Dog wouldn't come, when I said "Come"

[Amateur_Barbarian]

1. Leash.

2. There is a technique that goes under various names; I was taught it as "Really Reliable Recall."It’s an emergency “come” command that you train separately and use only in situations of need. In a nutshell, you use an alternate call word, not their name; you train with another person to hold them until it’s called; and then you absolutely lavish reward on them for coming straight to you - loves and hugs and rubs and handfuls of treats for like 30-60 seconds. It worked for me after just two training sessions at Puppy Kindergarten; the boy got off the leash and decided the world looked like a pretty interesting place. I barked out his recall command like a DI: “Rover! BACON!”… and he trotted right to me. Used it a few months later when a deer ran through the yard just as I was “trusting” him off the line as he was going into the house. Worked again. You can never use it as a routine, and never, ever, ever let them get away with not coming to you when you use it, or it will break.

3. Never, ever use “come” on a dog to punish it or make it do something unpleasant. You’re going to break the command. Bath time? Go get him, quietly, and use a leash.

[JcWoman]

@Sunny_Daze

Work on “Leave it” (start with food, which he will get to have, after he “leaves it”).

Never, ever call him to something unpleasant like a bath. Go and get him.

If he runs away instead of coming when called, guess what you get to do if he’s not on lead? Chase him and catch him. He gets a firm “no”, and a “come” and you bring him along with you. The leash must go on at that point and he gets to earn off-leash privileges again.

I agree with everything except for the bolded part. No! Never chase the dog, for two reasons:

1. He may think it’s a game and will always out run you.
2. If he picks up on the fact that you’re mad, he will run away from you and will always out run you.

NEVER CHASE A DOG. Here’s how you catch a dog:

[ol]
[li]First, check your mood/attitude because he will sense it. Dog’s won’t approach angry people. [/li][li]Crouch down and study a spot on the ground. A patch of grass or a pipe or anything. Be very curious and he will likely come to see what it is that you’re so interested in.[/li][li]If the dog is playful and likes chase games, you run away from him. He’ll chase you and then you can let him “tag” you. Then you simply, gently and casually grab his collar.[/li][/ol]

After that, the other cardinal rule, no matter how angry you are that he ran off, is to reward him for letting you catch him. You must always make it a happy thing for him to come to you. The instant you punish him or yell at him for coming to you, you’ve fucked up and have to start over training recall.

[cochrane]

@BigT

I don’t see any point where the OP asked about whether or not they should use a leash.

OP, I personally would never ask pet questions here. They, like social issue questions, produce threads that are more about judging the owner than answering the question. If you respond in any other way than acquiescing to the demands, it will just get worse. May even wind up closed.

That doesn’t mean you won’t get posts like Mangetout’s that actually answer the question. But be prepared for a lot of attacks. If you do continue on in this thread, respond to the real answers, not the incriminations.

Of course, you can do what you want. But I just wanted to warn you. I’ve seen it go bad so many times. I personally don’t consider it worth it.

Having the dog on a leash is the real answer.

[Omega_Glory]

@BigT

I don’t see any point where the OP asked about whether or not they should use a leash.

Who cares? An unleashed dog is a potential danger to everyone around it. This isn’t “should I feed dry pellets or raw?” It’s “my dog could have killed something, but I’m not taking the most logical step to protect those around us.”

[kayaker]

@cochrane

Having the dog on a leash is the real answer.

Not always. We hike and horseback ride in the woods around our home. It would suck to have the dogs on leash for those activities.

A trainer once told me that a dog that ignores “come” is more interested in something other than you, so you need to change that. He told me he once fell to the ground and began rolling around and laughing. His dog, ignoring him just moments before, came running back, and of course he rewarded the dog.

[Mangetout]

@kayaker

A trainer once told me that a dog that ignores “come” is more interested in something other than you, so you need to change that. He told me he once fell to the ground and began rolling around and laughing. His dog, ignoring him just moments before, came running back, and of course he rewarded the dog.

I think there are probably some situations, with some dogs, where even the most reliable recall methods will fail, either because there’s nothing you can offer the dog that is more enticing than [whatever it is chasing], or because it’s literally not listening to you.

My little doglet has whippet and terrier blood and despite being pretty good at recall, I don’t think I could ever break her off from pursuit of a squirrel - partly because it’s such a stimulus, but also, because she’s 50 yards away within a couple of seconds, with her ears down flat - I wonder if she could actually hear me shouting after her.

In situations where it matters (not in the woods - if she runs after a squirrel there, it will go up a tree and she will stop), I don’t trust my command or her obedience enough to risk letting her off the lead. I’ve seen people walking their dogs off-lead next to busy roads, and it’s impressive, but it takes a fraction of a second for a squirrel, bird, rat etc to dash out of a hedge and into the road in front of the dog. It’s not worth the risk to road users, and it’s certainly not worth the risk of losing my dog under a car.

[cochrane]

@kayaker

Not always. We hike and horseback ride in the woods around our home. It would suck to have the dogs on leash for those activities.

