# Does predator urine really deter coyotes? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 27, 2010, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688 "2010-06-27T17:01:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2017, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688/42 "2017-08-09T13:09:51Z")
I would think that a fisher-cat would be big enough that, while a coyote probably could kill one, it’d be risky for the coyote, and that it’d prefer to go after easier prey. Wait, are we talking about the cat, or the weasel, when we say “fisher”? I thought the former, but now that I’m looking online, I’m seeing info on the latter. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2017, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688/43 "2017-08-09T13:29:07Z")
> [@scrannel](#): > > About a week after going to wolf urine… it’s rabbit fiesta time on our lawn! Now… what urine keeps away rabbits…? I’ve had some success using coyote urine in my garden for that… It will not, however, deter a snapping turtle from coming into your garden and eating all your lettuce and other greens. ---
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2017, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688/44 "2017-08-09T14:15:55Z")
The problem with using predator urine is it might deter the prey animals … but it also might _attract_ the predators from whence the urine came from … coyote urine attracts coyotes, puma urine attracts pumas etc etc etc … that’s why they sell urine at trapper supply stores … sprinkle a little wolf urine in front of a #3-1/2 foot hold trap and presto, you’ll catch a wolf !!! ---
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2017, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688/45 "2017-08-09T14:28:43Z")
> [@watchwolf49](#): > > The problem with using predator urine is it might deter the prey animals … but it also might _attract_ the predators from whence the urine came from … coyote urine attracts coyotes, puma urine attracts pumas etc etc etc … that’s why they sell urine at trapper supply stores … sprinkle a little wolf urine in front of a #3-1/2 foot hold trap and presto, you’ll catch a wolf !!! Are you speaking from personal experience? If so, how did you get free? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2017, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688/46 "2017-08-09T14:33:21Z")
> [@KimTerrified](#): > > Anyone know anything about Fishers? I found this blog and really hope someone can give me some information. > I live in upstate NY - WAYY out in the country. One neighbor who is rarely home, completely covered by woods except about a 2 acre span of my land that I try to keep mowed. We have a second lot that leads to a corn field. When I first moved here we had beautiful deer, a few possum, lots of coyotes calls at night, but never was I really worried. I figured I’d always ‘see’ or ‘hear’ any danger and although I was cautious, have never had any problem. Had a cat who used to refuse to come in at night, out all day hunting, would come in about 2-3 am. No problem. I was worried but hearing him holler all night was worse. > > Since all this - coyote calls have stopped - used to hear about 30 in the next lot. They were so loud I could hear them over my TV. I only see a few deer now and then eating off my crabapple tree. No rabbits anymore - no possum - my newest cat, the other died a natural death - is very naive, loves to hunt, brought here after my mother passed on, is a small town cat used to visit all the neighbors around town, but now, we have a whole new scene. He’s been out and about for almost a year. Unbelievably so he’s made it home every day, and I try to get him in by 7-8 at night. He loves to go out in the early morning to do his hunting and I have let him go. However, the other morning, he was out, I had gone back to bed with my window opened and heard… little growling, snarling, little bit, but it woke me up… a little more and I got up out of bed.Looked out my window and against a flower box near my house is my cat with a fisher in front of him! I was TERRIFIED! Only through research did I know what this was… I had heard they were around, but stupid me, never though one would get this close to my house… (cabin). Screaming, hollering, my cat just stood there without a clue what this thing was, and only with this Fisher making advances did my cat start to raise his back. My screaming wasn’t working. NO reaction from the fisher at all. But I started pounding on the wood, raising holy \*\*\* and he backed off. I ran from my window to the front door ONLY to find out, my cat followed the Fisher! Terrified I kept calling the cat. I was pacing back and forth not knowing what to do and kept going back to the front door to call him, when he came around the corner. (My cat)… but still wouldn’t come in. Looking around and around, he didn’t have a clue the danger, but the fisher had left or was lurking someplace out of sight. I grabbed the cat and threw him inside. > > I did more research the rest of the morning, call my local Environmental Forestry ranger all without any answers. Came to the only conclusion that besides keeping my now very upset cat inside, he’s not hollered one time to go back out… I think he finally ‘gets it’… he’s very quiet now and is definitely on guard. It has completely changed his personality. One encounter did this and he wasn’t even struck by this animal. But one question I Have is I bought Wolf Urine, But will Wolf Urine ATTRACT other’s wolves looking for a mate? We have very very few wolves here, none that I have even seen, but I know others have, however will it keep fishers away? > > WHO has information about these fishers? Especially so close to my house? He was right outside my window. > > OMG. HELP! A New Hampshire Fish and Wildlife study of the stomach content of 1,000 fishers only found one with cat hair. This would indicate that fisher predation of cats is extremely rare and your cat has little to worry about from the fisher. If there are squirrels in your neighborhood that is what fishers prefer to eat. Coyotes are a much bigger danger to cats and cats make up about 10% of a coyote’s diet. Wolves are not a problem in New York as only one has been found there in the last 25 years. ---
