# Does the CIA have a "badass" training program **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 29, 2017, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992 "2017-08-29T04:05:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/21 "2017-08-29T21:40:13Z")
True, but there may be other organizations so secretive that no one even knows of their existence. Or at least no one is able to provide Wikipedia-worthy citations of their existence. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/22 "2017-08-29T23:33:47Z")
I suppose. There’s no way to know, of course. But people tend to notice organizations of people, even if they don’t necessarily know what they’re up to. Everyone who was paying attention knew about all those math Ph.D’s hanging out at Fort Meade decades before the DoD admitted that there was No Such Agency. ---
**Author:** ![outlierrn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/outlierrn/32/3005_2.png) [@outlierrn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outlierrn)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/23 "2017-08-30T00:41:59Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > How secretive could they possibly be if there’s a Wikipedia article about them? I’d suppose that hiding in plain sight was one of the first chapters in the CIA playbook. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2017, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/24 "2017-09-20T03:56:21Z")
> [@TSBG](#): > > What if said analyst needs to have a Jack Ryan moment? YOU CAN’T LEAVE THEM TOTALLY UNPREPARED!!! I have a college friend who’s been a satellite photoanalyst with a certain three-initialed agency for many years, and now and then have kidded him that he’s not nearly as close to becoming President as Ryan was in much less time. Slacker! ---
**Author:** ![Fleetwood](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fleetwood/32/271_2.png) [@Fleetwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fleetwood)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2017, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/25 "2017-09-20T11:00:53Z")
Not sure about the CIA, but the Army seems to have [one](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bD4xwK13lGk). ---
**Author:** ![GiantRat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@GiantRat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GiantRat)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2017, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/26 "2017-09-20T14:29:04Z")
There are plenty of (Agency-reviewed) autobiographies out there that touch on training in the Clandestine Service. You enter as a Clandestine Service Trainee (CST) spend your time at The Farm, where you receive survival and weapons training (in case it’s needed). But most of our operatives are unarmed most of the time… it looks a little fishy to be caught with a weapon on foreign soil (for the same reason that domestic narcotics officers often won’t carry their sidearm in a holster - cops wear holsters; OG’s don’t). A few interesting reads that come to mind include: The Spy Who Came in From the Cold, The American Agent, Master of Disguise, and a bunch of others. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2017, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/27 "2017-09-20T14:42:27Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > SOG-SAD sounds like the villain in a children’s cereal commercial. [Someone else thought so, too.](http://pbfcomics.com/comics/commander-crisp/)😃 ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2017, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/28 "2017-09-20T14:50:45Z")
> [@MichaelEmouse](#): > > Did she mention what those things were? The secret is to tell the CIA that you’re deathly afraid of extra-terrestrials and then see if they bring out a Martian to scare you. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2017, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/29 "2017-09-20T15:10:47Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > How secretive could they possibly be if there’s a Wikipedia article about them? The British Government didn’t even [acknowledge the existence of MI6](http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-29938135) until 1986, even though everyone knew (James Bond had been around since 1953, apart from anything else). ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2017, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/30 "2017-09-20T17:42:46Z")
> [@GiantRat](#): > > There are plenty of (Agency-reviewed) autobiographies out there that touch on training in the Clandestine Service. You enter as a Clandestine Service Trainee (CST) spend your time at The Farm, where you receive survival and weapons training (in case it’s needed). But most of our operatives are unarmed most of the time… it looks a little fishy to be caught with a weapon on foreign soil (for the same reason that domestic narcotics officers often won’t carry their sidearm in a holster - cops wear holsters; OG’s don’t). A few interesting reads that come to mind include: The Spy Who Came in From the Cold, The American Agent, Master of Disguise, and a bunch of others. Wasn’t the sky that came in from the cold about a British officer? And also fiction? ---
**Author:** ![TSBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/77aa72/32.png) [@TSBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TSBG)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2017, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/31 "2017-09-20T21:59:06Z")
“Wasn’t the sky that came in from the cold about a British officer? And also fiction?” Yes and yes, though the author spent a few years with MI6, and based on his other books appears to have developed and maintained a wide network of contacts around the world with some knowledge of clandestine affairs. That said, I’ve read “The Spy Who Came In From The Cold” more than once and I don’t remember much if any super-soldier type training in it. The whole book is about how life as a spy is (mostly) sad, tawdry, and boring. ---
