# Does anyone else think Word 2007 Sucks? Badly!! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 23, 2009, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372 "2009-12-23T21:32:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![HookerChemical](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/278dde/32.png) [@HookerChemical](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HookerChemical)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/141 "2010-01-05T17:28:45Z")
Vista was a horrible product on the roll-out. I bought a laptop with it within the first month it was out and regretted it. A few years later, I think it’s been patched into a decent operating system. There were so many annoyances on release that it was ridiculous. For example, I had to patch my Vista computer so it could read my shared XP folders, but XP could read my shared Vista folders without a problem. That’s just plain dumb. User Account Control is annoying as hell and adds very little to make my computer safer. “Are you sure you want to execute the file you told me you want to execute?.” Yes. “Are you sure? It’s an executable and may be harmful.” Yes, I really want to execute the file. It’s the Firefox installer, which means I can move away from your horrible insecure Internet Explorer. “You can only execute this executable if you confirm a third and fourth time. I’m trying to keep you safe.” /me throttles the computer. This takes some determination, as it’s a laptop with a rather large screen, but if you’re mad enough, you’ll find you can do it too. Now, docx. I like the idea of opening and standardizing the format. Installing a patch onto older versions of Office isn’t a big deal. (Seriously, it isn’t. It’s no worse than adding a security patch and something an IT department at a multinational firm should do as routine. It doesn’t break any functionality or change the way the program works in any significant way.) The execution, possibly rigged vote for approval, and Microsoft’s inability to follow its own standard, are a problem. ---
**Author:** ![HookerChemical](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/278dde/32.png) [@HookerChemical](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HookerChemical)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/142 "2010-01-05T17:37:15Z")
> [@Sateryn76](#): > > I think that, in the next ten years, MS is in for some hurt. As more “regular” people become more confident with computer work, this kind of bloatware bullshit is going to become quite unpopular, and MS is going to get their asses handed to them. They’ve already lost the IE race to Mozilla, and word processing, spreadsheet and database programs are not far behind. If only this were true. MS has a lock on the operating system and will continue to leverage that lock to force Office on people. MS has a lock on the Office suite and will continue to use it to force people to use their operating system. Formatting in WP is so much more intuitive than Word. “Reveal Codes.” That’s it. Those two words make WP a hundred times easier to work with. Word’s show formatting is a pale, pathetic, imitation. The menus were more intuitive for me than the Word menus, but I still prefer the ribbon interface. Still, I’ll take WP and Reveal Codes over Word with a ribbon if I had my choice. On the other hand, I like Excel 2003 more than Quattro, and I like Excel 2007 even more. ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Badger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/848f3c/32.png) [@Dead\_Badger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Badger)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/143 "2010-01-05T18:13:32Z")
Ah, fuck it, I’ll do it your way. [QUOTE=wmfellows] First, one can buy an after market add on (single user license Euro20 I believe) that recreates substantially the 03 interface. I have not used it, but it receives great reviews so far. [/quote] So what’s the problem? There exists a tool that solves your issues. I’m sure it wasn’t trivial to write. Why does it have to be made by Microsoft? Do Matlab users whine that Mathworks don’t write every Matlab addin? Do Excel users piss themselves in consternation at the thought of using third-party toolboxes? Of course not. So why does Mr Bigshot Executive have his panties in a bunch at the fact that there’s a cheap, easily-available solution to his problem? > [@](#): > > Asserting that staying with 2003 is the same as MS providing 2003 replication ability in its upgrade is simply absurd and laughable. I didn’t say that, I said that seeing as you define your needs with reference to 2003, 2003 is by definition acceptable. You’ve spent half the thread arguing about how it’s perfectly fine for you, and unwanted change is bad. So keep using it, for crying out loud. And if you think the 2007 features are so incredibly desirable, then either pay for retraining with the new UI, or pay the measly fee for Toolbar Toggle. It’s fucking simple. Stop whining that you’ve got a decision to make; that’s why you’re the big swinging dick, right? > [@](#): > > My irritation here specifically has been with the stupid gits who were abusing those users complaining about 07 as if it were some bloody magic leap forward. It’s not a magic leap forward; Word 2007 is (IMO) a vaguely competent product, where 2003 was a detestable piece of shit that should be dragged out and shot. Personally I don’t use Word unless forced to at gunpoint, but that doesn’t mean I don’t a) know improvement when I see it, and b) know “I hate change” whinges when I see them. I’ve hardly seen a single complaint about it vs. 2003 that wasn’t a simple “where is X command?” query