# Does the fact that Michelle Obama is dark skinned really matter to black women? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 15, 2009, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-fact-that-michelle-obama-is-dark-skinned-really-matter-to-black-women/481392 "2009-01-15T05:26:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2009, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-fact-that-michelle-obama-is-dark-skinned-really-matter-to-black-women/481392/41 "2009-01-16T01:21:23Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > Note: **you with the face** doesn’t count, cuz she’s not _really_ black.;). Who’s the one listening to Celtic music and is taking Friday off to show respect for Robert E. Lee? ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Bean](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_bean/32/1760_2.png) [@Green\_Bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Bean)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2009, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-fact-that-michelle-obama-is-dark-skinned-really-matter-to-black-women/481392/42 "2009-01-16T02:03:15Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > I know that folks have gone out and educated themselves on the ‘black experience’. I know they have. I respect that. But the truth is, it is a complex thing, and you can’t really grasp the understanding in a classroom. Are you suggesting that non-blacks can not and should not be professors of and/or teach African American history? :dubious: > [@](#): > > …I find it strange and interesting how many people are really turned on by the idea that black folks are a bunch of self hating, divided self-loathers… Where on earth are you getting this? You say over and over that you don’t know anyone who thinks this way. Therefore the color divide thing is a myth. You dismiss other people’s observations as being anecdotal. But your observation is equally anecdotal. Furthermore, you’re the one trying to prove a negative. Your point has been disproved multiple times. Yet you persist in insisting that it’s all a myth. I dunno. Your logic has apparently flown right out the window on this one. I’m really glad that colorism isn’t a problem, real or perceived, among you and yours. But please don’t think that just because it’s not a problem for you, that it’s not a problem for others. ---
**Author:** ![Auntbeast](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Auntbeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Auntbeast)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2009, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-fact-that-michelle-obama-is-dark-skinned-really-matter-to-black-women/481392/43 "2009-01-16T02:21:26Z")
I’m about as white as white can get, however (looks at her butt) there is evidence of other influences. I will say this, I am thrilled to fucking death that we FINALLY will have a First Lady with an ass. Hot damn! And she dresses fabulously. She doesn’t try to hide it at all. I just love her. Yeah, her hubby ain’t bad, but I really like Michelle…and her butt. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2009, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-fact-that-michelle-obama-is-dark-skinned-really-matter-to-black-women/481392/44 "2009-01-16T04:27:55Z")
> [@Green\_Bean](#): > > Are you suggesting that non-blacks can not and should not be professors of and/or teach African American history? :dubious: I never said this dumb shit. Or ‘suggested’ it either. I’m going to give the rest of your post the same respect due the quoted part. ---
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2009, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-fact-that-michelle-obama-is-dark-skinned-really-matter-to-black-women/481392/45 "2009-01-16T04:57:58Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > I don’t think I have ever read a single black person agree with me on these particular topics on these boards. Maybe I’m crazy, but if I found myself writing a sentence like that, I’d probably conclude that my experience was atypical. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2009, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-fact-that-michelle-obama-is-dark-skinned-really-matter-to-black-women/481392/46 "2009-01-16T05:35:50Z")
> [@furt](#): > > Maybe I’m crazy, but if I found myself writing a sentence like that, I’d probably conclude that my experience was atypical. I assure you, this occurs to me. It breaks my heart. ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Bean](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_bean/32/1760_2.png) [@Green\_Bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Bean)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2009, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-fact-that-michelle-obama-is-dark-skinned-really-matter-to-black-women/481392/47 "2009-01-16T17:39:21Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > I never said this dumb shit. Or ‘suggested’ it either. Then why did you dismiss my comments? I asserted that the dark vs. light issue is widely discussed in academia. Therefore, there is significant historical precedent suggesting that this likely continues to be an issue. This is corroborated by contemporary accounts. You responded: > [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > I know that folks have gone out and educated themselves on the ‘black experience’. I know they have. I respect that. But the truth is, it is a complex thing, and you can’t really grasp the understanding in a classroom. You’re discounting the work of white historians because they haven’t had “the black experience.” Having direct experience with an issue is not necessary to study that issue. Historians don’t report from their own experience. Historians study primary sources and previous work on the subject to form hypotheses and conclusions. In some cases, historians’ own experiences are included in the work, but usually not. If anything, they confine it to the preface or something. Otherwise, it would be essays or memoirs, not history. No white historian that I’ve ever met has ever claimed to grasp “the black experience.”\* That would be asinine. And it’s also entirely irrelevant to the subject at hand. You know, back when I was teaching American History: 1945 - The Present, which naturally included a lot of material on the Civil Rights Movement, etc., I was challenged a few times on what I said by older black students. Their experience didn’t match what I was saying. In every single case, I was able to satisfactorily demonstrate that the one thing didn’t necessarily contradict the other. Their personal experience simply happened to be atypical according to the widely accepted historiography of the period. I always encouraged them to talk about their own experiences and we spent time discussing the factors that might have contributed to the discrepancy. These discussions were some of the most valuable parts of the class. So, **Nzinga** –I have no idea whether this kind of colorism is typical or atypical, but we can clearly see that it’s common in some communities and not in others. What factors do you think might account for this? \*I actually did have one professor who claimed he actually understood the black experience. And the Latino experience. And the Irish experience. And on and on and on. He was an equal-opportunity douchebag. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2009, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-fact-that-michelle-obama-is-dark-skinned-really-matter-to-black-women/481392/48 "2009-01-16T17:48:56Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I think that the idea of a black First Lady is appealing to black women for obvious reasons. I’ve also heard that a lot of black women don’t like to see successful black men marrying white trophy wives. Right, wrong or indifferent, the fact that Barack married black is comforting to some people. It’s not a make or break thing, but seeing an entirely black first family carries an extra feel-good factor for black people. > > Now the _shade_ of skin I don’t think matters much except as a signifier that Michelle is unambiguously a sister. I read the quote more as “he married a black woman instead of a white woman” not the tone of Michelle’s skin. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2009, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-fact-that-michelle-obama-is-dark-skinned-really-matter-to-black-women/481392/49 "2009-01-16T17:57:52Z")
[The science behind it all.](http://snltranscripts.jt.org/76/76rblackperspective.phtml) > [@](#): > > Garrett Morris: [interrupting] Well, I think I understand the problem with the tests. But the fact is that people have been saying that white people are smarter than black for hundreds of years. We’ve only had I.Q. tests for 20 or 30 years. How did the idea of white intellectual superiority originate? > > Julian Bond: That’s an interesting point. My theory is that it’s based on the fact that light-skinned blacks are smarter than dark-skinned blacks. > > Garrett Morris: [not sure he heard that right] Say what? > > Julian Bond: I said I think it might have grown out of the observation that light-skinned blacks are smarter than dark-skinned blacks. > > Garrett Morris: I don’t get it. > > Julian Bond: It’s got nothing to do with having white blood. It’s just that descendants of the lighter-skinned African tribes are more intelligent than the descendants of the darker-skinned tribes. Everybody knows that. > > Garrett Morris: This is the first time I’ve heard of it. > > Julian Bond: Seriously? It was proven a long time ago. > > Garrett Morris: Well, I still don’t quite understand. We’re out of time right now, but perhaps you could come back on the show again and explain it further. > > Julian Bond: There’s very little to explain - it’s just like I told you. > > Garrett Morris: Well, we are out of time. Good night. [to Julian] If you could repeat it just once more… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-fact-that-michelle-obama-is-dark-skinned-really-matter-to-black-women/481392.md?page=2)