# Does Obama care to explain the fear of ACA? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 16, 2013, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445 "2013-10-16T23:26:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/81 "2013-10-17T17:55:25Z")
In very general terms: The law eliminates the lifetime cap that some insurance plans had. It allowed children of insured people to stay on their parents’ insurance until they reach age 26. It sets minimum standards for health insurance policies. It expands medicaid for those states that want the expansion. It requires all tax payers to have insurance or else pay a fine (in the form of a tax). It eliminates exclusions based on pre-existing conditions. It prevents insurance companies from dropping people who get sick. It sets up state exchanges for those states that want them, or a federal exchange for those that don’t, for individuals to shop for insurance. It has some medical device tax to help fund it. It requires that insurance companies pay at least 80% of their premiums received as health benefits. That’s most of it. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/82 "2013-10-17T18:01:31Z")
Thanks, **RitterSport**. How are you getting on with reading [that link](http://kaiserfamilyfoundation.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/8061-021.pdf), **doorhinge**? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/83 "2013-10-17T18:05:19Z")
Maybe a [video](http://kff.org/health-reform/video/youtoons-obamacare-video/)is more his speed. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/84 "2013-10-17T18:13:38Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > It’s becoming clear to me that in this case the problem here is not that the administration is being secretive or uncommunicative; it’s that you haven’t attempted to find out what is going on. The law is already in effect. Different provisions have been going into effect since the law was signed in 2010. What you’re thinking of is the individual mandate, which goes into effect January 1. > [@Marley23](#): > > If the OP has questions, he can ask them himself. People are trying to deal with those. You, on the other hand, haven’t raised any questions. I won’t speak for **Kimstu** but I’m certainly getting tired of it. You keep saying things like “they won’t tell anybody what’s in the law!” and “nobody knows what’s in the law!” and that’s just not true. I think it’s time you put your cards on the table. \*Quote: Originally Posted by doorhinge I think it’s apparent that most people in this country **don’t know what to expect when ACA/Obamacare finally goes into effect**. \* First off, I’m talking about the confusion cause by the lack of information provided by the creators of ACA/Obamacare. Many seem to think it’s the responsibility of the taxpaying voters to find out what the administration is selling. It’s everyone responsiblity except the ACA/Obamacare creators to explain their plan. Pelosi was the one who said we needed to pass “the bill” to see what’s in it. The bill has been passed. Now the regulations are being written and costs configured. Many people still don’t know what they’re getting. And many blame them for not knowing. That’s certainly one way of looking at the problem but it’s not going to solve the problem. So what is it that **Marley23** “I Am the One Who Bans” “Administrator” is getting tired of? My discussing the massive confusion that is ACA/Obamacare? I don’t know what you’re getting tired of since you didn’t explain yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/85 "2013-10-17T18:18:35Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Many people still don’t know what they’re getting. And many blame them for not knowing. If people complain about not knowing something and then continually ignore the information that other people provide to help them know it, I think it’s reasonable to say that the complainers are at least somewhat to blame for their own ignorance. Speaking of which: How are you getting along with reading [that link](http://kaiserfamilyfoundation.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/8061-021.pdf), **doorhinge**? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/86 "2013-10-17T18:20:24Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > First off, I’m talking about the confusion cause by the lack of information provided by the creators of ACA/Obamacare. Many seem to think it’s the responsibility of the taxpaying voters to find out what the administration is selling. It’s everyone responsiblity except the ACA/Obamacare creators to explain their plan. They have provided plenty of information. This is sounding more and more insincere. > [@](#): > > So what is it that **Marley23** “I Am the One Who Bans” “Administrator” is getting tired of? There is some serious irony at work in this post since I explained exactly what I’m getting tired of. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/87 "2013-10-17T18:41:57Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > They have provided plenty of information. This is sounding more and more insincere. > > There is some serious irony at work in this post since I explained exactly what I’m getting tired of. Maybe if you could find it within yourself to explain it just one more time, I would better know how I’ve offended you. Are you sure “irony” is the word your looking for? \*\> irony a type of usually humorous expression in which you say the opposite of what you intend: - He had a powerful sense of irony, and you could never be absolutely sure when he was serious. › Irony is also something that has a different or opposite result from what is expected: - It is one of the ironies of life that by the time you have earned enough money for the things you always wanted, you no longer have the energy to enjoy them. › literature Irony is a style of writing in which there is a noticeable, often humorous, difference between what is said and the intended meaning.