# Does today's unanimous Senate approval of a permanent DST bill mean it's a fait accompli? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 15, 2022, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145 "2022-03-15T23:52:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2022, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/201 "2022-03-19T13:59:08Z")
And again, no, it’s not possible for one person to unilaterally “adjust their schedule”, unless they are retired or something. If you don’t like changing the clocks, fine, lobby to get rid of it. But don’t pretend that the people who like it can just “adjust their schedules”. We all need our schedules to coordinate with the schedules of the people we interact with. ---
**Author:** ![Roger\_That](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roger_that/32/8505_2.png) [@Roger\_That](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roger_That)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2022, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/202 "2022-03-19T14:11:54Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > We all need our schedules to coordinate with the schedules of the people we interact with. You mean exactly as people used to before someone in your grandpa’s generation invented this stupid idea? ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2022, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/203 "2022-03-19T14:35:47Z")
> [@flurb](#): > > Now that the issue is on everyone’s radar, I think it’s unlikely that this will pass the House. It’s always easier to kill bills than move them. I’m having doubts that it will easily pass the House now. The Senate thing took everyone by surprise but the initial reactions in the media were very positive. Now there is a ton of pushback. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2022, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/204 "2022-03-19T14:42:17Z")
> [@iamthewalrus\_3](#): > > It is interesting to me that the disagreement over this policy is between people who think that the _time change_ is more disruptive than the _schedule/sun misalignment_ , and people who think the opposite. This overlooks the major axis of contention, which is believing the schedule is misaligned toward excessive evening sun vs. excessive morning sun. I hate changing my clocks, _and_ I prefer dark mornings with light evenings, so I am thoroughly in favor of this legislation _as an incremental approach_. Of course, the bulletproof long-term solution is for the entire planet to change to 24-hour UTC. Then municipalities can legislate solar office hours according to longitude and prevailing social habits. People will easily learn to associate 11:00 with “morning commute”, just as half the planet associates summer with “January”. While we’re on the subject, no more leap seconds, leap days, or leap years. We’re a modern society, we have many ways to figure out spring planting without a calendar. Let that sucker drift. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2022, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/205 "2022-03-19T14:50:26Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > We’re a modern society, we have many ways to figure out spring planting without a calendar. Let that sucker drift. Which is good, since the seasons are changing in many places, and even ordinary weather fluctuations impact when it’s best to plant. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2022, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/206 "2022-03-19T14:53:25Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > Which is good, since the seasons are changing in many places, and even ordinary weather fluctuations impact when it’s best to plant. Right, where I live “January” no longer means “winter weather”, it means “roll the dice.” Other than tradition and literary associations, there’s no reason the calendar can’t drift. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2022, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/207 "2022-03-19T15:25:55Z")
**Modnote** : You seem to be making this far too personal. Please dial it back. Several other posts also. > [@Roger\_That](#): > > Go ahead. Adjust your schedule. Leave me the fuck alone. Thank you. This is a strangely and overly strong reply. ---
**Author:** ![peccavi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peccavi/32/388_2.png) [@peccavi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peccavi)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2022, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/208 "2022-03-19T18:33:05Z")
> [@flurb](#): > > Now that the issue is on everyone’s radar, I think it’s unlikely that this will pass the House. It’s always easier to kill bills than move them. Unless we start a convoy of trucks to the capital…the Permanent Daylight Savings Time (PDST) convoy. Seriously, I think the Internet of Things (IoT) is going to bring an interesting twist to this debate. I used to spend the morning of the time change adjusting all the clocks in my house and vehicles. This year, I adjusted two clock, and old clock radio/alarm that I still use and an older clock on a shelf that is more decorative than anything else. All my other clocks in my car and house are wirelessly connected and adjust themselves. Once IoT is ubiquitous (it’s coming), the solution of making a tiny adjustment each night becomes not only possible, but straightforward. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2022, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/209 "2022-03-19T19:21:21Z")
> [@peccavi](#): > > Once IoT is ubiquitous (it’s coming), the solution of making a tiny adjustment each night becomes not only possible, but straightforward. I like that idea, but it will make every antique analog clock, from your grandpa’s pocket watch all the way up to Big Ben, obsolete…or, at least, very labor intensive. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2022, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/210 "2022-03-19T19:43:27Z")
I’m dubious about IoT becoming ubiquitous. Once it becomes common enough for the hackers to really start having fun with it, I think much of it’s going to start becoming rare again. Also, of course, there’s the Plain People; and the people with terrible internet connections. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2022, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/211 "2022-03-19T21:16:45Z")
Certainly, they’re not going to be able to do it the way the Senate did – i.e. no hearings, no committee vote, no amendments, etc. There’s too many people paying attention now. And floor time for a bill is a precious thing – just trying to get something like this scheduled before the end of the year would be a challenge. ---
**Author:** ![Tripler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripler/32/21807_2.png) [@Tripler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tripler)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2022, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/212 "2022-03-20T13:01:18Z")
I am all for “pick one frickin’ standard and go with it.” I regularly have teleconferences with other people in different time zones, and the whole Daylight Savings Time adjustment causes confusion even in the ‘normal’ calculations. I’d happily go with UTC (aka ‘Zulu Time’), just like astronomers, aviators, sailors, etc. do, but I’ll do one better: let’s go with _ **Stardate** _. It’ll work for Kirk and Picard, and we gotta start _somewhere_. Tripler A lot less future space-train crashes, on a unified Stardate plan. ---
