be? ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2017, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/188 "2017-05-04T13:13:21Z")
> [@Arcite](#): > > I had looked at the Indiana section of that site, which lists 4 bullet points, none of which mention clergy. So I did a Ctrl-F on “clergy”. It’s under Idaho, and states “Recommends ‘talking with a member of the clergy’ before having an abortion.” They link to the booklet, in which the actual text reads “You may also benefit from talking to a trusted friend, family member, clergy, or counselor about the important decision you are facing.” I realize you consider that horrific, but how is that evidence that the United States of America has [“a form of government in which God or a deity is recognized as the supreme civil ruler, the God’s or deity’s laws being interpreted by the ecclesiastical authorities?”](http://www.dictionary.com/browse/theocracy?s=t) Yes, it was Idaho, not Indiana. My mistake, but it is still the state injecting religion into women’s reproductive rights. Let’s look at some more examples of theocracy in today’s America: In Kentucky, a judge has recused himself from all gay adoption proceedings. Seems his religion trumps our laws: > [@](#): > > A Family Court judge in Kentucky has recused himself from adoption cases involving gay and lesbian parents, saying that “as a matter of conscience” he could not be impartial. > > In a court order on Thursday, the judge, W. Mitchell Nance, wrote that he believed “under no circumstance” would the best interests of a child be served in an adoption by a “practicing homosexual.” [https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/01/us/kentucky-judge-refuses-same-sex-adoption-cases.html?\_r=0](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/01/us/kentucky-judge-refuses-same-sex-adoption-cases.html?_r=0) And in Alabama: > [@](#): > > MONTGOMERY, Ala. (AP) — Alabama on Wednesday became the latest state to protect faith-based adoption organizations that refuse to place children with gay parents or other households on religious grounds. [https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/alabama/articles/2017-05-03/ivey-signs-bill-letting-adoption-groups-turn-away-gays](https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/alabama/articles/2017-05-03/ivey-signs-bill-letting-adoption-groups-turn-away-gays) But that can’t be signs of theocracy because theocracy is bad, but America is always good, or something. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2017, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/189 "2017-05-04T14:41:11Z")
Well, you’re first example isn’t theocracy because the judge recused himself. It might be close to\* theocracy if the judge didn’t recuse himself, and ruled based on his religion. The 2nd example isn’t theocracy because it’s protecting the religious freedom of a private organization. The 1st amendment cuts both ways. No establishment, and free exercise. \*one judge in one state does not a theocracy make. ---
**Author:** ![DZedNConfused](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dzednconfused/32/15991_2.png) [@DZedNConfused](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DZedNConfused)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2017, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/190 "2017-05-04T15:13:51Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Well, you’re first example isn’t theocracy because the judge recused himself. It might be close to\* theocracy if the judge didn’t recuse himself, and ruled based on his religion. The 2nd example isn’t theocracy because it’s protecting the religious freedom of a private organization. The 1st amendment cuts both ways. No establishment, and free exercise. > > \*one judge in one state does not a theocracy make. Those were my thoughts too. It’s NOT a theocracy when the judge states that his own bias would hinder ability to do his job fairly so he isn’t going to rule on those cases. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2017, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/191 "2017-05-04T15:45:40Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > Yes, it was Idaho, not Indiana. My mistake, but it is still the state injecting religion into women’s reproductive rights. > > Let’s look at some more examples of theocracy in today’s America: > In Kentucky, a judge has recused himself from all gay adoption proceedings. Seems his religion trumps our laws: > [https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/01/us/kentucky-judge-refuses-same-sex-adoption-cases.html?\_r=0](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/01/us/kentucky-judge-refuses-same-sex-adoption-cases.html?_r=0) > > And in Alabama: > > [https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/alabama/articles/2017-05-03/ivey-signs-bill-letting-adoption-groups-turn-away-gays](https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/alabama/articles/2017-05-03/ivey-signs-bill-letting-adoption-groups-turn-away-gays) > > But that can’t be signs of theocracy because theocracy is bad, but America is always good, or something. And Trump just signed some sort of bullshit to “allow more religious freedom”. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2017, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/192 "2017-05-04T17:04:23Z")
Definitely not plausible, and it’s also grating that the people most strenuously wringing their hands about it seem to gloss over or completely ignore that something similar really is happening to millions of women in countries like Saudi Arabia and Pakistan. I don’t normally endorse National Review op-eds, but I fully cosign [this one](http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/447118/what-fans-handmaids-tale-prefer-ignore). ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2017, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/193 "2017-05-04T19:03:35Z")