\* After carefully considering your position and abilities within this message board, I’ve decided that you’re right. Please don’t beat me massa, I still a good breeder. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Quatro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/bc8723/32.png) [@Mr\_Quatro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Quatro)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/88 "2013-10-17T18:44:24Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > Here’s a novel idea. How about instead of everyone in this thread have to defend ObamaCare/the ACA from accusations leveled by the OP, how about the OP defend his assertions:Please provide a cite for this assertion. > > Please provide a cite for this assertion. Yes of course I will now that the problem of congress blocking the ACA is over for this year. I saw it on point/counterpoint on CNN, but just one page of Bing brings up these figures: [Obamacare to cost $2.6 trillion first decade](Obamacare to cost $2.6 trillion first decade)[Yahoo Search - Web Search](http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20120711191443AATTN36) > [@](#): > > Jul 12, 2012 · Obama care Now Estimated to Cost $2.6 Trillion in First Decade The latest estimate, as the chart details, is that Obamacare will cost $2.6 trillion dollars > > Affordable Care Act will cost $1.8 trillion a year - 20 times … [brainerddispatch.com/opinion/2012-09-23/affordable-care-act-will](http://brainerddispatch.com/opinion/2012-09-23/affordable-care-act-will)… > [@](#): > > Sep 23, 2012 · Congressional Budget Office (CBO) officials project the Affordable Care Act (ACA) will cost American taxpayers double what the Obama administration had … The jobs being reduced down to 30 hours a week was also heard in a debate as a ploy by the employers to keep from having to pay the premiums of which that part of the bill to fine the employer has now been put off for an additional year. Yes I am against ACA, but I am willing to yield to it’s effectiveness of having mercy on the many Americans that can’t afford health insurance. The problem I have is how to do it more fairly than it has been done so far. Is it fair for the New York teachers employees union to be exempt because they have a better plan? A better plan than what? Perhaps we should model ACA after the New York teachers union health plan. Wouldn’t that be more fair? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/89 "2013-10-17T18:51:24Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Maybe if you could find it within yourself to explain it just one more time, I would better know how I’ve offended you. You haven’t offended me personally. I’m just finding that this is a waste of time. If you’re interested in a real discussion you can change that very quickly. > [@](#): > > Are you sure “irony” is the word your looking for? Yes. So can we get back to your questions about the law? Would you like to address anything of substance? > [@Mr\_Quatro](#): > > Yes of course I will now that the problem of congress blocking the ACA is over for this year. Not this year. Forever. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/90 "2013-10-17T18:54:42Z")
“Yahoo answers” linked to a _Weekly Standard_ article??? You gotta be kidding, but I see you haven’t been around here very long. There is nothing new in that article. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/91 "2013-10-17T18:59:52Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Maybe if you could find it within yourself to explain it just one more time, I would better know how I’ve offended you. > > Are you sure “irony” is the word your looking for? > > \*\> irony > a type of usually humorous expression in which you say the opposite of what you intend: > > - He had a powerful sense of irony, and you could never be absolutely sure when he was serious. > > › Irony is also something that has a different or opposite result from what is expected: > > - It is one of the ironies of life that by the time you have earned enough money for the things you always wanted, you no longer have the energy to enjoy them. > > › literature Irony is a style of writing in which there is a noticeable, often humorous, difference between what is said and the intended meaning.\* > > After carefully considering your position and abilities within this message board, I’ve decided that you’re right. Please don’t beat me massa, I still a good breeder. Obnoxiously defining irony? Fine. Maybe even funny. Tossing in that slavery riff? Not funny. Don’t do it again. Warning issued. ---
**Author:** ![Kearsen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/82dd89/32.png) [@Kearsen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kearsen)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/92 "2013-10-17T19:01:11Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > Here’s a novel idea. How about instead of everyone in this thread have to defend ObamaCare/the ACA from accusations leveled by the OP, how about the OP defend his assertions:Please provide a cite for this assertion. > > Please provide a cite for this assertion. I’m not going to defend the guy but you see those things, the curly things with a little dot under them? Well, you see, those are question marks (which inherently makes them not assertions. (hint: he probably won’t have a cite) ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/93 "2013-10-17T19:21:14Z")
I just got something! It was from that republican-focus-group site that I can’t find right off hand which made very clear that the reason many if not most of the tea party types hate and fear health care reform is not so much that they think it will be very expensive as that they believe it will increase support for the Democrats. One of the central tenets of these people is that they are deserving and almost any other group you could name is not deserving, other than those who already have a lot of money. The ACA not only so unfairly benefits the undeserving, but it BUYS THEIR VOTES FOR THE DEMOCRATS. The tea partyists believe this is a deliberate secret ploy to increase the Dems’ power – since no one can seriously entertain the idea of everyone deserving affordable healthcare, it must be a deliberate lie that only ignorant dupes of Obama could believe. See how that thought process works? I feel smart now! Before, I couldn’t imagine why someone could be so stupidly opposed to health care reform. But they are right. Even though they wrongly attribute nefarious motives, the result will be what they fear: it will indeed garner support for the Dems. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/94 "2013-10-17T19:23:51Z")
