# Does the Old Testament count as part of "the Bible"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 29, 2012, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-old-testament-count-as-part-of-the-bible/611089 "2012-01-29T16:51:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![constanze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f9ae1b/32.png) [@constanze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/constanze)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2012, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-old-testament-count-as-part-of-the-bible/611089/61 "2012-02-03T20:54:33Z")
> [@ZenBeam](#): > > Is this generally accepted? Can any other knowledgeable people confirm or deny? My first thought was that “Hebrew Bible” would be more condescending than “Old Testament”, but I’m not one to have much of a clue. I looked at the Wikipedia [Hebrew Bible](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hebrew_Bible) page, but couldn’t really tell. Not a general opinion (it will probably be difficult to get one) - but when the protestant[Kirchentag](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirchentag)meets, there’s one forum for Jewish-Christian dialogue (a seperate one is for the Abrahamic religions = Jewish, Christians, Moslems), and the general usage is “Hebrew Bible” instead of OT by the speakers because of the negative association “Old Testament because it got repealed”. The laypeople, esp. those not knowledgeable in Biblical science, will use OT. Scientists in general probably use either OT out of habit or Tanakh to be more exact. ---
**Author:** ![constanze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f9ae1b/32.png) [@constanze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/constanze)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2012, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-old-testament-count-as-part-of-the-bible/611089/62 "2012-02-03T20:58:52Z")
> [@ZenBeam](#): > > So is the term “Old Testament” condescending or insensitive to Jews or not? What about the term “Hebrew Bible”? Is one worse than the other? > > I guess the reason I’d think “Hebrew Bible” would be worse, is that when Christians refer to the “Old Testament”, they are at least using the words they usually use for a portion of their bible. When they say “Hebrew Bible”, they’re making up a new name for something that already has a name: The Tanakh. When Christians and Jews are talking with each other, “Hebrew Bible = OT” is to make clear the difference to the “Christian Bible = OT+NT”, and show that you are aware that Judaism is a seperate religion. Tanakh is not used normally by Christians because only priests and scientists speak Hebrew. Tanakh is not a word used normally for Christians or non-Jews, but Bible is. So Hebrew Bible is the best compromise for “I know it’s a real religion and not just a remnant from which Christianity came”. ---
**Author:** ![constanze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f9ae1b/32.png) [@constanze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/constanze)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2012, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-old-testament-count-as-part-of-the-bible/611089/63 "2012-02-03T21:00:39Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > At least Hebrew Bible recognizes its ours, not simply a part of the Christian bible. Why they can’t call it the Torah, though, is beyond me. But the Torah is only the first 5 books. When Christians think of the OT, they think of the whole. So Torah would mean leaving out the prophets and other books. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-old-testament-count-as-part-of-the-bible/611089/64 "2012-02-04T01:04:35Z")
> [@constanze](#): > > the Constantine testament My Bible studies are mostly self taught, and I do not know of this. A quick look on Google at best returns people assuming you know what it means and at worst a belief that Constantine wrote the New Testament himself, positing some sort of conspiracy theory. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-old-testament-count-as-part-of-the-bible/611089/65 "2012-02-04T03:55:00Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > My Bible studies are mostly self taught, and I do not know of this. A quick look on Google at best returns people assuming you know what it means and at worst a belief that Constantine wrote the New Testament himself, positing some sort of conspiracy theory. It’s known to English speakers as the [Donation of Constantine](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donation_of_Constantine). It’s a testament as in a will, rather than the essentially unique sense in which it is used to describe God’s covenants. The short version is that the Vatican forged a document purporting to transfer temporal authority over the western Roman Empire from Emperor Constantine to Pope Sylvester and his successors. ---
**Author:** ![constanze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f9ae1b/32.png) [@constanze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/constanze)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2012, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-old-testament-count-as-part-of-the-bible/611089/66 "2012-02-05T16:22:55Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > It’s known to English speakers as the [Donation of Constantine](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donation_of_Constantine). It’s a testament as in a will, rather than the essentially unique sense in which it is used to describe God’s covenants. > > The short version is that the Vatican forged a document purporting to transfer temporal authority over the western Roman Empire from Emperor Constantine to Pope Sylvester and his successors. Yes, thank you, that’s what I meant. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-the-old-testament-count-as-part-of-the-bible/611089.md?page=3)