# Does Star Trek DS9 rip off Babylon 5? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 13, 2010, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-star-trek-ds9-rip-off-babylon-5/528856 "2010-02-13T14:01:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-star-trek-ds9-rip-off-babylon-5/528856/61 "2010-02-17T23:10:49Z")
> [@Raguleader](#): > > Another thing that DS9 lacks, I think, is Vir Cotto’s wave. > > Like this: > > _waves and smiles_😉 True. For all the cringeworthy moments in B5, DS9 had a rod popped up its arse a little too far for it to create anything that worthy. > [@bouv](#): > > No mention of Zathras? Or of Zathras? And man, you didn’t even mention Zathras! Zathras, who lived on that _planet_ to which entry was _forbidden_. The lonesome looking place, under the surface of which was a massive and all powerful machine, which operated when someone plugged their mind into it and unleashed that power against anyone trying to come there with bad intentions. It looked like [this](http://b5thoughts.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/vlcsnap-195821.png), which was in no way similar to [this](http://www.technovelgy.com/graphics/content08/krell-machine.jpg). [JMS protests](http://www.jmsnews.com/msg.aspx?ID=1-13561). ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-star-trek-ds9-rip-off-babylon-5/528856/62 "2010-02-18T02:15:04Z")
> [@Pushkin](#): > > For all the cringeworthy moments in B5, DS9 had a rod popped up its arse a little too far for it to create anything that worthy. Say what? Er, please explain. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-star-trek-ds9-rip-off-babylon-5/528856/63 "2010-02-18T02:59:00Z")
> [@JThunder](#): > > Ezri is cute. DS9 wins. Lyta is cuter. Point to B5. ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-star-trek-ds9-rip-off-babylon-5/528856/64 "2010-02-18T04:31:02Z")
DS9 has [fighting Kira](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYMaglfnuso). And [singing Kira.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPsk8hjnhmw) And oh my, especially [Mirror Kira.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Db44tZY6bnE) For me, that’s game, set, and match! But more seriously, it’s all good – they’re two great sci-fi shows. We’re lucky to have 'em. ---
**Author:** ![thirdname](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/d07c76/32.png) [@thirdname](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thirdname)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-star-trek-ds9-rip-off-babylon-5/528856/65 "2010-02-18T05:22:13Z")
> [@choie](#): > > DS9 has [fighting Kira](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYMaglfnuso). And [singing Kira.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPsk8hjnhmw) And oh my, especially [Mirror Kira.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Db44tZY6bnE) I love that “two-handed hammer” fighting move they use on Star Trek in order to look exotic or futuristic. It would be completely useless in real life. With a punch, you can put the momentum of your whole body behind it. With that Star Trek move, you’re basically flailing your forearms at your opponent. I think Dax was a bit better in the face, but Kira had a fine ass. ---
**Author:** ![Darkhold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90db22/32.png) [@Darkhold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darkhold)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 7:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-star-trek-ds9-rip-off-babylon-5/528856/66 "2010-02-18T07:18:03Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > In infringement cases between large media companies these chains of evidence rarely exist before you sue. They acquire this information _after_ they sue. Not having these things before you sue doesn’t stop you from bringing a lawsuit. If Warner Bros. had had any belief at all that the DS9 producers had gotten hold of the B5 info before going into production, they would have sued. I don’t know why you are so sure about that. The creator of B5 didn’t want to pursue a lawsuit so why would they force one over his reluctance? And what do you mean ‘gotten hold of the B5 info’? We know this information was with Paramount. Obviously we can’t know what they did with that information but I doubt they burned it and wiped their memories. I guess it’s possible when it came time to start DS9 that none of the people that had seen the material or heard of the material were in any way involved in DS9 but I would guess the same people involved in a pitch of one sci-fi show would be involved in the creation of the next. > [@](#): > > The question here is not whether every element of DS9 is completely new. The question is whether it is a “rip off.” So far as I am concerned, it’s a rip off only if it is infringing. Well I guess we have different standards. I honestly don’t care if the DS9/B5 thing would hold up in court. I actually think DS9 was a better show then previous Star Treks for the very things it borrowed. It doesn’t change my opinion that there was something vaguely slimey going on. ---
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-star-trek-ds9-rip-off-babylon-5/528856/67 "2010-02-18T21:18:06Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Say what? Er, please explain. B5 was pretty cringeworthy at times, I really couldn’t look at the screen for some of its “finer” moments (most of them involving Ivanova or Sheridan IIRC). But then DS9 was pretty wooden and stilted. There were no frivilous moments like Vir’s wave. It was worth sticking with B5 to be able to remember back to his promise to Mr Morden just at that moment. ---
**Author:** ![JThunder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e95f7d/32.png) [@JThunder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JThunder)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2010, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-star-trek-ds9-rip-off-babylon-5/528856/68 "2010-02-19T02:15:26Z")
> [@thirdname](#): > > I think Dax was a bit better in the face… You’re going to have to be more specific. Jadzia? Ezri? Curzon? ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2020, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-star-trek-ds9-rip-off-babylon-5/528856/69 "2020-02-07T17:17:41Z")
> [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](#): > > Besides the actual “sex” scene **Raguleader** linked to, this also sets up a hilarious payoff at the end of the episode. “Next time, my way” ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2020, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-star-trek-ds9-rip-off-babylon-5/528856/70 "2020-02-07T17:33:42Z")
:rolleyes:This thread appears to be a rip-off of this one [Is This the Smoking Gun Proving Deep Space Nine Ripped Off Babylon 5? | Tor.com](https://www.tor.com/2013/02/26/is-this-the-smoking-gun-proving-deep-space-nine-ripped-off-babylon-5/) ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2020, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-star-trek-ds9-rip-off-babylon-5/528856/71 "2020-02-07T18:44:32Z")
This thread, like B5, has a [Day of the Dead](https://babylon5.fandom.com/wiki/Day_of_the_Dead), where the spirits of the long-departed return to pester the living. ---
**Author:** ![Declan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecae2f/32.png) [@Declan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Declan)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2020, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-star-trek-ds9-rip-off-babylon-5/528856/72 "2020-02-07T20:27:50Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > You all are forgetting the most important question: > > Which Captain grew a beard first? Which Captain had his own Teddy Bear [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-star-trek-ds9-rip-off-babylon-5/528856.md?page=3)