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2017, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688/47 "2017-08-09T19:24:49Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > Are you speaking from personal experience? If so, how did you get free? > 🙂 Some eco-freak greenies happened by … “Oh the poor majestic beast, we _have_ to set him free” … they sure were surprised when I turned and bit them … but lesson learned, one territory mark beware … any wolf worth his hide is going to piss on everything … Speaking of which, are we going to replace the carpet in here someday? ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2017, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688/48 "2017-08-09T19:26:19Z")
> [@Gary\_Robson](#): > > You’ve gained a very different view of coyotes than I have. Around here, they are quite a few notches down from the apex predator role (following wolves, grizzlies, mountain lions, black bears, possibly wolverines, and obviously humans). They are most definitely fast, clever, and opportunistic, but they can’t afford to get cocky, as some of the critters on the rungs above them kill them just for entertainment. The coyotes around here don’t show themselves much. Even predators that arguable share the same spot in the ecosystem (bobcats, red foxes, lynxes…) will kill a coyote if they can. > > Okay, I know it’s not really for entertainment. The big guys just don’t want to share their territory with competing predators. A resident coyote pack will actively try to steal a black bears cub, as documented by a couple of random stories here. > **[CAUGHT ON CAMERA: Bear Vs. Coyote](https://www.kulr8.com/news/caught-on-camera-bear-vs-coyote/article_e7af92f0-bd5b-5688-a681-69b333ba7dbb.html)** > > A momma bear and a coyote are caught on camera in a head to head match for a garbage can feast. > **[Mother bear and cub pursued by coyotes return to hunker down in La Cañada canyon](https://www.latimes.com/socal/la-canada-valley-sun/news/tn-vsl-mother-bear-20170602-story.html)** > > Animal Control officers and Crescenta Valley Sheriff’s Station deputies are monitoring a narrow canyon at the 4900 block of Terracita Lane, where a mother bear and her cub returned this week after being threatened by coyotes there Friday morning. But even in the case of grey wolves, competition seems to be the main control on coyote population, and while the numbers did drop in Yellowstone for example that drop in population was only about 1/3 and not total evacuation. Cougars may sometimes kill a coyote just as a coyote may kill a bobcat from time to time but these are occasional occurrences and not a hard rule. But crazy enough I have actually watch a badger and a coyote hunting together, and the coyote actually groomed the badger after they had both caught several squeekies (ground squirrels) working together. I shoot a lot of nature photography, and unfortunately most of it is wide angle time lapse so I didn’t have the right camera to take pictures but I have seen coyotes hanging out waiting for their chance on a kill, or in times/areas of less food rushing up to try and steal food from other larger predators. And when bellies are empty obviously the competition and tensions rise. But most related to the OP, I live deep in the city of Seattle, and I have routinely seen coyotes walking directly next to a dog park at night. They are smart enough to be nocturnal in the deep city, but they seemed to be more interested in the high number of rats as a food source than carrying about epic amounts of dog/(wolf) urine. My understanding may be incorrect, but it seems that the coyotes that are in very urban areas seem to be in pairs or solo. I assume that they do not have strongly defended territories and I doubt that detecting another predators markings does anything but alert them to needing to keep their guard up. I can understand the difficulty in trying to keep a former outside cat indoors, but the average lifespan of an feral cat in a group is ~5 years, and only a couple when solo. Compared to almost 20 for indoor pets, the numbers show how great the risk is. But relating to coyotes night time is the highest risk if you are in an urban area. ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2017, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688/49 "2017-08-09T22:46:09Z")
