# Does Trump calling Warren Pocahontas, make it OK to call him Adolph Drumpf? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 29, 2016, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008 "2016-05-29T16:44:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/141 "2016-06-01T16:30:19Z")
As I recall, the question arose as to her claiming Native heritage in order to secure advantage in relation to “diversity” of faculty appointments, on the presumption that her academic creds were not adequate to the task. From what I’ve read, it would seem that Harvard may have used her to “puff up” a somewhat paltry commitment to diversity. However, this was more or less “after the fact”. Myself, I attribute her advancement to a combination of intelligence and an overpowering sexual magnetism. But maybe that’s just me. Probably. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/142 "2016-06-01T16:35:33Z")
> [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](#): > > Has it ever been to anyone’s political advantage to be, or claim to be, of Native American ancestry? Will Rogers, perhaps, though as a rodeo clown and comedian, he did not lower himself to politics. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/143 "2016-06-01T16:38:21Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Try harder. Don’t encourage him. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/144 "2016-06-01T17:07:26Z")
> [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](#): > > Has it ever been to anyone’s political advantage to be, or claim to be, of Native American ancestry? The claim against her isn’t that she obtained some “political advantage”, but that she gained some “career advantage” at Harvard. I’m sure that some NAs have benefited from Affirmative Action over the years. But again, there is no evidence that Warren used her alleged NA ancestry to gain a career advantage. And as I noted earlier, there is no evidence she would even need to-- her resume is about as solid as it gets. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/145 "2016-06-01T19:15:51Z")
As I recall, the whole thing derives from a Harvard functionary who was tasked with making Harvard’s lily-white image appear more diverse. Said drone heard about her ancestry in passing, and included her in a roster of “diversity”. It was a minor kerfuffle at the time, of vast insignificance, but was resurrected during the Warren/Brown Massacre as a means to embarrass her. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/146 "2016-06-01T19:30:11Z")
> [@Pylesos](#): > > To be honest with you, I haven’t looked into whether Elizabeth Warren falsely claimed to be a Native American to “secure career advantage”…Is it possible she did it for that or some other purpose? Is it possible she didn’t do that at all? ---
**Author:** ![Pylesos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9fc348/32.png) [@Pylesos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pylesos)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/147 "2016-06-01T19:56:15Z")
> [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](#): > > Has it ever been to anyone’s political advantage to be, or claim to be, of Native American ancestry? Good question, either Elizabeth tried to gain some sort of an advantage, has been lying just for the sheer fun of it, or is delusional. Either way, getting a parental scolding from, quite likely, future US President, should sober her up and prevent her silly fantasies from rearing their ugly heads again. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/148 "2016-06-01T19:59:10Z")
> [@Pylesos](#): > > Good question, either Elizabeth tried to gain some sort of an advantage, has been lying just for the sheer fun of it, or is delusional. Is that an exhaustive list or are there other options? ---
**Author:** ![Pylesos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9fc348/32.png) [@Pylesos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pylesos)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/149 "2016-06-01T20:00:19Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Is that an exhaustive list or are there other options? There’re others. ---
**Author:** ![vd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b19c9b/32.png) [@vd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vd)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/150 "2016-06-01T20:18:54Z")
> [@Pylesos](#): > > There’re others. The evidence pretty much points to: 1. It was accepted in family lore that she had NA heritage. 2. She thought that was cool, so checked it off / mentioned it from time to time. 3. Higher scrutiny cast doubt on the family lore, but nothing has been proven one way or another. 4. Since then, she doesn’t push it. What’s the problem? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/151 "2016-06-01T20:20:17Z")
> [@Pylesos](#): > > There’re others. I can offhand think of a suggestion I find more plausible than any of your proposed three, though I’ll certainly consider withdrawing or modifying that assessment if presented with evidence that I should do so. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/152 "2016-06-01T20:27:29Z")