A trainer once told me that a dog that ignores “come” is more interested in something other than you, so you need to change that. He told me he once fell to the ground and began rolling around and laughing. His dog, ignoring him just moments before, came running back, and of course he rewarded the dog.

Well yes, you make a good point. In a city around traffic and other people, though, having a dog on a leash can prevent tragedy, for the dog, owner, and other people. Out in the woods away from any of those dangers, a dog can be safely unleashed.

[Amateur_Barbarian]

@Mangetout

I think there are probably some situations, with some dogs, where even the most reliable recall methods will fail, either because there’s nothing you can offer the dog that is more enticing than [whatever it is chasing], or because it’s literally not listening to you.

The RRR method above and its similar version can be amazingly powerful, even with otherwise strong-willed dogs. It can’t be misused, though. Once you embed the idea that it’s a call to “dog heaven” - hugs, praise, belly scratches, gorging on treats, etc. - it will overpower something close to all other lures. I’ve seen it done - a dog being called and tempted by five or six people with various goodies, and a stranger using the recall… right to 'em. Magic. Something I wish I’d had decades ago.

[Sailboat]

Pretty sure there are cars in Mexico.

Also, for those who feel the pro-leash people are piling on, I will counter that some off-leash advocates I have met are just that – advocates. Of course i don’t know if the OP falls into that category, but I’ve talked with numerous people who have a deep emotional commitment to letting their dogs roam “free” off leash, and defend the practice vigorously.

Usually I am talking to these people after their off-leash dog has rushed over to mine while they trailed behind, uselessly yelling.

That said, I have heard that short, sharp, repeated sounds are more exciting/interesting to a dog, so we have replaced the sonorous “cooome” command with a peppy “Here here!” in our own lexicon (although recently we adopted a deaf dog, so that won’t work with her). So if you want to work on the recall, I recommend employing a similar sound pattern.

[Dangerosa]

I have a friend who works with adopted racing greyhounds. The contract with them is that they are never off leash unless the area is fenced. The breed in general is lousy at recall, and racers are trained to run and chase. And when they do get loose, they can be miles from home when found.

We had our dog, who is yard trained (invisible fence) and never leaves the yard except for on leash walks, lost last year after a seizure. He just wanted to get away. He didn’t seem to recognize me. Made it about three miles where he was found next morning and the person who found him found us.

[Eyebrows_0f_Doom]

@BigT

I don’t see any point where the OP asked about whether or not they should use a leash.

OP, I personally would never ask pet questions here. They, like social issue questions, produce threads that are more about judging the owner than answering the question. If you respond in any other way than acquiescing to the demands, it will just get worse. May even wind up closed.

That doesn’t mean you won’t get posts like Mangetout’s that actually answer the question. But be prepared for a lot of attacks. If you do continue on in this thread, respond to the real answers, not the incriminations.

Of course, you can do what you want. But I just wanted to warn you. I’ve seen it go bad so many times. I personally don’t consider it worth it.

Is there anything wrong that you won’t defend?

OP: “I am doing something stupid and possibly illegal that is causing me a problem, help me solve this easily solved problem?”

Everyone in this thread: "Uh, stop doing the stupid and possibly illegal thing?

BigT: You guys are meanies picking on him like that for simply doing something stupid and possibly illegal!

[kayT]

I did want to add that just having the dog on a leash isn’t always enough. One of my neighbors walks his tiny little dog on a retractable leash which he never retracts, so the dog can wander all the way to the middle of the street while the guy is daydreaming or something. I have yelled at him at least twice and I think maybe he’s deaf? Or just doesn’t care? Anyway, of course everyone knows that even if the dog is leashed the owner still has to pay attention…

[Helena330]

@BigT

I don’t see any point where the OP asked about whether or not they should use a leash.

OP, I personally would never ask pet questions here. They, like social issue questions, produce threads that are more about judging the owner than answering the question. If you respond in any other way than acquiescing to the demands, it will just get worse. May even wind up closed.

That doesn’t mean you won’t get posts like Mangetout’s that actually answer the question. But be prepared for a lot of attacks. If you do continue on in this thread, respond to the real answers, not the incriminations.

Of course, you can do what you want. But I just wanted to warn you. I’ve seen it go bad so many times. I personally don’t consider it worth it.

He’d get the same answer anywhere there are responsible dog owners.

[Amateur_Barbarian]

Unleashed dogs in most public areas are a pointless hazard and annoyance to everyone else, and a risk to the dog, and a (legal/financial) risk to the owner. They’re no more welcome among responsible dog owners than the one-percenter or the kid who does wheelies on his dirt bike down a residential street is welcome among most motocyclists.

I have a family member who has been a “loose dog” person all her life, and thinks it’s everyone else’s problem. She’s wrong.

[Hilarity_N.Suze]

I once had a dog with a 100% reliable recall, and that dog was let off leash quite a bit. He also had a 90% reliable heel, but paired with the recall, off leash he was golden.