Several years ago when we lived across the street from a State Park I put a lot of different foods out at night and used a trail camera to see who came buy. I posted many of them here at the SDMB. Coyotes were common visitors plus many more things/critters. We had 7-9 cats at the time and we would put them up at night. Most folks did around there, even those with big dogs. Biggest problem was hawks & owls getting kittens in the day time. Had to be careful there. Several times we had on of our cats sitting 10 feet from a fox or two that was at the food place just about 20 feet from our front door watching them eat. Sometimes we had 5 different animals eating at the same time. A lot of times the coyotes would wait back in the woods until some other group would finish. No neighbors had less then 3 acres and no one was across the street at all, State Park. Only comments was about dogs that got into a chicken pen or, “Did you get to see the black mountain lion so & so got on his trail camera?” A few black bear sightings but there were not that many around that park. So, feeding all the critters did not raise or lower coyote populations that anyone could tell, people were not silly about trash and pets out at night. No campers were ever attacked. A few fell off the cliffs but critters had nothing to do with that as far as I know. YMMV ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2017, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688/50 "2017-08-09T23:51:31Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth **rat avatar** : > > But crazy enough I have actually watch a badger and a coyote hunting together, and the coyote actually groomed the badger after they had both caught several squeekies (ground squirrels) working together. Please tell me you caught that on camera, because that’s awesome. ---
**Author:** ![TSBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/77aa72/32.png) [@TSBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TSBG)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2017, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688/51 "2017-08-11T02:27:56Z")
Coyotes where I live are so damn confident that they lollygag around in the daytime near schools. This is urban LA county. Fuckers won’t even run away when you yell at them any more. They are very, very confident around humans and our pets, aka prey. I would happily shoot them all but that’s not so safe with all the people to catch stray bullets. Never heard anyone trying predator urine as a deterrent, but even if it worked there are a lot of people with a lot of small pets and it would take quite a lot of captive wolf piss to make LA County safe for cats and small dogs. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2017, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688/52 "2017-08-11T03:08:45Z")
That, and there are already a lot of wolves around and peeing in any place with humans. Do you really think that coyotes can tell from the smell that the wolves in question like humans and have floppy ears? ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2017, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688/53 "2017-08-11T04:34:29Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Please tell me you caught that on camera, because that’s awesome. I was shooting ultra-wide angle lenses and it was the era of 12MP cameras so unfortunately no. It would have just been little dots and I was viewing it with binoculars. Looking at some papers it appears that the badger/coyote affinity has been known for well over 40 years. Here is a cite for those who want to see close interaction. [https://www.fws.gov/news/blog/index.cfm/2016/11/2/Spotted-A-Coyote-and-Badger](https://www.fws.gov/news/blog/index.cfm/2016/11/2/Spotted-A-Coyote-and-Badger) ---
**Author:** ![Stalker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bcef8e/32.png) [@Stalker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stalker)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2019, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688/54 "2019-08-07T06:47:46Z")
Read a lot of good stuff which is logical There is a den right over the other side of my 1200ft moraine in southern NYS. Hunter saw the sign and I can hear momma My cats been nervous lately and no rabbits so that matches all I have heard I live very rural at edge of large wood and carried weapons when I walked my dog because of all the stories The one article makes sense with my recent experience When I hear them make a kill nearby I go outside at three am and howl like they do First they shut up then I hear the alpha call them back to the den I usually take a Hessian Horseman axe, morning star, war hammer or boar spear for protection and a pistol back up It is not sport unless the other team has a chance of winning So I howl like mad to challenge them and then I roar and yell curses. I finish off with unloading a few magazines from the pistol Someone in the area gets hired to track and kill them so they know what I am They seem pretty smart since they seem to respect the territory I have established But after reading all this I need to be more preemptive. They may well be watching from just out of sight. May just go howl now just because it is fun Like the idea of collecting my own urine Shame on the fur farms I believe I live and let live. As long as they stay out of my 10 acres they can do what they want but I need to protect my own till I get enough fence built for donkeys. We have plenty deer and roadkill they do not need to come here Thanks for putting it all in perspective Oh yeah. I saw bold ones in daylight in Ocala FL but the wild ones I have only seen crossing roads at sunrise and sunset while commuting What concerns me is the big one that literally jumped over the hood of my truck going up a mountain cut in the state forest one night Huge!!! Not like the FL coyotes I take them real seriously. My animals are my family [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-predator-urine-really-deter-coyotes/544688.md?page=2)