# Does anybody understand how Mexico will pay for the wall? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 25, 2017, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144 "2017-01-25T14:59:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![DinoR](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dinor/32/2821_2.png) [@DinoR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DinoR)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/41 "2017-01-25T19:33:54Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > Patrolled by the military on the US side? I’m pretty sure that it’s not legal for the United States military to operate within the actual United States boundaries. Now if the military patrolled the Mexican side of the wall that would make more sense as that would be a proper (if highly unpopular) use of the military. Posse Commitatus applies to federal troops. National Guard troops, on state active duty, can and have performed border security missions for big chunks of the last two administrations. They don’t have law enforcement powers but having the extra eyes out to observe and report supports the civilian authorities who do. Now states don’t generally have the money to pay for long term missions like this. That’s where a “fun” loophole comes in. The federal government can provide money for operational costs to the states whose governors agree to use their National Guard in the mission. Federal funding support isn’t an issue just federal troops. It’s how the border security missions were conducted. It’s how also how things like the airport security mission, right after 9-11, was conducted until the TSA could be created. It would take the relevant border state governors agreeing and directing the deployment in this scenario. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/42 "2017-01-25T19:34:52Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > The news today is that Trump is going to sign an executive order to start building The Wall. It’s estimated that it will cost over $10 billion/mile. He is still insisting that Mexico will pay for it, but has yet to tell us how that will happen. Does anybody have a clue as to what his Super Secret Plan is to accomplish this? Probably been answered already (my apologies, I haven’t read the responses on my phone yet), but my WAG on what Trump is, um, thinking (if I can use that term very loosely) is basically extortion. He’s already gotten rid of the TPP and has talked about the same thing with NAFTA. He or his team has gone on to discussions about no multi-lateral trade deals or discussions…everything will be bi-lateral. So, considering that Mexico does about 80% of it’s exports to the US and we have a mad man who seems to think he’s some sort of international trade genius and wants to play hard ball and chicken, his ‘thinking’ seems to be that we will be able to extort large concessions from countries like Mexico (and China) to continue to trade with us. One of the concessions he’s obviously eyeing wrt Mexico is the stupid wall. Depending on how desperate Mexico is to make a new deal, assuming NAFTA goes bye-bye, he figures he can get them to pony up a few billion dollars to save over $600 billion in annual trade (plus, essentially it would put a lot of Mexicans to work and be basically a huge government works program for Mexico…or something). That’s my take, FWIW. ---
**Author:** ![Doctor\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctor_jackson/32/32_2.png) [@Doctor\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctor_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/43 "2017-01-25T19:36:06Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > Patrolled by the military on the US side? I’m pretty sure that it’s not legal for the United States military to operate within the actual United States boundaries. The easy way around that (the Posse Comitatus Act) would be to use the Army and/or Air National Guard under State control. The federal government could subsidize the cost, even if done indirectly. > [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > Now if the military patrolled the Mexican side of the wall that would make more sense as that would be a proper (if highly unpopular) use of the military. To not be considered an act of war that would require permission from the Mexican government, something I doubt would be forthcoming. ---
**Author:** ![whitetho](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whitetho/32/1059_2.png) [@whitetho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whitetho)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/44 "2017-01-25T19:37:23Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > I fail to see how taxing people living in the US actually qualifies as "making Mexico pay… Acording to [Oklahoma Again Reports an Increase in Taxes on Wired Remittances](http://cis.org/north/oklahoma-again-reports-increase-taxes-wired-remittances), Oklahoma currently has 1 percent tax on “all out-going, out-of-state, person-to-person wire transfers of money”. In this case the fee can be deducted from your state income tax, although as of this report that only happened for 4 percent of the collected money. ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/45 "2017-01-25T19:39:05Z")
My money is in an American bank. I (or an associate) can put my bank card in any ATM in Mexico and get that money out, in pesos. How hard is that? How could anyone in the US stop me? ---
