# Does the cancel culture need to extend this far? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 8, 2022, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311 "2022-08-08T15:23:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2022, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/141 "2022-08-09T20:24:29Z")
It’s almost as if “Context is everything, even here.”! ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2022, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/142 "2022-08-09T20:32:30Z")
Accidents happen. Why would speech be immune to this? ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2022, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/143 "2022-08-09T20:33:46Z")
Wouldn’t. But he did not accidentally say “a” word. The account from his boss is he said that word “multiple times”. Once may be an accident. Multiples times is vastly less likely to be so. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2022, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/144 "2022-08-09T20:41:19Z")
It does seem like whenever this hue and cry over cancel culture gets stirred up, once the facts get known, it turns out that the hyperventilating was unwarranted. The actions were more egregious than previously reported, often times the person is a high profile individual who needs to command personal authority and respect. The virtue signalling in denouncing “cancel culture” takes priority over what actually happened, and it always devolves into, “Well, if it happened the way I imagined it, it would be so very terrible.” Then devolves into the inevitable fallacies of “Freedom of speech means that I can say anything I want, and no one can say anything in response.” and “They can say it, why can’t I?” or calling disapproval of speech a form of violence. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2022, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/145 "2022-08-09T21:06:11Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > often times the person is a high profile individual who needs to command personal authority and respect. This was a man who was responsible for a group of young men, including young black men. He is supposed to be a person guiding and leading these young black men, he has authority over them, will in some way determine their future opportunities, and black parents choose to let him, and the other OU coaches, have that power and influence over their sons. Perhaps angrily saying that word over and over again to a young black man will cause other black families to think twice about sending their sons to OU. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2022, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/146 "2022-08-09T21:50:19Z")
OK fair enough. I thought there was an argument being made that a standard of perfection was somehow attainable, therefore expected. ---
**Author:** ![carnut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnut/32/3531_2.png) [@carnut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnut)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2022, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/147 "2022-08-09T21:55:43Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > So what happens to the player who wrote the word on his iPad? That’s really where my disgust lies. But perhaps the coach decided to use his faux pas to get away from a culture that supports that bigoted outlook. I do think that he shouldn’t have to resign, but it appears he took the initiative. I’m also sure that there are plenty of organizations that would welcome him into their own fold a) because he is woke, and b) because he has a great record behind him. Edit: I read an article that implied he was woke. I do not know the man and cannot speak to it on a personal level. @Chingon ---
**Author:** ![Chingon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chingon/32/17645_2.png) [@Chingon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chingon)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2022, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/148 "2022-08-09T21:57:18Z")
In no universe is Gundy “woke”. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2022, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/149 "2022-08-09T22:36:53Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > But, the whine and cry of, “They can say it, why can’t I?” has been the cornerstone of allowing racist rhetoric. I posit that it is _that_ attitude that perpetuates the overall use in society. I personally don’t agree with the argument “They can say it, why can’t I?” I believe that it’s a word that we should try to eleminate from society. It is degrading, it was when it was originated, and it is now, regardless of who uses it. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2022, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/150 "2022-08-09T23:01:32Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > … how does this individual’s resignation further the fight against racism? Maybe would have been a better thread title. ---
**Author:** ![Mavis\_Topholese](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7feea3/32.png) [@Mavis\_Topholese](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mavis_Topholese)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2022, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/151 "2022-08-09T23:02:46Z")
I find it hard to work up sympathy for a tremendously overpaid doofus who is too stupid to keep the n-word out of his overpaid mouth. Resigning is likely the smartest thing he ever did. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2022, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/152 "2022-08-10T01:02:08Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Of course it is. Not only is it an implicitly violent threat constraining one’s individual liberty I genuinely don’t get what the heck you’re talking about, here; I think you’re wrong, but I don’t even get what you think the right answer _is._ Imagine that Guy A uses his, uh, individual liberty to, y’know, say something. And imagine that Guy B uses his individual liberty to say he thinks Guy A should lose his job. And imagine that Guy C uses his individual liberty to say, _hey, Guy A: remember how you and I had one of those individual-liberty meeting-of-the-minds things when we entered into a contract, such that I’ve been paying you to do stuff but can now end your employment?_ And imagine Guy A uses his individual liberty to say _aw, you don’t need to fire me; I quit._ Do you think someone in that arrangement is making an implicitly violent threat? Do you think someone’s individual liberty was constrained? If so: who? (I guess we could postulate some Guy D who makes an implicitly violent threat to constrain Guy C’s individual liberty: forcing him to keep Guy A on. And I guess we could postulate some Guy E who makes an implicitly violent threat to constrain Guy B’s individual liberty: forcing him to keep quiet about Guy A. And I guess we could even postulate some Guy F who makes an implicitly violent threat to constrain Guy A’s individual liberty — and, if that’s your point, then my question remains: _What The F Are You Talking About?_) ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2022, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/153 "2022-08-10T01:20:11Z")