My current dog is about 90% reliable with recall, but we have a special emergency term. We say, “Treat!” and that will get him, always, because we have faded the treat with all other commands but not that one.

Actually I have not tested this off leash with a powerful distraction because I can’t take treats to the area of largest distraction, aka the dog park (I would get mobbed).

I think there are some dogs that can be absolutely 100% reliable off leash with recall and heel, but not all dogs can get to that point, and even fewer owners can train them to that point. It really takes a lot of dedication.

I will say, my current dog easily took and passed a Canine Good Citizen course, and he’s got a certificate to prove it. He was around 2 when he passed the course. Now he’s 6, and as I’ve not been real dedicated to keeping the training going, he would not pass that course today. (He would flunk “sitting politely for petting” and “passing another dog.”) You have to keep up the training, reinforcing the behaviors they already have and teaching them new ones so they don’t get bored.

ETA: My dog is a bit leash reactive, so he’s actually, in general, better behaved off leash when it comes to aggressive behavior. However, because of that 10% chance that he won’t come when called, he’s mostly on leash.

[Amateur_Barbarian]

@Hilarity_N.Suze

(He would flunk […] “passing another dog.”)

You just need to feed him smaller dogs.

[harmonicamoon]

Thank you all for your replies. I have learned a great deal.

As Sunny Daze mentioned up thread, I live in México. Specifically, in a small town in the Yucatán.

Kiko was a street dog for 2 years before we bonded. Puppy street dogs that don’t learn about traffic and cars never make it to adolescence. Kiko is street savvy.

He sometimes heals, or he may stride 10 meters in front of me. He constantly looks back to make sure I am following. If I go in a shop, he finds me.

Because it is a small town, everyone knows Kiko. They are amazed when he obeys commands in the indigenous language. And they ask his name. I mostly fear that someone will steal him. Because he is so cool.

If you could see his smile (yes, I may be anthropomorpmizing) as he struts down the street, you wouldn’t put him on a leash. I believe the street is his life. In his blood.

We go everywhere together. In the supermarket, they don’t allow dogs. On my command he will wait for me outside. I may be 20-30 minutes shopping. When I return, there he is and I say vamos a la casa. And we go home. If I buy too much we get a taxi.

I tell him that he is the luckiest dog in the world. He can enjoy the street, yet be very well taken care of. I buy the best kibble I can find. And occasionally supplement it with treats. He has access to a vet if he needs it. And has all his shots. He has a bed and sleeps outside my door.

Yes, I may be a mean, evil person for him letting off leash. And I realize that one day he may end up under a car. And I will cry for a long time.

But, if you could see him a struttin’…

[Idle_Thoughts]

@BigT

I don’t see any point where the OP asked about whether or not they should use a leash.

OP, I personally would never ask pet questions here. They, like social issue questions, produce threads that are more about judging the owner than answering the question. If you respond in any other way than acquiescing to the demands, it will just get worse. May even wind up closed.

That doesn’t mean you won’t get posts like Mangetout’s that actually answer the question. But be prepared for a lot of attacks. If you do continue on in this thread, respond to the real answers, not the incriminations.

Of course, you can do what you want. But I just wanted to warn you. I’ve seen it go bad so many times. I personally don’t consider it worth it.

If you see any posts that violate the rules, then report them. No need to warn off other posters, however, let the mods worry about it if something goes wrong.

[Chronos]

Quoth Mangetout:

I’ve seen dogs trained to the point that they will not chase a cat, and would not eat a chunk of steak in front of their nose without explicit voice command from their owners, but that’s a pretty extraordinary level of training, and probably not all dogs are capable of it (or owners capable of delivering it).

It varies wildly from task to task and from dog to dog. My first dog, for instance, was very thoroughly trained not to chase cats, with no effort at all from us: The cats trained him for us. And my mom’s current dog is very spotty on “Come” (which is why he always wears a leash and a muzzle whenever he’s out), but is excellent about not eating until he’s told to.

On the other hand, her previous dog was excellent about obeying all commands, to the best of his ability, except for any commands relating to food (he was three-fourths starved when she adopted him, and he never really recovered from that psychologically). Since he was so good about everything else, Mom responded by just never giving him any commands not to eat anything, and just keeping all food out of his reach.

And I agree about not chasing the dog. When Mom’s dog won’t go straight up to his kennel when he needs to, I won’t chase him around the house (which I sometimes do for play); instead I immediately start rearranging furniture to where he can’t run around the house.

[Lisaren]

Your and your dog remind me of the absolutely beautiful Akita that almost killed my cat. He and his owner ran every day without a leash. The dog seemed to be perfectly trained until the day my cat was on my porch: not in the yard, not roaming around, laying under the porch swing. The dog saw my cat, ran up on my porch, took one bite and almost killed the cat. I ended up with extensive vet bills because the runner did not think he needed a leash and I did not know the owner’s name. But, he never ran past my house again. Please leash the dog when you are in any type of populated area. One mistake could end up with the death of your beloved dog or another’s beloved pet.