**Author:** ![XOldiesJock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/ec9cab/32.png) [@XOldiesJock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XOldiesJock)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2022, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/213 "2022-03-20T14:20:46Z")
I’ve read that a number of Senators didn’t even know or understand what they were voting for. Not surprising really. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2022, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/214 "2022-03-20T14:29:17Z")
> [@XOldiesJock](#): > > I’ve read that a number of Senators didn’t even know or understand what they were voting for. Not surprising really. - You mean they were in the dark? Guffaw. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2022, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/215 "2022-03-20T14:30:52Z")
It’s not that, it’s that they didn’t even know it had come up for a vote. The way “unanimous” votes work in the Senate is that if someone calls for a bill to be approved unanimously, they wait a little to see if anyone objects, and if no one speaks up, it passes. Most of the stuff passed unanimously is extremely uninteresting. I gather it was a bit of a violation of their “gentleman’s agreement” that an interesting bill even got submitted for unanimous approval. So this is an example of the extreme dysfunction of our Senate right now, not of actual agreement. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2022, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/216 "2022-03-20T14:34:49Z")
> [@Lord\_Feldon](#): > > They didn’t 100% agree, there just weren’t 1% who were informed and/or bothered enough to come to the chamber to _dis_ agree, which would have paused it (maybe fatally). The minority whip, someone who’s probably supposed to know all of the business before the Senate, [didn’t know](https://twitter.com/igorbobic/status/1503800344735850509) it had passed until a reporter told him (though he supported it). I have to look up the rules of the Senate but yeah, IIRC if nobody who cares enough is around to object to cloture, and when asked “all in favor…all against” nobody challenges the quorum(\*) or demands a counted vote, it goes through “by unanimous consent”. ( \* Quorum is assumed continued from the last vote or roll call, not reestablished after every break in works. I bet this was one of those sessions where there is just a nominal rump body remaining on chamber, just blowing through ostensible “routine” or “housekeeping” items. ) The Whip staff have standing lists of what things to raise any of the Senate’s apparently endless stock of procedural stops about, but it seems seems this one flew in under the radar. ---
**Author:** ![XOldiesJock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/ec9cab/32.png) [@XOldiesJock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XOldiesJock)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2022, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/217 "2022-03-20T14:45:53Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > _So this is an example of the extreme dysfunction of our Senate right now, not of actual agreement._ You are so right. Thanks for clarifying how this came to be. ---
**Author:** ![Honolulu\_Lulu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/87869e/32.png) [@Honolulu\_Lulu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honolulu_Lulu)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2022, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/218 "2022-03-20T15:02:17Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > While we’re on the subject, no more leap seconds, leap days, or leap years. We’re a modern society, we have many ways to figure out spring planting without a calendar. Let that sucker drift. Right now, GMT and UTC differ by 0.1 seconds. A GMT second is based on the earth’s current rotation speed, which, in general, is slowing down due to tidal drag caused by the moon. A UTC second was based on the earth’s rotation speed in 1900 and doesn’t change. Leap seconds keeps the two times within 0.7 seconds. Unless you have your own atomic clock, how do you even know when leap seconds occur? If pope Gregory had eliminated leap years, today’s date would be about June10th ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2022, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/219 "2022-03-20T15:23:02Z")
> [@Honolulu\_Lulu](#): > > Unless you have your own atomic clock, how do you even know when leap seconds occur? People who work with granular time (software engineers) have to account for all time differences in their programming and testing. Additionally, if one is looking at log files of periodic events, a leap second is an obvious outlier. But that is of minor importance. The important reason is to eliminate the cost of society of having to muck around with different standards of timekeeping. You personally might not see the cost of doing that, but you can be assured that it manifests in the prices of goods and services, plus the loss of efficiency when errors happen. > [@Honolulu\_Lulu](#): > > If pope Gregory had eliminated leap years, today’s date would be about June10th This is entirely irrelevant and unimportant. The only reason to care about this is if you strongly feel that March should be associated with a certain season. But there’s no reason that has to matter. The only function of March is to let us know that it’s been roughly a year since whatever happened last March. It’s been 500 years since March would drift to June, and this is more than enough time for people to get accustomed to it. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2022, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/220 "2022-03-20T15:45:36Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > Most of the stuff passed unanimously is extremely uninteresting. I gather it was a bit of a violation of their “gentleman’s agreement” that an interesting bill even got submitted for unanimous approval. I think this is right. Theoretically, unanimous consent motions are very powerful – you could literally do anything in the Senate if you get unanimous consent for it. But because practically there would always be an objection to anything controversial, they’re only used for completely noncontroversial bills and resolutions or routine housekeeping motions. Rubio’s apparently getting some shit over this, but to be fair every Senate office was alerted ahead of time that this would come up for unanimous consent and had the opportunity to register an objection. The likely outcome is that offices will start scrutinizing unanimous consent requests more closely, which will only gum up the works even more in a Senate that already moves at a snail’s pace. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145.md?page=12)