The story wouldn’t work in Saudi Arabia because the target audience doesn’t give a shit about Saudi Arabia. Those are brown people who speak weird languages. Again, the problem with “The Handmaid’s Tale” from a plausibility point of view is that everything in the show happens in less than ten years. Seventy years? Sure, now maybe. But then you cannot have one character remember being a free woman and also being a handmaid. ---
**Author:** ![Elemenopy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b5e925/32.png) [@Elemenopy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elemenopy)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 11:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/194 "2017-05-05T11:14:53Z")
> [@Karen\_Lingel](#): > > Can you recommend some books in this category? I would like to read one and see what I think. I can’t think of any books about extra-left dystopias. Does _Animal Farm_ count in this category? I just (as in, 2 days ago) finished Ira Levin’s _This Perfect Day_. Not bad, one of his better efforts. As I understand it, it had been out of print for several decades. The utopia/dystopia is rather left-wing, although in the context of 1969 when he wrote it, it’s a bit hard to lay it on a party line. Nevertheless, the protagonist (very) slowly fights against the genetically and psychologically programmed ideals (everyone looks the same, acts the same, no occupation is better than another, conflict is to be avoided at all cost, family is no more important than the community, and all ideological sins are to be confessed to your counselor, who will soup you up with a larger dose of ~antidepressants) in strong favor of rugged individualism. Which, incidentally and finally, just demonstrates your leadership potential over the proles. ---
**Author:** ![Elemenopy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b5e925/32.png) [@Elemenopy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elemenopy)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/195 "2017-05-05T11:22:00Z")
By the by…I find “Handmaid’s Tale” scarily possible. My weird old dad converted to a (not small) religious sect in Indiana who undoubtedly would read that novel as a sort of inspirational text. I also could see the possibility of the society evolving that way in a sci-fi sense, just given the parameters, and what sort of group would be most likely to respond passionately to them. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/196 "2017-05-05T11:32:52Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Definitely not plausible, and it’s also grating that the people most strenuously wringing their hands about it seem to gloss over or completely ignore that something similar really is happening to millions of women in countries like Saudi Arabia and Pakistan. > > I don’t normally endorse National Review op-eds, but I fully cosign [this one](http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/447118/what-fans-handmaids-tale-prefer-ignore). Pakistani men have intercourse with their concubines while her head rests on their wife’s lap? Man, I have been shafted out of my rights. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/197 "2017-05-05T12:03:55Z")
AK84, when comparing Pakistan to the USA and Canada exclusive of sub-continent and mid-east immigrant families, what are the rates of purdah, child marriage exclusive of vani, vani, watta satta, dowry deaths, and honour killings? ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/198 "2017-05-05T12:21:17Z")
_Animal Farm_ qualifies in the “left wing dystopia” category, as does Orwell’s other classic _1984_. Others that come to mind, although I dislike both of them: _The Giver_ by Lois Lowry, and _Anthem_ by Ayn Rand. > [@AK84](#): > > Pakistani men have intercourse with their concubines while her head rests on their wife’s lap? Man, I have been shafted out of my rights. That’s hilarious, but while no country in the world has the exact conditions described in this work of science fiction, I dare say it’s worse to be a woman in Pakistan than in Gilead. [PBS Newshour:](http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/poll-five-most-dangerous-countries-for-women/) > [@](#): > > According to Pakistan’s Human Rights Commission, 90 percent of women in Pakistan are victims of domestic violence at some point in their lives. > > In a 2009 epidemiological study published by the European Journal of Public Health, researchers found that at least 1 in 5 homicides in Pakistan are the result of so-called “honor killings,” a practice where women are murdered — often by their own relatives — to protect the family’s honor following accusations of infidelity or defiance. > > “Pakistani women are left with little, if any, protection from violence and discrimination,” Noreen Haider, chairwoman of the Madadgar Trust for Research and Development in Pakistan, told TrustLaw. > > “In addition to Pakistani laws being discriminatory, the judicial system condones and exacerbates the problem by failing to view violence against women as a serious violation of women’s human rights.” [NBC News:](http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/girls-treated-cattle-child-brides-divide-pakistan-n65956) > [@](#): > > “These girls are being treated as cattle,” Memon told NBC News. “They are dying. We cannot have little girls being married off at 15 and 16 and being forced to produce kids. It doesn’t make sense medically, and it doesn’t make sense economically.” > > According to UNICEF’s State of the World’s Children Report 2014, seven percent of Pakistani girls are married under the age of 15.