# Does Mitt Romney have a problem with the truth? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [March 12, 2012, 8:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537 "2012-03-12T08:31:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2012, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/21 "2012-03-13T08:20:25Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > Benan does his argument a diservice by padding a list of straight-up lies with more debatable points. #1-#6 are really just straight up lies. The other stuff is pretty squirrelly to, but they aren’t the same kind of thing. Putting them with the first six points make the first six points look less egregious then they would otherwise. How is #10 not a straight up lie? One of the hostages spoke at my school (and lived on my paper route) in the early 80’s. I’ve read an excellent book on the subject. Everything I’ve heard from people who were there, or have seriously looked into it, is that the hostage takers hated Carter and gave no thought at all to Reagan. Negotiations were about returning the Shah, and after his death, unfreezing of Iranian assets. Once the issues were settled, they delayed the release until after the inauguration as a final “fuck you” to Carter. I’m sure lots of people would like to see it as corroboration of Reagan’s get-tough image, but that doesn’t mean it’s in any way true. ---
**Author:** ![Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/96bed5/32.png) [@Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patty_O_Furniture)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2012, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/22 "2012-03-13T16:07:39Z")
> [@Finagle](#): > > I admit that this is a strategy that’s going to resonate with the GOP, but what ever happened to "My opponent is an honorable and decent guy […] ? They don’t want to give the opposition or the media the chance to selectively quote it the way I just did. These days, even the subordinate clause has to be negative. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/23 "2012-03-19T00:34:54Z")
Steve Benen’s [10th edition of Chronicling Mitt’s Mendacity](http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/16/10720707-chronicling-mitts-mendacity-vol-x) is out. I see that he calls it “Mendacity” rather than “Lie” or even “Untruthful”. Please accept that clarification to the OP. > [@Steve Benen](#): > > 1. Romney told voters in Mississippi this week, “Don’t forget by the way that this President, how many months ago was it, 37 months ago, told us that if he could borrow $787 billion, almost $1 trillion, he would keep unemployment below 8 percent.” > > Putting aside the fact that $787 billion is not “almost $1 trillion,” the “below 8 percent” canard just isn’t true. > > 1. Romney also told Mississippi Republicans about the president, “He was going to cut the budget deficit in half. He’s doubled it.” > > This is one of Romney’s favorite lines, but it’s simply absurd on its face – he’s either lying or he’s bad at arithmetic. When Obama took office, the deficit was about $1.3 trillion. Last year, it was $1.29 trillion. This year, it’s on track to be about $1.1 trillion. Does Romney not know what “double” means? (Even if we believe Romney is confusing the words “deficit” and “debt,” it’s still wrong. The only modern presidents to double the debt on their watch were Reagan and George W. Bush. Obama inherited a $10 trillion debt, and it’s nowhere near $20 trillion.) > > 1. Going after Rick Santorum this week, Romney said, “This is the guy that voted to fund Planned Parenthood.” > > This is wildly dishonest. Not only did Romney fund Planned Parenthood as governor, but during his Senate campaign, Romney attended a Planned Parenthood fundraiser (his wife even dropped off a $150 check). > > 1. Romney argued in a press statement this week that Obama plans to “end Medicare as we know it.” > > This is both dishonest and ironic. Obama’s Affordable Care Act strengthens and protects Medicare, while Romney has endorsed Paul Ryan’s House Republican budget plan, which ends Medicare and replaces it with a voucher scheme. > > 1. Romney mocked Obama this week by arguing, “This is a president who thinks America is doing better.” > > You know who agrees with the president? Mitt Romney. > > 1. On energy policy, Romney said Obama blamed higher gas prices on Republican presidential candidates who “are talking in a very muscular way about Iran and their nuclear program.” > > That’s not what Obama said. > > 1. As Paul Krugman noted, Romney also argued that gasoline prices are high because President Obama won’t allow unrestricted drilling in the Gulf of Mexico and the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge. > > What Romney’s saying just isn’t true. > > 1. Romney told Fox News’ Megyn Kelly, “Time and again, I pointed out I’m not in favor of a health care plan that includes a national mandate.” > > Time and again, Romney has said he’s in favor of a health care plan that includes a national mandate. > > 1. In the same interview, Romney told Kelly, “I believe we should get rid of Obamacare. It’s a disaster. It’s going to cost a $1 trillion-plus.” > > No, it won’t. The Affordable Care Act actually cuts the deficit by hundreds of billions of dollars. > > 1. Romney told Fox News this morning about the president, “It’s hard to create a job if you never had one.” > > The economy has created 3.4 million jobs in the last three years. As for Obama “never” having held a job, he’s actually held several – one of which happens to be serving as president of the United States during a time of several crises. > > This week, MSNBC’s Lawrence O’Donnell explained to viewers, “[T]he political media have a problem. It’s a problem the press has always had and has never solved. When should they call a lie a lie? When a candidate like Mitt Romney, who lies much more than most candidates, says something that is utterly false, the press will say, it’s ‘not accurate.’ They might even use the word ‘false.’ They might use the word ‘untrue,’ but they will never, ever use the word ‘lie.’ And that is what lying politicians like Mitt Romney count on every time they try to get away with one of their ridiculous lies… In the silly rules of politics and political coverage, the word ‘lie’ just can’t seem to find its place.” > > Romney is testing this thesis in a rather dramatic way. > > Previous editions of Chronicling Mitt’s Mendacity: Vol. I, II, III, IV, V, VI, VII, VIII, IX. Ample links and additional material are [at Steve Benen’s blog entry](http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/16/10720707-chronicling-mitts-mendacity-vol-x). This week isn’t as overwhelming as the top 6 from last week were. Here are my scores: 1,3, 9 - highly misleading 2, 6, - untruth 4 - dishonest and ironic 5 - who cares 7 - fantasy conflicting with all expert opinion 8 - highly misleading, but par for the course: Mitt has merely changed his position and is trying to paper that over. I see his problem: he can’t just say he changed his mind, because frankly he does that way to much for it to be a credible excuse. Then again, nobody has ever lost money under-estimating the gullibility of the Republican electorate. 10 - hyperbole, combined with baseless smear. Obama worked on Wall Street, was a professor of constitutional law at the University of Chicago and was a best selling author, all before his political career. And if Mitt doesn’t think that the Presidency is a job, he should pursue other work. Hilariously, Benen notes that Mitt also attacked Santorum by saying, “misrepresenting the truth is not a good way” to boost one’s campaign, and candidates looking to gain ground should “use truth as one of the pillars of your strategy.” The Mittster seems to have discovered an inversion of the Rove strategy. Karl Rove advised candidates to identify the main strength of one’s opponent and attack that. Never mind accuracy or smear – just attack the main strength. Romney’s strategy is to ID one of his own many shortcomings and attack his opponent along those lines. So Romney projects his untruthfulness onto Santorum. And in #4 he attacks Obama for ending Medicare, when in fact the Medicare phase-out plan was proposed by Ryan (R). It’s a good approach when the media is prone to false equivalence. See? Both sides claim the other wants to end Medicare! ---
**Author:** ![gatorslap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gatorslap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gatorslap)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/24 "2012-03-19T05:55:21Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > Rick Santorum thinks so. He says Romney, "went out and didn’t tell the truth… He repeatedly had big government solutions and then went out and told the public bold face he didn’t.” Sorry for the nitpick, but… “[He] told the public bold face he didn’t”? Am I the only one that found that construction cringe-worthy? ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/25 "2012-03-19T06:08:51Z")
> [@gatorslap](#): > > Sorry for the nitpick, but… “[He] told the public bold face he didn’t”? Am I the only one that found that construction cringe-worthy? That was from the National Journal. To be fair, the Hill called it “Bald face”, which sounds more plausible: “He went out and misled voters that somehow or another he was not for mandates at the federal level when in fact he was,” Santorum said. “He went out and said, ‘Oh no. I didn’t require Catholic hospitals to provide things that were against their conscience,’ when in fact he did. He said, ‘Oh, I didn’t provide free abortions under ‘RomneyCare,’’ when in fact he did for some.” “So he’s repeatedly had big government solutions and then gone out and told the public, bald face, that he didn’t do the things that he did,” Santorum added. The former Pennsylvania senator cited recently unearthed materials — including “Meet the Press” appearances — in which Romney suggested that the Massachusetts healthcare law, specifically its individual mandate, would be a good model for national reform. “Gov. Romney actually advocated for the Massachusetts model that President Obama adopted with mandates,” Santorum said. “And then went out on the campaign trail and repeatedly — well, he repeatedly didn’t tell the truth.” [http://thehill.com/video/campaign/215341-santorum-romney-doesnt-tell-the-truth-on-healthcare](http://thehill.com/video/campaign/215341-santorum-romney-doesnt-tell-the-truth-on-healthcare) ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/26 "2012-03-19T06:41:17Z")
Not so strangely, Romney reminds me a lot of John Kerry. When you have to explain that you really do stand for something, people don’t think you really stand for anything. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/27 "2012-03-19T07:00:54Z")
> [@BlankSlate](#): > > Not so strangely, Romney reminds me a lot of John Kerry. When you have to explain that you really do stand for something, people don’t think you really stand for anything. Romney is basically the embodiment of all the phony caricatures the Republicans trot out during election years. Gore allegedly had a problem with the truth, though he didn’t. They wondered whether Kerry was the kind of guy you would have a beer with – but Romney is genuinely awkward, stilted or plastic in person, worse than Nixon. They spoke of limousine liberals and out of touch plutocrats – Romney fits these cultural descriptions to a T. The New York Times quoted one Tony Libri, chairman of the Sangamon County Republican Central Committee, in central Illinois: “I’m tired of rich guys running for office because it’s a mountain to be climbed for them… He probably spends more on a shirt or a haircut than most Americans make in a week.” ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2012, 7:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/28 "2012-03-19T07:26:14Z")
