# Does military authority overpower police authority **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 13, 2006, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519 "2006-04-13T14:04:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Bear\_Nenno](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bear_nenno/32/3358_2.png) [@Bear\_Nenno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bear_Nenno)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2006, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519/21 "2006-04-14T22:33:50Z")
ASAP. The implied rule there is “As Soon as _Legally_ Possible”. The only time a soldier needs to be in that kind of hurry is if he’s actually in theatre. And then, traffic laws dont really apply anyway. The people who have a need to go fast, already have laws in place to allow them to do so. Your average soldier… even your average SF soldier, has no reason to drive 90 to get to work. ---
**Author:** ![Scruloose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e68b1a/32.png) [@Scruloose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scruloose)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2006, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519/22 "2006-04-14T22:41:24Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Just a thought, but doesn’t it depend upon the orders the soldier has been given? If he’s been ordered to return ASAP, despite reminding his superior that this may involve breaking speed limits, then surely the lawbreaking is the responsibility of the superior? Or would this qualify as an ‘Unlawful Order’? That would be an unlawful order. Commanding officers (at least in my service) are specifically charged in service regulations with ensuring their personnel comply with federal, state and municipal laws. As a somewhat related sea story (or land story, as it were), I once had a seaman who had quite the lead foot. He was once pulled over for speeding while traveling to Walmart on a unit parts run. In the Gov’t Chevy Suburban. The Gov’t Chevy Suburban with the emergency lights and sirens and “U.S. COAST GUARD SEARCH & RESCUE” plastered all over it. Dumbass. The Chief was pretty pissed. U.S. Government emergency response vehicles are subject to local and state laws. Even during an emergency, we could only drive 10mph over the speed limit with lights and sirens. YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![Raguleader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2006, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519/23 "2006-04-15T01:46:02Z")
So, a random question, say someone robs a Shopette on an Air Force base, and the Security Police give chase. The guy manages to get through the gate and get off base, are the SPs allowed to keep chasing him until local law enforcement catch up, or do they have to stop at the gate no matter what? (I imagine that if it was apparant the guy was heading to the gate, they’d contact local law enforcement anyways so as to try and have someone on the other side to continue the persuit, but eh, I’m curious.) ---
**Author:** ![Tripler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripler/32/21807_2.png) [@Tripler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tripler)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2006, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519/24 "2006-04-15T02:15:48Z")
> [@Raguleader](#): > > So, a random question, say someone robs a Shopette on an Air Force base, and the Security Police give chase. The guy manages to get through the gate and get off base, are the SPs allowed to keep chasing him until local law enforcement catch up, or do they have to stop at the gate no matter what? (I imagine that if it was apparant the guy was heading to the gate, they’d contact local law enforcement anyways so as to try and have someone on the other side to continue the persuit, but eh, I’m curious.) First, they have ways to close the gate before the fleeing suspect gets there. So, there’s a good chance they’ll lock down the gate(s) should something like that happens–I’ve seen it done before, to stop a fleeing husband who smacked his wife around in base housing, who then tried to run off base. Second, it’s situational, but the SPs could follow the suspect off base and either apprehend the suspect on the spot or detain him until the local “Fife squad” came to the site to pick him up. Usually, there’s already agreements in place to spell out who can do what, but that may get thrown out the window if the situation dictates. But yes, in either situation they would call ‘downtown’ to let them know what was going on. Tripler Clear as mud, eh? ---
**Author:** ![Moirai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/96bed5/32.png) [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2006, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519/25 "2006-04-15T20:52:47Z")
Wasn’t that a significant plot point of that classic Sean Connery/Mark Harmon/Meg Ryan thriller, _The Presidio_? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Jman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jman/32/4416_2.png) [@Jman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jman)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2006, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519/26 "2006-04-15T21:11:03Z")
As mentioned, quick deployment forces are notified that they are on short notice. Pretty much every servicemember is on a 96-hour recall. So, if your unit mobilizes, and your leave is cancelled, you have 4 days to return to post. Depending on your commanders orders, generally you may have less. For instance, in my unit, on duty days (including at night), you had 2 hours to be recalled. If you got a call, you had two hours to report to base. If you were off duty, and you’re now drunk, you have two hours to get a cab or call someone to pick your ass up and bring you to the base. On the weekends or holidays, you have more time, usually 4-6 hours. Outside of that, you’d need a milage pass to exempt you. In case of pass or leave, it’s 96 hours. So, given these circumstances, there’s very little reason for anyone to need to haul ass. Those on 2-4 hour recall at ALL times are given direct orders, and may not drink or be outside of the general area during that time. These types of rosters usually rotate to give soldiers time to relax and have good time, and aren’t all that common unless your unit is prepping to deploy anyway. ---
