# DOJ/Jack Smith Investigation into Trump and Election Interference, January 6th Insurrection (Re-Indicted August 27, 2024) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [November 23, 2022, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455 "2022-11-23T20:14:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/322 "2023-08-02T00:39:23Z")
I went with ice cream and a dance. I wonder how long the trial will take. I’m hoping for a December ish trial date. 70 days from today is mid October ish, so given that there will be filings and trump delay tactics, nov. or dec… ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/323 "2023-08-02T00:43:52Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > > [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > > > > [@rocking\_chair](#): > > > > > > 4 lawyers we know, Eastman, Powell, chesebro, and Giuliani > > > > > > 1 justice official is Clark > > > > > > 1 political operative Brannon? Stone? > > > > My guess is Cleta Mitchell. > > Less sure now, but the identity of Conspirator 6 still seems to be unconfirmed. Here are the clues I picked up from the indictment. These are outlined starting at item 58 in the indictment. > > CC6 provided CC1 (most certainly Guliani) with a list of lawyers in every state who could assist in the fraudulent elector scheme. > > CC6 also participated in a - apparently unreported until now- phone call on Dec 12th with the PA electors. Rudy CC1 and CC5 (probably Chesebro) were also in the phone call. > > CC6 also participated in a conference call on Dec 13, participants are not detailed but appeared to be internal to campaign. > > I’m backing off on Cleta because she’s an attorney. I’m now guessing that it’s a Trump campaign official whose name is relatively unknown, maybe a guy named Mike Roman who was mentioned once in an article about the plot. > > Or Christina Bobb, but she’s an attorney. > > Another very slim possibility is Ginni Thomas. It’s probably not, but if it is Smith has some elephant sized balls. It’s been reported that she did directly contact AZ electors to promote the scheme and she would be a good non-lawyer source for names of insurrectionist lawyers, which is the reason I threw that out. But I can’t see her participating in the phone calls. It would be delicious, though. The only person I’d find more hilarious than Ginni Thomas is Mike Lindell. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/324 "2023-08-02T00:44:58Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > Trump did well in being deeply consistent in asserting a particular reality. I’d assume that his defense would rest strongly on blame shifting his beliefs to crazies around himself (e.g. Flynn, Lindell, etc.), Newsmax, Epoch Times, etc. Smith doesn’t offer any evidence, in the indictment, that Trump ever broke and admitted the truth. The indictment isn’t going to include all the evidence for each charge. I’m sure there’s plenty. [From Dennis Aftergut, a former federal prosecutor:](https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2023/08/jack-smith-jan-6-trump-indictment-prosecution-masterpiece.html) > Trump will surely argue that he was trying to _prevent_ the deprivation of _his_ voters’ rights because of election fraud. Hence, prosecutors will want to produce evidence of his knowledge of, or willful blindness to, the truth about the election. > > We know of plenty of evidence to that effect. In December 2020, Trump was told as much by both Attorney General William Barr and his successor, acting Attorney General Jeffrey Rosen. Two research companies hired by the Trump campaign to discover significant ballot fraud reported they could find none. > > Even more compelling was the evidence given to the House Jan. 6 committee that after the election, Trump acknowledged behind closed White House doors that he had lost the election. Alyssa Farah Griffin, Trump’s former White House communications director, testified she heard Trump express this exasperation after his defeat: “Can you believe I lost to this effing guy?” > > Likewise, Gen. Mark Milley testified that after the election, while still president, Trump told him, in effect, “Yeah, we lost, we need to let that issue go to the next guy, meaning President Biden.” > > Smith may well have more of the same, particularly because there are tantalizing hints in the indictment that Mark Meadows, Trump’s White House chief of staff, may be cooperating. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/325 "2023-08-02T00:47:06Z")
Anybody else wondering what Hillary Clinton is drinking tonight? ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/326 "2023-08-02T00:52:05Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > The indictment isn’t going to include all the evidence for each charge. I’m sure there’s plenty. That is my assumption. But, not having it in the indictment (assuming that it exists) means that Newsmax, Fox, etc. have room to wiggle and keep the insanity going. Political violence is more likely to increase than decrease, on the basis of this - I feel. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/327 "2023-08-02T00:53:31Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > Anybody else wondering what Hillary Clinton is drinking tonight? Whatever it is, I hope it’s sweet and cold. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/328 "2023-08-02T00:53:49Z")