Aside: are you saying “bold faced” and “bald faced” are the same thing? that clears some things up. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 8:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/29 "2012-03-20T08:50:46Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Aside: are you saying “bold faced” and “bald faced” are the same thing? that clears some things up. I’m hypothesizing there was either a typo or braino in the transcription presented by National Journal. I opine that “Bald faced” is more plausible. I did not watch Meet the Press. ---
**Author:** ![rogerbox](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/76d3ee/32.png) [@rogerbox](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rogerbox)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/30 "2012-03-20T14:23:03Z")
I’ve always heard it _pronounced_ like bold faced, spelled for some reason like bald faced. But they are the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![gatorslap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gatorslap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gatorslap)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/31 "2012-03-20T15:13:10Z")
> [@rogerbox](#): > > I’ve always heard it _pronounced_ like bold faced, spelled for some reason like bald faced. But they are the same thing. The correct phrase is bald-faced. You do see/hear bold-faced sometimes. Either way, it sounds a little weird without the word “lie” immediately following. ---
**Author:** ![Balance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ccd318/32.png) [@Balance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balance)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/32 "2012-03-20T16:24:54Z")
> [@gatorslap](#): > > The correct phrase is bald-faced. You do see/hear bold-faced sometimes. Either way, it sounds a little weird without the word “lie” immediately following. Either way he pronounced it, I presume Santorum was hoping everyone would fill in the “lie” part without requiring him to actually say it. Outright _saying_ that a candidate is lying is apparently a breach of campaign etiquette–probably because once it starts, it will get thrown back at the one who started it. ---
**Author:** ![Docta\_G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2bfe46/32.png) [@Docta\_G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Docta_G)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2012, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/33 "2012-03-21T23:29:12Z")
Yes, it’s called “being a fucking moron.” ---
**Author:** ![Kozmik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8dc957/32.png) [@Kozmik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kozmik)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2012, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/34 "2012-03-22T01:38:08Z")
Yes. Romney saying [Bush and Paulson saved country from depression](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/21/mitt-romney-george-bush_n_1371073.html). ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2012, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/35 "2012-03-22T01:56:17Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > …The New York Times quoted one Tony Libri, chairman of the Sangamon County Republican Central Committee, in central Illinois: “I’m tired of rich guys running for office because it’s a mountain to be climbed for them… He probably spends more on a shirt or a haircut than most Americans make in a week.” Love it. Lincoln, the first Republican president, rose to political prominence in Sangamon County, which included New Salem. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2012, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/36 "2012-03-22T05:27:09Z")
> [@Kozmik](#): > > Yes. Romney saying [Bush and Paulson saved country from depression](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/21/mitt-romney-george-bush_n_1371073.html). Well, that is actually fair. Of course Obama continued saving the country from Depression. What Romney is not going to say is that if the mainstream Republican policies were followed, we would be in a depression. The Republicans were the ones against the horrid bailout. And Bush and Paulson got us into the mess also. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2012, 8:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/37 "2012-03-22T08:16:47Z")
> [@rogerbox](#): > > I’ve always heard it _pronounced_ like bold faced, spelled for some reason like bald faced. But they are the same thing. And that’s what I was saying makes a lot more sense to me. It’s like when you read the AW-ree as a child, and didn’t realize it was the same word as a-RYE that other people said. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2012, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537/38 "2012-03-22T13:25:13Z")
> [@BlankSlate](#): > > Not so strangely, Romney reminds me a lot of John Kerry. When you have to explain that you really do stand for something, people don’t think you really stand for anything. When I saw the “y’all” and “I ate some cheesy grits” nonsense from last week I was _immediately_ reminded of John Kerry posing in a borrowed leather work jacket at some AFL-CIO event in 2004. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-mitt-romney-have-a-problem-with-the-truth/615537.md?page=1)