**Author:** ![thirdname](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/d07c76/32.png) [@thirdname](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thirdname)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2006, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519/27 "2006-04-16T00:10:18Z")
So it’s been established that the police have to stop at the base gates, but what happens afterwards? Is the military required to extradite soldiers off of the base? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Slant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c57346/32.png) [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2006, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519/28 "2006-04-16T02:11:50Z")
> [@Bear\_Nenno](#): > > ASAP. The implied rule there is “As Soon as _Legally_ Possible”. The only time a soldier needs to be in that kind of hurry is if he’s actually in theatre. And then, traffic laws dont really apply anyway. The people who have a need to go fast, already have laws in place to allow them to do so. Your average soldier… even your average SF soldier, has no reason to drive 90 to get to work. So you’re saying that if the Red Chinese have landed in Arlington, and our hypothetical base is in Virginia, the OP’s example might work? ---
**Author:** ![Tripler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripler/32/21807_2.png) [@Tripler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tripler)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2006, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519/29 "2006-04-16T04:58:34Z")
> [@riker1384](#): > > So it’s been established that the police have to stop at the base gates, but what happens afterwards? Is the military required to extradite soldiers off of the base? This OP notwithstanding, your question depends on the nature of the infraction. Should the soldier, airman, Marine, etc. make it onto the base and the authorities find out, the Devil starts wringing his hands, looking for charges to bring up on the person. Usually the rendition process starts from there–whomever has the best case against the service member. It also depends on the charges: if it’s a parking ticket or littering fine, they probably won’t render the service member to the civil authorities. If it’s “mid-level stuff” like shoplifting or a DUI, they may, just to get the charges moving along. If it’s heavy, say murder or manslaughter, the commander(s) may opt to lock up the servicemember in _military_ confinement, pending the outcome of the investigation. Long story short: there’s no obligation that I can answer to. It all depends on the charges, and how far people want to press the issue. Wether rendered or not, the servicemember will have to answer for their actions in one court or another. Tripler Clear as mud, eh? ---
**Author:** ![Raguleader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2006, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519/30 "2006-04-17T05:06:13Z")
> [@EJsGirl](#): > > Wasn’t that a significant plot point of that classic Sean Connery/Mark Harmon/Meg Ryan thriller, _The Presidio_? > > 😉 So… in such an event as what I’ve described, then I might have the chance to see Sean Connery beat the crap out of some thug with his left thumb (his right thumb being FAR to powerful) in a bar? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Moirai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/96bed5/32.png) [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2006, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519/31 "2006-04-18T00:27:37Z")
Hell yeah! I’d buy a ticket… 😃 ---
**Author:** ![cjb1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e99b99/32.png) [@cjb1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cjb1977)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2006, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519/32 "2006-04-18T04:07:22Z")
Another thing to consider is that some bases have their own civilian police departments. For example, Great Lakes Naval Base in North Chicago, IL has their own civilian police department called the Great Lakes Police Department who enforce both federal and State laws. They also patrol the base, housing, and other related areas. They have the same authority as a regular police officer in Illinois plus federal jurisdiction i.e. the Base. Police authority is a weird thing, it varies so much State to State, even by definition, that a general question without specific facts/locale makes discussions very difficult. Actually most Goverment Agencies/Entities have their own specific police departments. The CIA has their own police department, Supreme Court, Capital and etc. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519/33 "2006-04-19T00:54:18Z")
> [@Bear\_Nenno](#): > > Great point. And the other amazing thing about police authority in Korea, is the authority the American MPs exercise OFF POST!! Not so amazing. The Status of Forces Agreement between the host country and the United States provides for such a thing. Basically, the US military members are subject to two sets of laws at the same time while off base: the UCMJ and the host country laws. The non-military non-host country personnel who are employed on base or who accompany the U.S. military members are subject to the host country law while off base or on base. They are also subject to administrative sanction of the U.S. area commander. In other words, their behavior both on and off base can be cause for removal of command sponsorship, and thus deportation/ejection from the country. Mind you, what I’ve described here is not the case for those personnel who are granted diplomatic immunity. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-military-authority-overpower-police-authority/352519.md?page=1)