# Does Trump want to undermine the role of the press? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 19, 2018, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796 "2018-11-19T15:21:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/21 "2018-11-19T18:29:41Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Acosta chose to debate/argue with his interview. It was a Whitehouse press conference. No one cares what Acosta thinks. The public wants to know the views of the person being interviewed. Acosta said this, or Acosta said that, is not supposed to the news story. It’s not the “all about Acosta, and when will he get his own show” press conference. When asking about the illegal alien invasion of Mexico, people want to know what the President thinks. The reporter should be transparent to the actual story. Even CNNSUX debaters/reporters. It’s kind of cute how you think these are real rules and actual facts. > [@doorhinge](#): > > Trump is, and always has been, a counter-puncher. The media is not used to a popular President treating them the same way that they treat him. IME this is demonstrably untrue: I have never once seen or heard of Trump researching a reporter’s past words on a subject and then questioning them about what they said. Also: why do you think a question should be answered with a counter-question and why do you call them “punches”? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/22 "2018-11-19T18:30:51Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Trump is, and always has been, a counter-puncher. The media is not used to a popular President treating them the same way that they treat him. You are confusing “counter-punch” with “sucker-punch”. ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/23 "2018-11-19T18:36:21Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > The media is not used to a popular President treating them the same way that they treat him. 1. That’s not surprising, and they’re not dealing with a popular president now. ([52.9% negative, 42.6% positive](https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/trump-approval-ratings/?ex_cid=rrpromo) at time of post.) 2. The President works for us; the press–who are part of “us”–don’t work for him. When an employee lies repeatedly to their supervisors, it’s time for some tough questions. And this is one hella mendacious employee. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/24 "2018-11-19T19:30:13Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Can you point out a reporter in the White House press corps that is “doing it right” and getting answers from Trump? If not, then I suspect it is questions and not the supposed attitude of those questioning him that bother you. Suspect away. Do you suspect the same of that Atlantic article I linked? ---
**Author:** ![Covfefe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ee7513/32.png) [@Covfefe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Covfefe)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/25 "2018-11-19T19:57:49Z")
We’ve known the answer to this for over 2 years. The good news is things haven’t worsened/escalated much in that time, other than Huckabee-Sanders displaying a significantly more toxic attitude toward a free press than Spicer did. The bad news is the passage of 2 years makes the corrosiveness of lying and calling the media the enemy of the people more normalized; and it can and will turn into something far worse if Trump finds himself fenced in by a scandal. I don’t sense the Acosta situation is going to matter in the big picture unless it begets a trend that happens to others. The basics of the conflict can’t be that aberrant from quarrels other presidents have had with guys who push limits. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/26 "2018-11-19T20:08:26Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Suspect away. Do you suspect the same of that Atlantic article I linked? Weak deflection is weak…but not unexpected. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/27 "2018-11-19T20:21:43Z")
was he counter punching when he used to call the NYC media pretending to be someone else and then praised himself? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/28 "2018-11-19T20:26:09Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > was he counter punching when he used to call the NYC media pretending to be someone else and then praised himself? My first thought on seeing **doorhinge** ’s nonsense was, “Who was he counter-punching when he called for the execution of five innocent people in the Central Park Five case?” But your question is perhaps better! ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/29 "2018-11-19T20:29:45Z")
Trump wants to undermine the role of the press when they point out that he is bullshitting, which is their job. He wants to praise the role of the press when they suck his dick, like Hannity. It’s that simple. > [@Czarcasm](#): > > You are confusing “counter-punch” with “sucker-punch”. Or rather, **doorhinge** is just drinking the Koolaid of Trump’s bullshit persona. Lying like a five-year-old with his hand in the cookie jar is not a “counter-punch.” The adults don’t buy it, and he throws a temper tantrum. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/30 "2018-11-19T20:43:35Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Weak deflection is weak…but not unexpected. You’re the one deflecting. You refuse to endorse the posturing style of journalism, in fact I have no idea if you think that it is or not. I’m not a press corp fanboy. I don’t have a favorite asker of questions. Why should I worry about disproving your sneaky suspicion that I’m really a Trump lover in disguise? ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/31 "2018-11-19T20:48:28Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Trump is, and always has been, a counter-puncher. **doorhinge** is right. Why, Trump says so himself, in this 2016 interview with Megyn Kelly! [Donald Trump explains being a ‘counter-puncher’](https://video.foxnews.com/v/4914523692001/?#sp=show-clips) (Although, I listened to the whole interview, and I don’t believe he ever used the term ‘counter-puncher’. But that’s what the headline says.) ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/32 "2018-11-19T20:49:00Z")
No, not even close to that. C’mon, dear USAians, try harder for the “Trump is a dictator!!” thingy. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/33 "2018-11-19T20:52:32Z")