**Author:** ![brujaja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4af34b/32.png) [@brujaja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brujaja)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/46 "2017-01-25T19:41:54Z")
What’s to stop people from simply “vacationing” in Mexico, and “spending” money there? (i.e., people making a career out of physically bringing cash to peoples’ relatives or agents while visiting Mexico.) What are they going to do, tax all conversions of dollars to pesos? All of this bullshit reflects a whole lot of ignorant peoples’ absurd viewpoints based on faulty reasoning. I think some people see anybody speaking Spanish AT ALL in America, and assume that those people must be illegal immigrants. Others just don’t realize that the people they resent because they are Mexican and employed here, are simply LEGAL immigrants. (thinking somehow that if a person with a Polish accent, or more experience, or better skills, beats you out for a job, that’s okay – but if they are hired over you and speak Spanish they are _ **"illegal immigrants taking my job!"** _) ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/47 "2017-01-25T19:42:12Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > I fail to see how taxing people living in the US actually qualifies as “making Mexico pay.” > > If I plan to give you $10, but instead I deduct $1 from that amount and give it to, say, Cecil, have you given Cecil $1? Not in any universe that I have lived in. Because the $ goes to Mexico, which then gets less of it. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/48 "2017-01-25T19:45:39Z")
The Republicans have long maintained that there will be no new expenditures without reducing spending elsewhere. I’m wondering if they are going to stick to that mantra, or if it was just because of Obama. If they insist on reducing spending elsewhere, I expect it will come from regulatory agencies and other programs that actually do some good. Either way, the American taxpayer is on the hook for this boondoggle. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/49 "2017-01-25T19:45:49Z")
> [@jtur88](#): > > My money is in an American bank. I (or an associate) can put my bank card in any ATM in Mexico and get that money out, in pesos. > > How hard is that? How could anyone in the US stop me? How did your money get \*into \*an American bank? Illegals generally dont have bank accounts. and giving your relatives your bank card is a big act of trust, considering the crime and corruption down there. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/50 "2017-01-25T19:46:59Z")
> [@whitetho](#): > > Acording to [Oklahoma Again Reports an Increase in Taxes on Wired Remittances](http://cis.org/north/oklahoma-again-reports-increase-taxes-wired-remittances), Oklahoma currently has 1 percent tax on “all out-going, out-of-state, person-to-person wire transfers of money”. In this case the fee can be deducted from your state income tax, although as of this report that only happened for 4 percent of the collected money. The difference is that Trump is talking about a tax on illegal aliens only. Whether true or not, if there is even a hint of cooperation between those companies that transfer funds and the Federales, those companies will be avoided like the plague out of fear that information leading to deportation will be handed over. If the “tax” is taken from _all_ monies leaving the country via this method, no matter who is sending it and where it is going, then this has absolutely nothing to do with Mexico paying at all. ---
**Author:** ![DinoR](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dinor/32/2821_2.png) [@DinoR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DinoR)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/51 "2017-01-25T19:48:31Z")
> [@Doctor\_Jackson](#): > > To not be considered an act of war that would require permission from the Mexican government, something I doubt would be forthcoming. Just prompted a thought that I didn’t respond to in Si Amgio’s post… The Mexican military is already actively conducting security operations in the Mexican border states. The have a serious cartel problem in the areas that control the major smuggling routes into the US. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/52 "2017-01-25T19:53:31Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > The difference is that Trump is talking about a tax on illegal aliens only. Whether true or not, if there is even a hint of cooperation between those companies that transfer funds and the Federales, those companies will be avoided like the plague out of fear that information leading to deportation will be handed over. If the “tax” is taken from _all_ monies leaving the country via this method, no matter who is sending it and where it is going, then this has absolutely nothing to do with Mexico paying at all. I believe Trump is considering just a levy on funds to Mexico. Or he could make it all foreign nations, since WU type wire transfers are used mostly by the unbanked or scamsters, moneylaunderers, crooks, gamblers, etc. . Remember, dudes, that illegals already willingly pay a large wire fee to transfer their cash from the USA to Mexico. A few dollars more will not change this. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/53 "2017-01-25T19:56:40Z")
