# Dog behavior question: neutered littermates suddenly growling **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 7, 2011, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dog-behavior-question-neutered-littermates-suddenly-growling/602130 "2011-11-07T02:31:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2011, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dog-behavior-question-neutered-littermates-suddenly-growling/602130/21 "2011-11-10T20:55:59Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > **chiroptera** has done a good job representing NILIF as I understand it, but it’s worth noting that the original link I posted says: > > I can imagine someone disagreeing with the program’s _intent_, _technique_, or _effectiveness_; but “time and effort” shouldn’t be the issue. IMHO anyone who can’t put THAT little effort into their relationship with their dog shouldn’t have a live animal companion. Get a teddy bear or something. OK, I didn’t look at the original link but what you have here is misleading. Each individual interaction isn’t supposed to take any time, but the whole process can take months or years, depending on the dog. That is the part that I think the average pet owner won’t do - they’ll do a couple of days of it and then start running out of time in the morning on the way to work, or not have the energy for it at the end of the day, etc. Since I haven’t done training for the general public in quite some time, it’s possible that the average owner is more willing these days to do long term work than they used to. OTOH, I haven’t seen much if any drop in owner-created problems or dogs given up for easily fixed issues. So I tend to err on the side of the dog and suggest things that won’t require the owner give up a lot of time and energy, that they may not have. It’s not like I have a problem with NILIF, I use it myself, I just don’t have much faith in the average pet owner to follow thru on something that might take more than a few days. ---
**Author:** ![chiroptera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/df705f/32.png) [@chiroptera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chiroptera)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2011, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dog-behavior-question-neutered-littermates-suddenly-growling/602130/22 "2011-11-10T21:42:21Z")
> [@rhubarbarin](#): > > I guess I do NILIF although I never realized it before. It takes 20 seconds max to have my cats and dogs respond to a simple command before they get to do the things they love, like eat, go outside, or play laser-chase. It seems to work well for me because they are well-behaved… at least when I am there. I know the cats get bitten and counters are climbed on when I am not home, but few pets are perfect. 😉 You do this with CATS as well? We need a genuflecting smiley! ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2011, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dog-behavior-question-neutered-littermates-suddenly-growling/602130/23 "2011-11-15T19:07:56Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > OK, I didn’t look at the original link but what you have here is misleading. Each individual interaction isn’t supposed to take any time, but the whole process can take months or years, depending on the dog. That is the part that I think the average pet owner won’t do - they’ll do a couple of days of it and then start running out of time in the morning on the way to work, or not have the energy for it at the end of the day, etc. > > Since I haven’t done training for the general public in quite some time, it’s possible that the average owner is more willing these days to do long term work than they used to. OTOH, I haven’t seen much if any drop in owner-created problems or dogs given up for easily fixed issues. So I tend to err on the side of the dog and suggest things that won’t require the owner give up a lot of time and energy, that they may not have. It’s not like I have a problem with NILIF, I use it myself, I just don’t have much faith in the average pet owner to follow thru on something that might take more than a few days. Wait a minute – you read the part that describes it as a "two or three second encounter that consists of nothing more than saying “sit”, then “good dog!”, then putting the bowl down and walking away, " and that **rhubarbarin** says “takes 20 seconds max” and you infer that most pet caretakers won’t spend that much time, so the whole program is useless? Is there some training regime that takes _less than_ 2-3 seconds per use that you recommend? When you say > [@](#): > > That is the part that I think the average pet owner won’t do - they’ll do a couple of days of it and then start running out of time in the morning on the way to work, or not have the energy for it at the end of the day, etc. …you have a point, _but that’s not specific to NILIF_. That’s one of the two great, besetting problems with ALL training regimes (the other being lack of consistency by the humans). Any and every training regime will be dependent on the humans taking the time and effort. And this one doesn’t impose very much time and effort. It’s not even as much trouble as making a special trip to a trainer one night a week, for example. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2011, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dog-behavior-question-neutered-littermates-suddenly-growling/602130/24 "2011-11-16T06:18:49Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > Wait a minute – you read the part that describes it as a "two or three second encounter that consists of nothing more than saying “sit”, then “good dog!”, then putting the bowl down and walking away, " and that **rhubarbarin** says “takes 20 seconds max” and you infer that most pet caretakers won’t spend that much time, so the whole program is useless? No, I didn’t say anything like that - as a matter of fact, I said I use it myself. > [@](#): > > Is there some training regime that takes _less than_ 2-3 seconds per use that you recommend? Because most pet owners won’t stick with anything that takes any amount of time, I don’t tend to recommend any training program like that for a specific problem. (Are you from the US?) > [@](#): > > When you say > > …you have a point, _but that’s not specific to NILIF_. Uh, actually it is. If the dog only has to wait a couple of days to start getting things for free again, then calling a training program Nothing In Life Is Free wouldn’t make sense. NILIF will only work if the owner is willing to commit to it until the dog clearly understands that it must work for a living _and_ be willing to go back to it when the dog backslides, which most do. Yes, every training regime will be dependent on the humans taking the time and effort - again, I have nothing against NILIF but these days most owners want a solution yesterday that doesn’t require them to do much work, so I usually won’t recommend a lifestyle change when the problem is a single issue. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2011, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dog-behavior-question-neutered-littermates-suddenly-growling/602130/25 "2011-11-23T17:51:09Z")
I think I see where we differ: > [@curlcoat](#): > > I have nothing against NILIF but these days most owners want a solution yesterday that doesn’t require them to do much work My understanding is that no such “solution” exists. The problem is that these people want a fantasy solution. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2011, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dog-behavior-question-neutered-littermates-suddenly-growling/602130/26 "2011-11-24T06:03:03Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > I think I see where we differ: > > My understanding is that no such “solution” exists. The problem is that these people want a fantasy solution. Yes, that was my whole point. It’s been a couple of years since I did any work with the general public, but I think it’s still true that the average pet owner doesn’t want to or simply cannot put in the time to actually train their dog, never mind maintaining that training. So my suggestions tend to focus more on management with a bit of training rather than a program that would require daily work. That way the owner usually sees at least some immediate results and tools they can use in everyday life. Another thing that was never addressed was the idea that NILIF would be only "two or three second encounter that consists of nothing more than saying “sit”, then “good dog!”, then putting the bowl down and walking away, ". What if the dog has no training, or poor training? It’s going to take far more than 20 seconds to get through the simple task of feeding a dog if he doesn’t know “sit” or isn’t well trained enough to do it in the presence of the huge distraction of dinner. Remember, a dog that is going through NILIF usually has some sort of behavior or training problem already. And, NILIF isn’t just feeding the dog, it’s _everything_. Dog wants to play fetch? Has to lay down on command. Dog wants a skitch behind the ears? Has to sit. Go for a walk? Come in from out back? Get up on the couch and watch TV? Gotta “pay” for each and everything he gets. It’s time consuming! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dog-behavior-question-neutered-littermates-suddenly-growling/602130.md?page=1)