Perhaps in the short term, but in the long term, serious consequences for inciting an insurrection and attempting to overturn an election should dissuade future inciters and overturners. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/329 "2023-08-02T00:53:55Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > Anybody else wondering what Hillary Clinton is drinking tonight? I don’t know, but I wouldn’t be at all surprised if Trump was seriously considering dropping a double-shot of vodka into his Diet Coke. And I wonder how much ketchup is on the walls now. Is anybody watching Fox and its ilk for any reaction from them, or their commentators; or Trump, or Trump supporters? Has Trump truthed anything since the indictment dropped? ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/330 "2023-08-02T00:57:32Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > Smith doesn’t offer any evidence, in the indictment, that Trump ever broke and admitted the truth. > [@TroutMan](#): > > > Two research companies hired by the Trump campaign to discover significant ballot fraud reported they could find none. Yes, I can see how not one but two research companies that Trump hired specifically to find ballot fraud reporting that they could find none is dubious and not to be believed. 🙄 And he did make several spontaneous statements demonstrating he did understand he lost. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/331 "2023-08-02T01:02:09Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > The only person I’d find more hilarious than Ginni Thomas … That would be _too_ sweet. > [@](#): > > … is Mike Lindell. BTW he’s selling slippers now. ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/332 "2023-08-02T01:09:39Z")
And 700 pieces of company equipment, ranging from forklifts to office desks and cubicles. I don’t see him as other than a dupe (rich though) to DJTs charm, not a political of legal operative. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/333 "2023-08-02T01:11:24Z")
Interesting. CNN’s anchor is discussing the matter with one of Trump’s lawyers. Without tipping his hand too much, he’s alluding to the defense: “it’s all political, intended to influence, if not outright upset, the 2024 election.” CNN’s anchor is obviously making Trump’s lawyer uncomfortable. He cannot seem to stop interrupting her with, “But … but … but …”. And again, “The government had three years. Why not sooner? It’s obviously intended to get in the way of an election.” ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/334 "2023-08-02T01:16:36Z")
> [@Spoons](#): > > Is anybody watching Fox and its ilk for any reaction from them, or their commentators; or Trump, or Trump supporters? Don’t watch, but [foxnews.com](http://foxnews.com)’s headline is misleading: > [@](#): > > Former president hit with 4 counts in Special Counsel’s January 6 case As soon as loyal Republicans see this, their first thought will be that Trump never ordered his people to break into the Capitol building. But the indictment is not really about the Capitol invasion. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/335 "2023-08-02T01:17:47Z")
Looks like five of the six co-conspiritors have been identified: > **[Who are the Trump co-conspirators in the 2020 election interference...](https://www.cnn.com/2023/08/01/politics/co-conspirators-trump-indictment/index.html)** > > The historic indictment against Donald Trump in the special counsel’s probe into January 6, 2021, and efforts to overturn the 2020 election says that he “enlisted co-conspirators to assist him in his criminal efforts.” Good thing we didn’t have a betting pool. Pretty much all the guesses we made earlier today are true. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/336 "2023-08-02T01:17:47Z")
Am I the only one disappointed not to see insurrection in the list of charges? That’s the most important thing to convict him of. ---
**Author:** ![MulderMuffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldermuffin/32/2862_2.png) [@MulderMuffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MulderMuffin)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/337 "2023-08-02T01:19:43Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > The only person I’d find more hilarious than Ginni Thomas is Mike Lindell. Absolutely! Who was that frat boy-looking guy that was all over Arizona screaming about Sharpies right after the election? I forget his name now, but he was everywhere for a while after the election, making me want to smack his smug face off (much as I feel about Matt Gaetz’s frat boy smug mug). He could be a contender for #6. But my money is still on Navarro. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/338 "2023-08-02T01:21:39Z")
**PhillyGuy** , thanks for the post about the Fox News headline. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/339 "2023-08-02T01:27:47Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Am I the only one disappointed not to see insurrection in the list of charges? That’s the most important thing to convict him of. The article I linked above from the former federal prosecutor addresses this. Briefly, it would make the trial much longer (probably extending beyond the election), and it is a much tougher case to prove. There is deniability that Trump was encouraging insurrection - you and I know that’s BS, but all it takes is one juror. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/340 "2023-08-02T01:34:13Z")
I imagine that his actions involving the incitement of a crowd to attack the Capitol would not need to be part of this. While they’re related, they’re not the same incident. (IANAL and could be wrong.) That said, I don’t expect charges for incitement or insurrection due to how hard it would be to prove that, even if it seems obvious, and the 1/6 committee made a good case to the public. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/341 "2023-08-02T01:34:14Z")
All this, plus it would create an issue on appeal for this SCOTUS to weigh in on the limits (or lack of same) on free speech. Sometimes you want to avoid setting legal precedent. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455.md?page=18)