Assuming this all happens, I’m going to be interested to see what happens to the price of goods and services in this country. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/54 "2017-01-25T19:58:13Z")
> [@jtur88](#): > > My money is in an American bank. I (or an associate) can put my bank card in any ATM in Mexico and get that money out, in pesos. > > How hard is that? How could anyone in the US stop me? I’m not sure that that could be stopped. However, an issue is that many of the people sending money to Mexico are “unbanked” – that is, they don’t have bank accounts. According to this study from the FDIC, one out of six Latinos in the U.S. are unbanked, and another 29% are “underbanked” (they have a bank account, but also use expensive services like prepaid cards or payday loans). [http://blog.nclr.org/2016/11/02/spotlight-hispanic-households-results-2015-fdic-survey-unbanked-underbanked-households/](http://blog.nclr.org/2016/11/02/spotlight-hispanic-households-results-2015-fdic-survey-unbanked-underbanked-households/) ---
**Author:** ![whitetho](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whitetho/32/1059_2.png) [@whitetho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whitetho)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/55 "2017-01-25T19:58:18Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > The difference is that Trump is talking about a tax on illegal aliens only. Whether true or not, if there is even a hint of cooperation between those companies that transfer funds and the Federales, those companies will be avoided like the plague out of fear that information leading to deportation will be handed over. If the “tax” is taken from _all_ monies leaving the country via this method, no matter who is sending it and where it is going, then this has absolutely nothing to do with Mexico paying at all. The idea in Oklahoma is that only legal residents are filing state income taxes to get refunds, thus effectively only illegals are actually paying the tax. ---
**Author:** ![slash2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@slash2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slash2k)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/56 "2017-01-25T19:58:34Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > It’s about $25Billion. so a 1% tax (which is already in place in some states) would bring in $250Million a year. Yes, that would pay for the wall if they took their time. A 2% levy would bring in 500MM, a 4% a cool billion. The wall should cost 15-25 B, or 20 years with a 4% levy. Current estimates on the wall are in the range of $25 billion, maybe more. (For comparison, the existing 650 miles of fence have to date cost $7 billion, and they’re not usually described as ‘beautiful,’ or even ‘impenetrable.’) At 2% levy and $25 billion, the initial construction will have been paid for in 50 years–by then, extensive sections will have needed heavy maintenance or even rebuilding, perhaps several times, all of which adds to those initial costs. The government will also need to finance much of the cost, given current budgetary realities, and the finance charges are part of the bill. “We’ll get enough money out of Mexico over the next five or six decades to reimburse us for the wall we’re building now” isn’t QUITE the promise Trump made. (Also, we haven’t accounted for any costs of collecting this levy, or investigating/prosecuting avoidance, etc.) ---
**Author:** ![slash2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@slash2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slash2k)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/57 "2017-01-25T20:02:35Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > How did your money get \*into \*an American bank? Illegals generally dont have bank accounts. Given that there are banks marketing accounts specifically to people using Mexican consular documents as ID, I’m not sure I’d believe this bald assertion. Do you have a cite? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/58 "2017-01-25T20:04:59Z")
I can see how people might start mailing those pre-loaded debit cards out of the country in bulk. I wonder if he would then consider putting a tax of those…and how he could possibly show that the intent of the buyer was to send it out of the country? ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/59 "2017-01-25T20:06:40Z")
> [@Quimby](#): > > When the GOP controlled all of Washington last time during the Bush years they looked into building a wall like Trump proposed and determined the cost and maintenance of made it completely impractical. If anything the costs are higher now. Then there are the more local issues to deal with. Whose land is the wall going to sit on? I assume they’re not going to build it actually in the Rio Grande. The land is mostly private ranch land. What about those ranchers whose cattle rely on access to the river water? They would have to take, by eminent domain, a shit ton of land, and figure out how to remedy all the problems for the people who live there. I thought this idea was just so batshit crazy that we’d never hear a peep after the election. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144/60 "2017-01-25T20:06:43Z")
Over decades?? Ha. The next Democrat president just halts the whole thing. Trump will make taxpayers pay for the start of the construction, and Mexico won’t pay a dime. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anybody-understand-how-mexico-will-pay-for-the-wall/778144.md?page=4)