> [@Mr\_Quatro](#): > > Yes I am against ACA, but I am willing to yield to it’s effectiveness of having mercy on the many Americans that can’t afford health insurance. The problem I have is how to do it more fairly than it has been done so far. Is it fair for the New York teachers employees union to be exempt because they have a better plan? Exempt from what? It’s not like ACA mandates that you must have coverage from a specific vendor. It’s more like my state mandates minimum 20,000/50,000 policy limits on auto liability insurance- and if I buy a 100,000/300,000 policy that meets the requirement.The requirement is that health insurance plans meet a specified level of coverage. Congress, NYC teachers and other groups aren’t “exempt” at all- their current plans meet and perhaps exceed the requirements. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Quatro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/bc8723/32.png) [@Mr\_Quatro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Quatro)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/95 "2013-10-17T19:25:48Z")
> [@Kearsen](#): > > I’m not going to defend the guy but you see those things, the curly things with a little dot under them? Well, you see, those are question marks (which inherently makes them not assertions. (hint: he probably won’t have a cite) cite:[http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2013/08/obamacares-impact-on-todays-and-tomorrows-taxpayers-an-update](http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2013/08/obamacares-impact-on-todays-and-tomorrows-taxpayers-an-update) August 21, 2013 > [@](#): > > New Spending > > The two main coverage components of Obamacare are a massive Medicaid expansion and new government subsidies to purchase coverage in the government-run state exchanges. The new spending on these provisions will cost taxpayers nearly $1.8 trillion from 2014 to 2023. anyway you look at it … a problem with money … is going to come up next year, especially if the young people don’t provide the overage for the old people. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/96 "2013-10-17T19:26:32Z")
If it unfairly benefits the “undeserving” and is a ploy to win votes (meaning that people benefit from it), then this directly contradicts every single thing the Republicans have said about the EVILS of “Obamacare”. So, Republicans, pick one. Either it ‘unfairly’ benefits people, or it will destroy America. It ain’t going to do both. Then maybe we can discuss how ‘unfair’ it is that people get health care, and just how they are ‘undeserving’ of such a basic thing. Oh, and how that fits within the whole “Christian” and “Pro-Life” thing. ---
**Author:** ![Algorithm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/algorithm/32/12204_2.png) [@Algorithm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algorithm)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/97 "2013-10-17T19:27:04Z")
> [@Kearsen](#): > > I’m not going to defend the guy but you see those things, the curly things with a little dot under them? Well, you see, those are question marks (which inherently makes them not assertions. (hint: he probably won’t have a cite) Easy mistake, but [those aren’t question marks](http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-september-13-2006/the-question-mark). ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/98 "2013-10-17T19:33:02Z")
> [@Mr\_Quatro](#): > > Jul 12, 2012 … > Affordable Care Act will cost $1.8 trillion a year - 20 times … > [@Mr\_Quatro](#): > > August 21, 2013 > > The two main coverage components of Obamacare are a massive Medicaid expansion and new government subsidies to purchase coverage in the government-run state exchanges. The new spending on these provisions will cost taxpayers nearly $1.8 trillion from 2014 to 2023. So what you’re telling me is that the more we learn about Obamacare, the _less_ it’s going to cost, since the price has apparently dropped by a factor of 20 between June 2012 and August 2013. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/99 "2013-10-17T19:34:19Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > You haven’t offended me personally. I’m just finding that this is a waste of time. If you’re interested in a real discussion you can change that very quickly. > > Yes. So can we get back to your questions about the law? Would you like to address anything of substance? I STILL question why the public still seems so confused about what ACA/Obamacare means for their personal healthcare and its costs to them. If you find that a waste of time, so be it. It’s your time. I also question the reason that so many waivers were issued if this ACA/Obamacare was supposed to be such a grand plan. If you support ACA/Obamacare up front, you won’t be force to live with it later. At least until some future date when it too late to change your mind about it. But that almost requires another thread, doesn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2013, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445/100 "2013-10-17T19:34:24Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > “Yahoo answers” linked to a _Weekly Standard_ article??? You gotta be kidding, but I see you haven’t been around here very long. There is nothing new in that article. \*\*And \*\*a citation that is over a year old! Some excellent policework, there. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-obama-care-to-explain-the-fear-of-aca/671445.md?page=6)