> [@vd](#): > > What’s the problem? She’s a brilliant, influential, highly-educated, female, well-respected Democrat. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/153 "2016-06-01T20:51:08Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > As I recall, the whole thing derives from a Harvard functionary who was tasked with making Harvard’s lily-white image appear more diverse. Said drone heard about her ancestry in passing, and included her in a roster of “diversity”. It was a minor kerfuffle at the time, of vast insignificance, but was resurrected during the Warren/Brown Massacre as a means to embarrass her. Not quite. From the article **Colibri** linked to: > [@](#): > > Warren, who graduated from the University of Houston in 1970 and got her law degree from Rutgers University in 1976, did not seek to take advantage of affirmative action policies during her education, according documents obtained by the Associated Press and The Boston Globe. On the application to Rutgers Law School she was asked, "Are you interested in applying for admission under the Program for Minority Group Students?‘’ “No,” she replied. > > While a teacher at the University of Texas, she listed herself as “white.” But between 1986 and 1995, she listed herself as a minority in the Association of American Law Schools Directory of Faculty; the University of Pennsylvania in a 2005 “minority equity report” also listed her as one of the minority professors who had taught at its law school. It wasn’t just something the drone heard “in passing”, it was what the drone read in a document in which Warren listed herself as Native American. Perhaps EW never thought she’d be running for public office, but it seems like an odd thing for a “brilliant lawyer” to do. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/154 "2016-06-01T21:32:56Z")
Sounds like “In passing” to me. The Association of American Law Schools clearly had some sort of form which she or an admin filled out. It would be interesting to see the wording of that questionaire. I’m guessing that a high powered law professor (which is what Warren was: she authored a number of seminal articles) wouldn’t track this sort of stuff too closely. At every juncture when she could have taken advantage of her alleged NA heritage, she passed it over. She isn’t a career politician. Indeed, she would have never run for public office if the elected Republican finance industry representatives had not blocked her appointment to the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/155 "2016-06-01T21:53:16Z")
“Heard in passing” sound like you overheard something at a cocktail party. Part of the drone’s job was specifically to know what the diversity of the staff looked like. I saw a link a while back to what the form looked like that was filled out, but it was simple enough. Just one page with a list of 5 or so ethnicities and you checked the box you thought best applied to you. I’ll see if I can relocate it. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/156 "2016-06-01T22:12:26Z")
Can’t find it, but [here is the Harvard Crimson article from 1996](http://www.thecrimson.com/article/1996/10/22/survey-diversity-lacking-at-hls-pa/) that people often refer to: > [@](#): > > “The fact that there never have been Asian Americans, Native Americans, gays, lesbians, Latinos, Latinas and women of color [on the faculty] is a subject of major concern,” said Wilkins, who is black. > > Of 71 current Law School professors and assistant professors, 11 are women, five are black, one is Native American and one is Hispanic, said Mike Chmura, spokesperson for the Law School. > > Although the conventional wisdom among students and faculty is that the Law School faculty includes no minority women, Chmura said Professor of Law Elizabeth Warren is Native American. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/157 "2016-06-01T22:23:42Z")
Not exactly a smoking gun. More like a slightly warm slingshot, to coin a phrase. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/158 "2016-06-01T23:08:43Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > “Heard in passing” sound like you overheard something at a cocktail party. Part of the drone’s job was specifically to know what the diversity of the staff looked like. I saw a link a while back to what the form looked like that was filled out, but it was simple enough. Just one page with a list of 5 or so ethnicities and you checked the box you thought best applied to you. I’ll see if I can relocate it. Thanks for checking. A description of the current form is in this link and it sounds like what you say, FWIW. [Faculty Appointments Register | Association of American Law Schools](http://www.aals.org/services/faculty-recruitment-services/far/) As I perceive it, a form was filled out in 1985 which nobody cared about. Her alleged ethnicity was mentioned in a student newspaper in 1996. Shortly afterwards, her ethnic category was adjusted so that the 1996 edition of the AALS directory no longer listed her as Native American. I’m a little surprised she took the effort to correct the record: it’s not like this stuff mattered to her professionally at the time. Except insofar as it permitted Harvard to give a lame defense of their record on diversity. I really don’t think this reflects poorly on her legal savvy. It does underline the improbability of her political career back in 1985. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/159 "2016-06-01T23:15:47Z")
Scots/Irish and Cherokee ought to have its own check box. Just sayin’, is all. > [@](#): > > …I’m a little surprised she took the effort to correct the record… Mind a quibble? Do we know that _she_ changed it, was that her decision to make? ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008/160 "2016-06-02T00:24:06Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Mind a quibble? Do we know that _she_ changed it, was that her decision to make? Since we’re talking about a directory, it stands to reason that she could change it. Whether she did change it is strictly speaking unknown. Did she even fill out the form herself in 1985? Beats me. I’m guessing she filled out both forms and didn’t spend too much time thinking about it. Mainly because they didn’t affect her one way or another. I also assert that “Not thinking about it”, was the correct decision at the time. Hell, it could have been an uncorrected transcription error in 1985. Or the form could have looked different and permitted multiple check marks. Or it was filled in by an admin somewhere. John: Let me know if any of the above conflicts with your impressions of the form you saw. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-calling-warren-pocahontas-make-it-ok-to-call-him-adolph-drumpf/756008.md?page=9)