wrapped up in swearing, usually with the answer “right in front of your stupid, stupid face, for fuck’s sake.” Unfortunately, it’s a trait of the common or garden idiot that they’d rather rant about something to strangers than spend 5 seconds with Google, hence the irritation amongst people who have a bit more initiative than God gave watercress. I sympathise if you employ a lot of common or garden idiots (I prefer garden idiots, myself), but that’s your cross to bear. > [@](#): > > Maybe in the US of A, where apparenlty MS has you lot bloody getting wagged by the tail, but not in my markets. I’m in the UK, thanks all the same, and can speak for at least two top UK universities. They tend to roll over software frequently because they get cheaper support for newer versions, and replenish their machines a lot. And yes, Office 2007 has been the default retail edition since its release, unless your “markets” are in Bumfuck, Mongolia. So I’m sorry, but if you think 2007 isn’t widespread outside offices and getting more so, you’re not doing your job properly. > [@](#): > > So you assert. I don’t see objective efficiency data out there, I do see a lot of taste and style being asserted as objective. Given your enlightened approach to software development, I can’t imagine you really want any such detail, but here is a [whole blog feed](http://blogs.msdn.com/jensenh/pages/table-of-contents.aspx) dealing solely with how MS went about designing their new UI, including validation. Knock yourself out. I also recommend **Merneith** ’s roundly ignored posts earlier. Not enough insults for you, I suppose. For the intellectually incurious, however, and just off the top of my head: [ul][li]commands are more consistently placed (as opposed to the old “guess where the toolbar went” approach to layout);[/li][li]there’s much more label text, reducing the need to guess what individual icons mean;[/li][li]GUI elements are larger, meaning less hunting and pecking;[/li][li]and they’ve made a better attempt to group options conceptually, as opposed to the dire pre-2007 game of guessing whether the option you want is in “tools, options, advanced” or “tools, customize, advanced” or wherever the hell else Microsoft stuck all their features they couldn’t be bothered to locate usefully.[/ul][/li] It’s not the best thing since sliced bread, but it surely is an improvement on the morass of anonymous, draggable icons and opaque dropdown menus that infested Word pre-2007. You’re welcome to your own opinion of course, but frankly I think anyone who can pretend that someone facing Word for the first time would prefer [this](http://i.d.com.com/i/dl/media/dlimage/41/76/8/41768_large.jpeg) to [this](http://www.qweas.com/downloads/business/office-suites-tools/scr-microsoft-office-word-2007.png) is off their rocker. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/144 "2010-01-05T19:04:33Z")
> [@wmfellows](#): > > Evidently you do else you would not have been haranguing and belittling the others and then getting slapped by me, eh? You think you’ve “slapped” me? Calling me names and telling me I don’t understand something doesn’t mean I don’t understand it. All you keep saying is that you need to retrain your people and that you don’t think the benefit is worth the cost. That’s fine. You don’t believe your people can grok it in a reasonable amount of time, so you’re going to stay a version behind. Two versions, pretty soon, since 2010 is out this year I believe. > [@wmfellows](#): > > No you dumb shite, as you keep dodging and weaving your stupid fucking smarmy pretension this is about being “smart” or “competent” enough to learn Office 07 becomes more fucking stupid. Every time you call me a “shite”, God kills a kitten. Save a few kittens and expand your vocabulary a little. > [@wmfellows](#): > > Competence is not about jumping into every fucking little marketing move by MS just because they added some shiny little objects for dumb gullible fucking shites like yourself, but assessing whether the transition cost is worth it, given lost productivity, training money spent on this bloody basic tool rather than on more mission critical training in software that actually is adding substantial new value, or even training spend in areas other than software. > > My firm is the fucking client, and MS will serve us, not the other way around, they’re the fucking tail, and the tail doesn’t wag big dogs. Sorry, I forgot that you’re their only client. How dare Bill Gates’ and his people do something that doesn’t EXACTLY the way you want? You should go smack him around and call him a “little shite”. That’ll show him. Don’t forget to add in “gullible little git”. That’s always a fun one. Here’s the inside scoop, Bigshot. Thousands of other firms have managed to upgrade to Office 2007, including mine and dozens of my clients, without the world blowing up on us. Clearly they were not all idiots, despite your cost/benefit analysis saying it’s not worth it. I eagerly await your response where you come back and tell me, AGAIN, that I’m a gullible, stupid, little shite who couldn’t possibly understand your super important job of allocating resources to train people how to use a fucking word processor so that you can better focus on your core competency, or whatever other mindless, corporate-speak you use to keep your ego inflated to such enormous proportions. ---