**Author:** ![GiantRat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@GiantRat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GiantRat)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2017, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/32 "2017-09-21T01:28:28Z")
1 > [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > Wasn’t the sky that came in from the cold about a British officer? And also fiction? Yes. My memory failed me on that one, and now I’m trying to remember the actual name of the biography I was thinking of. I might have it in the bookstacks here somewhere, if I haven’t donated it already. My bad, but good catch! ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2017, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/33 "2017-09-21T04:52:37Z")
> [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](#): > > I believe there was some kind of ropes course and something that triggered claustrophobia. Safety measures apparently were in place, because after all these were people with desk jobs. (Most of the time? Allegedly?) > > On the analyst-vs.-field-agent thing above, she said when she was there, everybody who wasn’t some kind of boss was an analyst. By job description. IOW there were no “field agents.” Just “analysts.” Somebody somewhere must have known the difference. And one of my friends insists he was a secret sniper during his enlistment in the late 80s. I knew a former analyst for the CIA. When I asked him about it, he said analyzed things and simply changed the subject. Some people like telling stories. ---
**Author:** ![TSBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/77aa72/32.png) [@TSBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TSBG)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2017, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/34 "2017-09-21T20:27:18Z")
I can’t say for sure, but it’s reasonable to guess that there are analysts in overseas postings who get some version (perhaps milder) of the survival training given in SERE-type courses, or at least the ones journalists get before going into a war zone. IOW training not in how to shoot or ford a river under fire, but what to do if you get kidnapped, or a gun battle erupts around you. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2017, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/35 "2017-09-21T21:14:08Z")
> [@TSBG](#): > > “Wasn’t the sky that came in from the cold about a British officer? And also fiction?” > > Yes and yes, though the author spent a few years with MI6, and based on his other books appears to have developed and maintained a wide network of contacts around the world with some knowledge of clandestine affairs. > > That said, I’ve read “The Spy Who Came In From The Cold” more than once and I don’t remember much if any super-soldier type training in it. The whole book is about how life as a spy is (mostly) sad, tawdry, and boring. The thing about Le Carre’s books is how incredibly mundane and boring (and realistic) he makes spy work sound - but then it is still riveting fiction despite that. ---
**Author:** ![TSBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/77aa72/32.png) [@TSBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TSBG)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2017, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/36 "2017-09-21T22:35:24Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > The thing about Le Carre’s books is how incredibly mundane and boring (and realistic) he makes spy work sound - but then it is still riveting fiction despite that. I once told my wife that Le Carre’s genius was that he could make a meeting of bureaucrats into a tense, page-turning scene. She was not convinced. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2017, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/37 "2017-09-21T23:50:29Z")
If an intelligence operative has to fight for his life, he’s screwed up. ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2017, 5:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/38 "2017-09-22T05:48:10Z")
When I interviewed at the CIA out of college in 1985, they definitely appealed to being able to continue by 5 years in martial arts. BTW, back then, they were the only recruiter that cared about my Mandarin language skills and economics degree. (They also said that if I chose not to follow up on the interview, they would destroy the records. 5 years later as I was getting my MBA, I answered a wall street journal blind add for international careers. Got a call from a gentleman who identified himself as a CIA recruiter. He asked, studiously casually of course, “if you had ever applied to the CIA in the past?”) That said, others that have interviewed said the interviews pitched the opposite. That almost all the black ops folks are recruited from special forces. ---
**Author:** ![SamuelA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@SamuelA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SamuelA)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2017, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/39 "2017-09-22T06:54:39Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > If an intelligence operative has to fight for his life, he’s screwed up. Yep. Intelligence operatives aren’t really “spies”. The real spies are the natives of whichever country we are talking about. These are people who legitimately have access to the documents or information the CIA wants to know about, and who have decided to betray their country for money or perks. The CIA field agents are just there to facilitate a transaction. (money/perks for intel). They don’t need guns or lockpicks or spy cameras, they aren’t going to be breaking in anywhere or ‘neutralizing’ any guards. With that said, it does seem clear that the CIA _can_ resort to this kind of thing. They obviously have a way to covertly kidnap or assassinate people. If they were desperate enough, they obviously could send agents in to a building with records, killing guards if necessary. This just is extremely high risk and not something worth doing unless the stakes are extreme. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2017, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992/40 "2017-09-23T04:04:48Z")
> [@SamuelA](#): > > Yep. Intelligence operatives aren’t really “spies”. The real spies are the natives of whichever country we are talking about. These are people who legitimately have access to the documents or information the CIA wants to know about, and who have decided to betray their country for money or perks… Or, in some cases, because they hate their own government, oppose its policies, or respect the U.S. more. It happens. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-cia-have-a-badass-training-program/794992.md?page=1)