# Does today's unanimous Senate approval of a permanent DST bill mean it's a fait accompli? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 15, 2022, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145 "2022-03-15T23:52:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2022, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/241 "2022-03-21T22:42:47Z")
> [@gman32141](#): > > Why not normal time? Because standard time effing sucks. Is we are going to do away with shifting then it’s standard time that needs to go. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2022, 11:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/242 "2022-03-22T11:03:55Z")
> [@gman32141](#): > > Why not normal time? The time we currently use eight of the twelve months of the year? Sure, makes sense to me. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2022, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/243 "2022-03-22T12:49:41Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Because standard time effing sucks. Is it standard time that effing sucks, or is it having relatively little daylight during the 24-hour period? Because I think a lot of people (not necessarily accusing you) who _think_ they love DST or hate standard time really just hate winter and cold and darkness, and that’s not something we can change by changing the clocks. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2022, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/244 "2022-03-22T14:39:44Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > I think a lot of people (not necessarily accusing you) who _think_ they love DST or hate standard time really just hate winter and cold and darkness, and that’s not something we can change by changing the clocks. Good point – the notion for many people seems to be _“I want **some** disposable time **after working hours** to **not** be in the dark”_. Well, past some latitude that’s hard to manage in winter at the NW edges of our existing time zones, if the workday stays at 8 hours. To be fair, at the opposite end of the calendar I can imagine DST fans would also be a bit horrified about Standard-time-only meaning in summer it is full on daylight out before 0430. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2022, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/245 "2022-03-22T14:46:45Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Is it standard time that effing sucks, or is it having relatively little daylight during the 24-hour period? Of course, having less sunlight during the day in winter _also_ sucks, but standard time makes things worse by wasting daylight hours early in the day. That means that standard time makes _summer_ worse by having too much daylight before 7 a.m. (disturbing my sleep) instead of later in the day (when it’s useful). So, currently, daylight time _does_ actually solve a problem by changing the clocks during summertime. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2022, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/246 "2022-03-22T15:06:26Z")
Clearly the solution is we all move to totally enclosed structures so we can directly control the day/night cycle. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2022, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/247 "2022-03-22T15:18:05Z")
That’s the thing: this is a no-win situation. No matter what of the three solutions you choose: permanent DST, ST, or seasonal clock-switching, you’re gonna irk some significant percentage of the population. Right now, given the polls, it seems switching to DST is going to irk the fewest amount of people in the immediate term (before all the ramifications of the switch are stabilized), but even that is just the preference of a plurality and not majority of Americans. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2022, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/248 "2022-03-22T15:58:58Z")
Exactly. I have never in my life had a problem with switching twice a year. It just doesn’t bother me. At all. And I find all the attempts to change to something different inferior and annoying. So my personal vote would be to tell everybody agitating for change to feck off and leave us alone. _I don’t care_ what you think about the time change. _I don’t care_ that you can’t handle switching. Boo-hoo. YMMV. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2022, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/249 "2022-03-22T18:00:02Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > Clearly the solution is we all move to totally enclosed structures so we can directly control the day/night cycle. Clearly we need to alter the axial tilt of the earth. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2022, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/250 "2022-03-22T18:05:34Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > Clearly we need to alter the axial tilt of the earth. If we could do that, we can also slow the rotation to 25 hours/day. Then everyone gets their extra hour and we can make it be in the evening. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2022, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/251 "2022-03-22T18:14:06Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > Clearly we need to alter the axial tilt of the earth. > [@dtilque](#): > > If we could do that, we can also slow the rotation to 25 hours/day. Then everyone gets their extra hour and we can make it be in the evening. Ok, then let’s alter the axial tilt of Mars and move there, and we’d only have to slow the rotation by 20 minutes. Lot less work, especially in the reduced gravity! ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2022, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/252 "2022-03-22T18:25:37Z")
> [@dtilque](#): > > If we could do that, we can also slow the rotation to 25 hours/day. Then everyone gets their extra hour and we can make it be in the evening. Nooo! We need that extra hour to be in the early morning, so I can use it to get more sleep! 😝 ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2022, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/253 "2022-03-23T18:29:44Z")
Among the comments on this Buzzfeed [item](https://buzzfeed.com/sarahmimms/daylight-saving-time-permanent-congress), at least one person in British Columbia wants permanent DST. Go figure. (Search for wasteoftime149 if you want to read their comment.) ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2022, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/254 "2022-04-10T18:59:53Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > If the sun rises too early for you in July, can’t you just pull your blinds? I have never, ever seen blinds that will effectively block out daylight, though blackout curtains do work for us. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2022, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/255 "2022-04-10T19:37:11Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > I hate the idea of having the sun not rise till 8:35 during the first week of January This reminds me of something fairly obvious, but I never considered it until I started googling for news stories on this: your longitude within a time zone can have a huge effect on your local sunrise and sunset times, particularly if you are near the western edge of your zone. This sometimes leads to startling results like the following: Sunrise times for January 7, if permanent DST is adopted: Atlanta, 33N 84W : 8:42 Montreal, 45N 73W: 8:33 Eugene,OR, 44N 123W: 8:47 Of course, the day **length** on any given day is determined solely by latitude, so Atlanta will still have about an hour more of daylight on that day. But it’s surprising to see that 10° of longitude can have as much effect as 10° latitude. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2022, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/256 "2022-04-10T19:44:23Z")
Yes, I’ve noticed that difference when I’ve been in Ottawa on business in the winter. The sunset was much earlier than I was used to in Saskatchewan, because of Ottawa’s location in the Eastern time zone by longitude. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2022, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/257 "2022-04-10T20:52:54Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > I’m guessing people would rather have more daylight in the evening. But what’s the point if you have cold winters? It’s not like you’re going to be out grilling on the back deck, or throwing a Frisbee in the park. It’s cold! ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2022, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/258 "2022-04-10T23:16:09Z")
> [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > It’s not like you’re going to be out grilling on the back deck I use my grill year round, and sometimes get criticised by Clan Piper if the burgers are too burnt - I can’t always see when it’s getting dark. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2022, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/259 "2022-04-11T01:16:39Z")
> [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > But what’s the point if you have cold winters? It’s not like you’re going to be out grilling on the back deck, or throwing a Frisbee in the park. It’s cold! This sounds a lot like you’ve never gotten home after dark and needed clear the snow that fell in the afternoon by flashlight. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2022, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145/260 "2022-04-11T02:57:06Z")
Look y’all, our ancestors blew _that_ when they decided to move out of our pleasant home soil in the East African Rift. We weren’t shoveling snow in either dark or daylight there, were we? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-todays-unanimous-senate-approval-of-a-permanent-dst-bill-mean-its-a-fait-accompli/961145.md?page=14)