**Author:** ![tim314](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim314/32/3468_2.png) [@tim314](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tim314)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/145 "2010-01-06T04:44:16Z")
**Want to know why they redesigned the MS Office user interface?** Here it is, straight from the horse’s mouth. (In this case the horse is Jensen Harris, who was the Group Program Manager of the Office 2007 User Experience team.) [The Why of the New UI (Part 1)](http://blogs.msdn.com/jensenh/archive/2006/03/28/563007.aspx) [Ye Olde Museum Of Office Past (Why the UI, Part 2)](http://blogs.msdn.com/jensenh/archive/2006/03/29/563938.aspx) [Combating the Perception of Bloat (Why the UI, Part 3)](http://blogs.msdn.com/jensenh/archive/2006/03/31/565877.aspx) [New Rectangles to the Rescue? (Why the UI, Part 4)](http://blogs.msdn.com/jensenh/archive/2006/04/03/567261.aspx) [Tipping the Scale (Why the UI, Part 5)](http://blogs.msdn.com/jensenh/archive/2006/04/04/568249.aspx) [Inside Deep Thought (Why the UI, Part 6)](http://blogs.msdn.com/jensenh/archive/2006/04/05/568947.aspx) [No Distaste for Paste (Why the UI, Part 7)](http://blogs.msdn.com/jensenh/archive/2006/04/07/570798.aspx) [Grading On the Curve (Why the UI, Part 8)](http://blogs.msdn.com/jensenh/archive/2006/04/11/573348.aspx) ---
**Author:** ![tim314](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim314/32/3468_2.png) [@tim314](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tim314)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/146 "2010-01-06T05:04:41Z")
The main point of those articles seems to be that their basic menu structure hadn’t changed too much since the very first version of MS Word, and while this was great when they only had a small number of features, it doesn’t work so well now that they have roughly a billion features. People never even discover a lot of useful features because they’re buried in submenus of submenus. The new UI is better for finding features you’ve never used before, because more stuff is right in front of you. To add my own take on things: The problem is that if you already _knew_ where something was, it’s now harder to find (at least at first) because it’s not where you expect it to be. I think MS is probably _right_ that the old Office UI had outlived its usefulness. _However_, it’s a basic principle of UI design that a good UI should work like people expect it to work. Otherwise, people tend to get angry. In this case, that expectation has been shaped for many of us by years and years of using the old versions of MS Office. So Microsoft is damned if they do and damned if they don’t . . . either they keep using an increasingly inadequate menu system, or they switch to one that commits the cardinal sin of being _unfamiliar_ and piss off all their established users who had come to expect everything to work a certain way. I’m not sure there’s any good solution . . . I guess they’re gambling that those who are initially pissed off by the new UI will get over it and adjust to the new arrangement. They’re Microsoft, so they can probably get away with this when others couldn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 8:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/147 "2010-01-06T08:05:58Z")
> [@tim314](#): > > So Microsoft is damned if they do and damned if they don’t . . . either they keep using an increasingly inadequate menu system, or they switch to one that commits the cardinal sin of being _unfamiliar_ and piss off all their established users who had come to expect everything to work a certain way. > > I’m not sure there’s any good solution . . . The main complaint is that Office 2007 contains no “Revert to 2003 menus” option. Managing wetware transition isn’t exactly a new concept. ---
**Author:** ![Critical1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Critical1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Critical1)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 8:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/148 "2010-01-06T08:16:42Z")
> [@wmfellows](#): > > Of course quitting bitching means that the Redmond firm will continue to make the same mistakes, as it did with Vista. > > And given the failure that was Vista, the Redmond firm should bloody well care. Vista was a Resounding success, it did Exactly what it was intended to do. Get people to PAY microsoft for the honor of beta testing windows 7. personally I love the new office, then again I am not a power user and have few problems that cant be solved with a quick google (note google, not bing) ---
**Author:** ![Prelude\_to\_Fascination](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a183cd/32.png) [@Prelude\_to\_Fascination](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prelude_to_Fascination)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/149 "2010-01-06T13:02:02Z")
I haven’t read the whole thread, but my company offered Office 2007 as a personal download for $9.95. Considering we were looking at buying an office suite, and saw it priced at least at one store for about $200, it seems like a good deal. On the other hand, you get what you pay for. On the third hand, it was a company benefit – one of the few I get (I deserve more, to be honest, but that’s another topic). Given that, as long as it doesn’t actually damage my computer, what’s the harm (unless there’s an indication that it does harm my system, in which case, I’m probably fucked)? On the fourth hand, my 11-year old will use it for school reports, which is why I agreed to buy it. ---
**Author:** ![BrandonR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/779978/32.png) [@BrandonR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrandonR)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/150 "2010-01-06T15:40:53Z")
Everyone hates the new Office interface until they give a chance and learn where everything is, then they love it. Microsoft did a lot of research into what functions are used and where they should be logically placed, and it really is better than going through endless menus. Just give it some time to adjust… Why must everyone flip out when change occurs? ---