When someone lies, the time to address the lie is right then and there. And the reason why Acosta didn’t ask a question is because Trump never gave him the opportunity to. All questions must, necessarily, be based on premises. Honest questions are based on true premises. If Acosta was asking a question based on the true premise that the “caravan” is not an invasion, but the person he is asking the question of does not accept that true premise, then it is necessary to first establish the truth of the premise. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/34 "2018-11-19T20:54:17Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > No, not even close to that. C’mon, dear USAians, try harder for the “Trump is a dictator!!” thingy. _That_ was certainly out of left field. 😕 Did you mean to post this in some other thread? ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/35 "2018-11-19T20:56:11Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > When someone lies, the time to address the lie is right then and there. > > And the reason why Acosta didn’t ask a question is because Trump never gave him the opportunity to. All questions must, necessarily, be based on premises. Honest questions are based on true premises. If Acosta was asking a question based on the true premise that the “caravan” is not an invasion, but the person he is asking the question of does not accept that true premise, then it is necessary to first establish the truth of the premise. Ok, what do you imagine the real question was going to be after Acosta finally browbeat Trump into accepting the truth of his premise? How long should the rest of the room wait? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/36 "2018-11-19T20:58:28Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Ok, what do you imagine the real question was going to be after Acosta finally browbeat Trump into accepting the truth of his premise? Poor, poor put-upon Trump. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/37 "2018-11-19T21:01:24Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > The “question” that caused the brouhaha was basically “just admit the caravan isn’t an invasion!”. This is an unfortunate test case. Not really. Here’s his question as he probably had it written down, with the president’s interruptions and insults removed: > [@](#): > > Thank you, Mr. President. I wanted to challenge you on one of the statements that you made in the tail end of the campaign in the midterms, that this . . . caravan was an “invasion.” As you know, Mr. President . . . the caravan was not an invasion. It’s a group of migrants moving up from Central America towards the border with the U.S. > . . . Why did you characterize it as such? It’s somewhat gotcha, but it allows for an actual answer. An answer that I’d consider stupid and racist, but an answer, like, say, > [@](#): > > Thank you. Invasions can happen with guns and with tanks, but they can also happen with crime and with terrorism. There are bad guys hiding in that caravan. It’s a tremendous way to smuggle drugs into the country. MS-13 is bringing their recruits to the United States. I’ve talked to very smart people who tell me that Al Qaeda could hide members among the Mexicans. It’s very short-sighted of you to think that just because they’re not marching alongside tanks, that means they’re not bringing danger to America’s citizens. It’s absolutely an invasion. The question of “why did you characterize it as such?” is a perfectly legitimate question, and it allows a perfectly plausible answer (I was going to say “legitimate,” discarded that for “reasonable,” and am pretty unhappy with “plausible”, too). Trump’s decision to not answer the question doesn’t make it a bad question. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/38 "2018-11-19T21:13:01Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > The question of “why did you characterize it as such?” is a perfectly legitimate question, and it allows a perfectly plausible answer (I was going to say “legitimate,” discarded that for “reasonable,” and am pretty unhappy with “plausible”, too). Trump’s decision to not answer the question doesn’t make it a bad question. Yes. In fact, most of the questions asked by the White House press pool are insulting to the American people, because they’re such lame-ass questions. They’re dead-end YES-NO questions:\*Mr. President, do you still have confidence in \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_? Mr. President, are you going to fire \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_? Mr. President, will you apologize for \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_? Mr. President, do you regret \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_?\*All pathetic YES-NO questions which don’t get anywhere closer to holding Trump accountable. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/39 "2018-11-19T21:19:17Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Trump’s decision to not answer the question doesn’t make it a bad question. I think what made it a bad question was that it was essentially a question that begged itself, or poisoned the well, or maybe some other fallacies to boot. To remove this from Trump, imagine if a Fox News reporter asked you: “Mr. Dorkness, you said that Five Guys cheeseburgers are the best. But you are wrong. Why did you say something wrong?” If you do have fondness for Five Guys, of course the first thing out of your mouth is going to dispute the editorializing of the reporter that Five Guys are not the best. Because after all, that’s just a reporter stating an opinion that his interviewer is wrong! In my opinion, there’s quite a few ways to improve upon the question. Drop the bare assertion that the interviewee was wrong (or untruthful), cite experts who have an objective opinion on what constitutes a cheeseburger, and so on. But framing a question as “I’m stating my opinion in contradiction to yours, and the premise of my question is that I’m right and you’re wrong” is just an invitation to a goat rope, not a substantive response. Of course, I fully agree that it is not an invasion, that Trump couldn’t answer a question if his life depended on it, but I just don’t think it was a good question. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2018, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796/40 "2018-11-19T21:24:57Z")
It occurs to me that there’s another sort of answer that question allows: crazy to say, **it allows for an informative answer** : > [@hypothetical answer](#): > > As a matter of fact, I’ve been in consultation with my intelligence advisors, and they have shown me credible intelligence that Al-Qaeda has been attempting to use Central American refugees as cover for entering the United States to carry out terrorist operations. Obviously I cannot share the details of this information with you, but in this age of asymmetrical warfare, an invasion may consist of a few trained terrorists, and it may be cloaked by thousands of innocent refugees. It is the first group, not the last group, that I characterize as an “invasion.” Still problematic, but perhaps the president actually had a non-racist reason for characterizing a bunch of refugees as an invasion. A question that provides him with the opportunity, at least in theory, not to be a racist shitbird is a perfectly fine question. The idea that Acosta is a bad journalist does not seem supported by this question. As it ties directly into Trump’s campaign against a free press and against facts, I’m not inclined to support him. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/does-trump-want-to-undermine-the-role-of-the-press/824796.md?page=3)