[…] > > Once married, young girls can become isolated and they are often forced into early sex, according to Ann Warner, a senior gender and youth specialist at the International Center for Research on Women. > > “This leads to early pregnancy and very high risk pregnancy,” she said. “Younger girls are at a much higher risk of death and disability during pregnancy and their children are also at much higher risk of not surviving and dying as young children." > > Warner said that early marriage “has an extremely negative impact on their lives.” > > She added: “They are not physically and mentally ready. They are almost always pulled out of school so their potential for education is cut off and with that, their potential to work and contribute to their societies both economically and socially.” > > Marilyn Crawshaw, who is involved with a non-governmental organization that works with women in the Khyber Pakhtunkhwa region of Pakistan, said such marriages put girls’ health and welfare at risk. > > “If you children as some sort of bargaining chip or commodity that has a value attached to it, that is always bad for them," said Crawshaw, who is chairwoman of the UK Friends of Khwendo Kor. “The price is paid by the child.” [USA Today:](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2014/06/07/pakistan-child-marriage/10003047/) > [@](#): > > In Pakistan, poor families commonly marry off girls as young as 10, shifting the cost of supporting them to their new husbands. Before anyone clicks one of those links and says “but hey: they were working on reforming the system and outlawing child marriage”, you should know that this effort failed. Per the [Washington Post:](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/01/15/bill-banning-child-marriage-fails-in-pakistan-after-its-deemed-un-islamic/?utm_term=.3268bd223a1d) > [@](#): > > [T]he Council of Islamic Ideology, a constitutional body which gives advice to parliament on the compatibility of laws with Sharia, appeared to slap down the legislation after deeming it “un-Islamic” and “blasphemous,” according to Agence France Presse. It had already handed down a similar ruling in 2014. > > The council has garnered opprobrium in the past. In 2013, reports AFP, “it suggested making DNA inadmissible evidence in rape cases, instead calling for the revival of an Islamic law that makes it mandatory for a survivor to provide four witnesses to back their claims.”[…] > > Clerics on the council object to minimum age requirements, arguing instead that an individual can marry once reaching puberty, which can be as early as the age of 9. Honor killings were recently(!) made technically illegal, but [that hasn’t stopped them:](http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-01-11/why-honour-killings-continue-in-pakistan-despite-tough-new-laws/8172756) > [@](#): > > The practice is widespread. Male family members kill women for talking to a male stranger, for dressing immodestly, marrying according to their own will, or for defying basic Islamic teachings. > > Last year 1100 cases of honour killing were reported, but the Human Rights Commission of Pakistan (HRCP) estimates at least another 1,000 went unreported. > > Many people feel it will take a lot more than laws to put a stop to the practice. And the World Economic Forum ranked Pakistan 144th of 145 countries in their [Gender Gap Index.](http://reports.weforum.org/global-gender-gap-report-2015/economies/#economy=PAK) ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/199 "2017-05-05T12:25:20Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > AK84, when comparing Pakistan to the USA and Canada exclusive of sub-continent and mid-east immigrant families, what are the rates of purdah, child marriage exclusive of vani, vani, watta satta, dowry deaths, and honour killings? Tell me the murder rates in those countries and we will compare. The difference I suppose is that for someone like you when child abuse or partner murder happens in the US of Canada you say “what a horrible person”. When it happens elsewhere you say “what horrible people”. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357/200 "2017-05-05T12:49:12Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Tell me the murder rates in those countries and we will compare. The difference I suppose is that for someone like you when child abuse or partner murder happens in the US of Canada you say “what a horrible person”. When it happens elsewhere you say “what horrible people”. Canada: [Gender Based Violence in Canada | Learn the Facts](http://www.canadianwomen.org/facts-about-violence) rate of of women killed by intimate partners: 0.00018852% (a bit less than two per million per year, as compared to over five and a half honour killings per million per year in Pakistan.). As far as the religious/cultural practices mentioned in my post, we don’t track them because the rates are miniscule. Very rarely will one hear of an honour killing, and even then it will be in a sub-continent or mid-eastern immigrant family. There is a problem with child marriage which is being run through the courts (refer to Blackmore in Canada and Jeffs in the USA). So yes, there is a very strong difference between the murder rates of women in Canada and Pakistan that is based on culture. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-actually-find-a-handmaids-tale-remotely-plausible/785357.md?page=11)