**Author:** ![Corner\_Case](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/corner_case/32/234_2.png) [@Corner\_Case](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Corner_Case)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2010, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/151 "2010-01-06T22:25:06Z")
I may have missed the link in this thread, but here is a link to an [interactive guide](http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/word/Ha100744321033.aspx). Click on the Word 2003 menu item and it shows you where it is in Word 2007. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/152 "2010-01-07T00:44:57Z")
> [@BrandonR](#): > > Why must everyone flip out when change occurs? Because Microsoft forgot to consult with **wmfellows** before redesigning the interface. ---
**Author:** ![Ignatz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/3be4f8/32.png) [@Ignatz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ignatz)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/153 "2010-01-07T01:21:07Z")
Yeah. I just needed to insert a line between two other lines in an Excel spreadsheet and couldn’t remember how I did it the last time so I try the INSERT function. Nada. Then I try the PAGE LAYOUT function. Nada. Then I tried the others and finally HOME. Tada. Big Green Donkeys. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/154 "2010-01-07T02:44:49Z")
In a grqphics program I see a legitimate need & purpose for a tools palette with icons and whatnot — you don’t do graphics editing with just your keyboard, after all. No word processor should assume you want your screen taken up with lots of icons though. Commands belong in menus (until you memorize the keystroke equivalents, that is). ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/155 "2010-01-07T03:05:08Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > No word processor should assume you want your screen taken up with lots of icons though. Commands belong in menus (until you memorize the keystroke equivalents, that is). …why not? ---
**Author:** ![tacoloco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tacoloco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tacoloco)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/156 "2010-01-07T03:26:37Z")
> [@Lord\_Ashtar](#): > > Because Microsoft forgot to consult with **wmfellows** before redesigning the interface. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Waenara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/50afbb/32.png) [@Waenara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Waenara)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/157 "2010-01-07T06:25:18Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > No word processor should assume you want your screen taken up with lots of icons though. Commands belong in menus (until you memorize the keystroke equivalents, that is). _Word 2007_ has over 1,500 commands. If they were all in menus, it would be impossible to find everything because they would be buried 2 or 3 menus deep and then inside of a dialog box. One major reason they redesigned the UI was because people kept requesting new features that old versions of Word _already contained_ - people just didn’t know they were there or couldn’t find them. ---
**Author:** ![Polerius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d78d45/32.png) [@Polerius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polerius)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/158 "2010-01-07T06:41:06Z")
I haven’t read the whole thread, but has anyone mentioned the following: In today’s vertically challenged laptops with widescreen displays, vertical real estate is very valuable, and no matter how “brilliant” the new menu structure is, it eats up a lot of vertical space, leaving less room for the document you are editing. As more and more people use netbooks, the problem is exacerbated even further. One positive thing: In case some of you don’t know, pressing Control+F1 hides the ribbon allowing you to write/read without taking so much space, and pressing Control+F1 again makes the ribbon reappear. ---
**Author:** ![Polerius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d78d45/32.png) [@Polerius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polerius)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 6:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/159 "2010-01-07T06:44:18Z")
> [@Waenara](#): > > _Word 2007_ has over 1,500 commands. If they were all in menus, it would be impossible to find everything because they would be buried 2 or 3 menus deep and then inside of a dialog box. This explanation I don’t get. Are you claiming that they have been able to cram 1,500 commands into the ribbon? It seems a bit unlikely. If you need multiple menus buried 2 or 3 deep to fit 1,500 commands, how much ribbon space would you need, since the ribbon just lays it all out there? ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2010, 8:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372/160 "2010-01-07T08:27:28Z")
> [@Waenara](#): > > One major reason they redesigned the UI was because people kept requesting new features that old versions of Word _already contained_ - people just didn’t know they were there or couldn’t find them. MS’s help function sorta sucks doesn’t it? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-anyone-else-think-word-2007-sucks-badly/522372.md?page=9)