# Does this happen on Ebay? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 14, 2005, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-this-happen-on-ebay/299350 "2005-04-14T21:00:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Future\_Londonite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9dc877/32.png) [@Future\_Londonite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Future_Londonite)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-this-happen-on-ebay/299350/1 "2005-04-14T21:00:27Z")
Hey guys…sorry for yet another Ebay question. As I was browsing for some art this week, I noticed that the artist I was interested in sold most her stuff to the first and only bidder. Which got me to think - is it possible for a seller to open a new Ebay account, using a new email and artificially increase the price by bidding on his/her own auction? If he/she were to win because the other bidder stopped bidding, he/she can always pretend that money was exchanged… Is this a known practice on Ebay? Does it have a name? And how does Ebay prevent this (if they prevent it at all)? MODS - if this is not the right forum, please move… Thanks all ---
**Author:** ![CynicalGabe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@CynicalGabe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CynicalGabe)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-this-happen-on-ebay/299350/2 "2005-04-14T21:23:56Z")
It is called “shill bidding”, and is strictly forbidden by eBay policy. If you are caught once, you get a warning, more offenses result in indefinite suspension of your account. And yes, they do catch you. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-this-happen-on-ebay/299350/3 "2005-04-14T21:25:52Z")
Yep, ‘shill bidding’ is common enough to be notorious. Often it’s used to push a legitimate bidder to the highest price they’re prepared to pay, rather than simply the minimum necessary to beat the second-highest bid. Ebay dislike it, and publicly say they’re very strict about it, but with something of the size of eBay, it’s hard for them to patrol every listing. However, this is still a minority problem - I’ve never seen anything that remotely resembled such fraudulent behaviour, except when told where to look (sometimes from this board). In the case you mention, it’s possible that only one person was interested! (Although multiple cases of single-bidder sales starts to look suspicious.) ---
**Author:** ![spingears](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ebca7d/32.png) [@spingears](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spingears)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-this-happen-on-ebay/299350/4 "2005-04-14T21:28:04Z")
> [@EuroMDguy](#): > > As I was browsing for some art this week, I noticed that the artist I was interested in sold most her stuff to the first and only bidder. She obviously had no idea as to a sale price. Maybe testing the water? > [@](#): > > Is this a known practice on Ebay? Does it have a name? And how does Ebay prevent this (if they prevent it at all)? A fake bidder is a shill. I think ebay prohibits this practice. If caught you may be barred. ---
**Author:** ![Xema](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9de053/32.png) [@Xema](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xema)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-this-happen-on-ebay/299350/5 "2005-04-14T21:29:12Z")
> [@EuroMDguy](#): > > he/she can always pretend that money was exchanged… It’s worth noting that eBay still collects the listing charges and the sales commission. ---
**Author:** ![Future\_Londonite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9dc877/32.png) [@Future\_Londonite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Future_Londonite)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-this-happen-on-ebay/299350/6 "2005-04-14T22:17:10Z")
> [@Xema](#): > > It’s worth noting that eBay still collects the listing charges and the sales commission. True…but if he/she has multiple auctions in which he/she artificially drives the price up then the gain from the other auctions do offset any fees paid for auctions on which he/she ends up being the highest bidder. Thank you all for answering my question ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2005, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-this-happen-on-ebay/299350/7 "2005-04-15T02:29:36Z")
BTW this practice pre-dates online auctions, in case that wasn’t obvious. Although you hired a stooge to bid since you couldn’t do it yourself. The stooge is the shill. ---
**Author:** ![neutron\_star](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/51bf81/32.png) [@neutron\_star](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/neutron_star)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2005, 8:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-this-happen-on-ebay/299350/8 "2005-04-15T08:31:18Z")
> [@CynicalGabe](#): > > It is called “shill bidding”, and is strictly forbidden by eBay policy. If you are caught once, you get a warning, more offenses result in indefinite suspension of your account. And yes, they do catch you. It’s not just against the rules; it’s also illegal. [Here](http://www.siliconvalley.com/mld/siliconvalley/2627644.htm) is a case from a couple years back where three people were arrested after shill bidding for expensive collectibles on eBay. > [@GorillaMan](#): > > Ebay dislike it, and publicly say they’re very strict about it, but with something of the size of eBay, it’s hard for them to patrol every listing. Not when you’ve got computers doing all the tough work for you. [Here](http://pages.ebay.com/event/robc/) is a live chat transcript from a 2002 talk with the VP of eBay’s Trust & Safety Department, who notes that an automated system is set up to catch shill bidders: > [@Rob Chesnut on eBay](#): > > For the last several months, eBay has been using new technology to proactively search for shill bidding activity. By proactively getting involved before an auction closes, we are able to prevent loss, and educate the seller. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2005, 8:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-this-happen-on-ebay/299350/9 "2005-04-15T08:38:57Z")
That’s tought talk from the VP. But that was three years ago, and it’s the first I’ve ever heard of such a system. Plus, shill bidding doesn’t seem to have dwindled. ---
**Author:** ![neutron\_star](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/51bf81/32.png) [@neutron\_star](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/neutron_star)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2005, 9:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-this-happen-on-ebay/299350/10 "2005-04-15T09:12:02Z")
They don’t seem to brag about it too much - especially recently. A search yields dozens of references to it between 2000 and 2002, however. Maybe it was just a vaporware ploy to scare shillers and placate sellers. Perhaps it was a project that ended up getting scrapped. Then again, maybe they’ve just decided to keep their mouths shut about it for some reason. A more recent article (3/31/05) on [CNET](http://cnet.nytimes.com/4520-10168_7-5834834-1.html) seems to support that last possibility: > [@CNET](#): > > eBay has nifty (but top-secret) software that can quickly tell if someone is shill bidding. ---
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2005, 9:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-this-happen-on-ebay/299350/11 "2005-04-15T09:55:06Z")
Someone I know was letting her b/f use her EBay account to sell some CDs, he got a friend to bump up the price (unwittingly becoming the winning bidder and requiring a resale 😛 ) does EBay do anything to prevent this? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2005, 10:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-this-happen-on-ebay/299350/12 "2005-04-15T10:14:27Z")
The easiest form of shill bidding to spot (from the POV of ebay’s own system) would be when the seller places shill bids to keep elevating the price, until the shill ID wins the auction (by a dollar/pound), then the seller pretends the high bidder backed out and tries to sell to the (genuine)next-highest bidder as a Second Chance Offer. Easy to spot simply by counting the number of second-chance offers a seller makes in auctions that had the same high bidder.