Hey, as long as it’s said without context, it’s harmless. (so I hear) Like, hop on a bus, ride around town for a while, intermittently shout the N word (without context, naturally) and things should go just swimmingly! ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2022, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/154 "2022-08-10T03:45:27Z")
Anyone else here ever taught a class with people who dropped their attention and pulled out their phone? It never occurred to me to grab it away and recite the rap lyrics on the screen, or describe the porn, or read the text or whatever. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2022, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/155 "2022-08-10T06:34:01Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Hey, as long as it’s said without context, it’s harmless There is no such thing as a context-free word, I don’t think I’ve seen anyone claim that. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2022, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/156 "2022-08-10T06:40:27Z")
> [@Slithy\_Tove](#): > > Anyone else here ever taught a class with people who dropped their attention and pulled out their phone? It never occurred to me to grab it away and recite the rap lyrics on the screen, or describe the porn, or read the text or whatever That actually happened (or very similar) in my last year of school when a friend of mine was sneaking a read of “Viz” in an English class. (no phones in those days) Teacher caught him, grabbed it and proceeded to read out the relevant strip “Sid the Sexist” complete with all its overt sexual and sexist language. Language that would obviously have had that teacher sacked were they said in a different context. Of course, the teacher thought they would be shaming that lad by reading it all out. It did not have the intended effect. “Teacher reading out the confiscated item to embarrass said kid” won’t be a rare occurence. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2022, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/157 "2022-08-10T18:57:59Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > Teacher caught him, grabbed it and proceeded to read out the relevant strip “Sid the Sexist” complete with all its overt sexual and sexist language. Language that would obviously have had that teacher sacked were they said in a different context. I’d say in that context, there are still some passages that they should avoid. Is it okay to explicitly describe sexual conduct to the class if they are reading it out of a student’s property? Or even if it is “merely” misogynistic. Would you feel the same if, rather than a raunchy manga, it was just straight up Penthouse Forums? They have a choice, and if they _choose_ to do this, then they are still responsible for the words that come out of their mouth. > [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > Of course, the teacher thought they would be shaming that lad by reading it all out. It did not have the intended effect. And that’s the other problem, it’s rarely going to be effective, and essentially, it sounds like your friend tricked the teacher into saying things that they really shouldn’t be saying in front of a class. That teacher probably got mocked and shamed for their inappropriate behavior, the student probably got a high five. > [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > “Teacher reading out the confiscated item to embarrass said kid” won’t be a rare occurence. Teachers should be _more_ careful if they are choosing to read what a student has provided them, not _less_. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2022, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/158 "2022-08-10T20:35:27Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > I’d say in that context, there are still some passages that they should avoid. Is it okay to explicitly describe sexual conduct to the class if they are reading it out of a student’s property? Or even if it is “merely” misogynistic. Would you feel the same if, rather than a raunchy manga, it was just straight up Penthouse Forums? I didn’t feel much about it one way or another, I wasn’t suggesting that what the teacher did was necessarily good, bad or useful. Merely that the uttering of certain words and phrases is treated differently dependent on the context. Had the teacher used any of the same puerile and sexist chat-up lines from the comic _directly_ to a 15 year old female classmate, that would have been treated very differently, and quite right too. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > And that’s the other problem, it’s rarely going to be effective, and essentially, it sounds like your friend tricked the teacher into saying things that they really shouldn’t be saying in front of a class Well of course it was ineffective, 15 year old kids are going to _love_ a teacher doing that, 15 year kids are idiots. But it wasn’t a trick, it absolutely was just a sneaking of a read and getting caught. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > That teacher probably got mocked and shamed for their inappropriate behavior, the student probably got a high five. Well, the UK, mid-80’s equivalent of a high-five yes. But the teacher was just being a teacher. That is the sort of thing they do. Had the teacher tried to make out they were hip, cool and daring by reading out the naughty words then yes, they would have been mocked mercilessly. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > Teachers should be _more_ careful if they are choosing to read what a student has provided them, not _less_. Interestingly, I know that silly notes getting passed around would be intercepted confiscated and _sometimes_ read out. I say sometimes because if it were a personal slight against someone, or an acutely embarrassing love poem then the teachers would often spare the blushes of the writer or the subject. I think that’s an excellent example of suitable care and discretion. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2022, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/159 "2022-08-10T20:47:34Z")
> [@Slithy\_Tove](#): > > Anyone else here ever taught a class with people who dropped their attention and pulled out their phone? It never occurred to me to grab it away and recite the rap lyrics on the screen, or describe the porn, or read the text or whatever. It’s a shaming tactic, which means it’s a shameful tactic. By itself, that’s just a sign of a shitty leader, who leads through humiliation. I can imagine the coach being super irritated at the fucking-around kid, and deciding that he’d get his vengeance by humiliating the kid by reading his screen aloud–and his irritation clouded his judgment to the extent that he read a hateful racist epithet several times without going “fuck I shouldn’t do this.” Without more details, that seems a likely explanation. And if that’s what happened, I agree with his later judgment that he’s not fit to continue at the job. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2022, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311/160 "2022-08-10T20:59:11Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > There is no such thing as a context-free word, I don’t think I’ve seen anyone claim that. Try post number, I’m not even kidding, 88. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cancel-culture-need-to-extend-this-far/969311.md?page=9)