# DOJ/Jack Smith Investigation into Trump and Election Interference, January 6th Insurrection (Re-Indicted August 27, 2024) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [November 23, 2022, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455 "2022-11-23T20:14:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/342 "2023-08-02T01:36:15Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > I did not expect to see a statement this strong from Mr. Cardboard. He actually is a very moral person, just that many of us do not accept that code of right wing religious morals. I would trust Pence with $1009 in cash, a person would have to be a fool to trust trump. I did a happy dance then logged in here. > [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > Political violence is more likely to increase than decrease, on the basis of this - I feel. Has that happened yet? Paper tiger. > [@Chronos](#): > > Am I the only one disappointed not to see insurrection in the list of charges? That’s the most important thing to convict him of. That is like getting the bestest Birthday gift ever, and complaining about the gift wrap. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/343 "2023-08-02T01:41:33Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > I don’t expect charges for incitement or insurrection due to how hard it would be to prove that As I understand it, one of the reasons the DOJ has such a high conviction rate is because they go for the sure case as much as possible. ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/344 "2023-08-02T01:55:01Z")
So they were looking at using the Insurrection Act? Launching military to cities’ riots if Orange Boy was to stay in power? Fuck these guys: > **[Live updates: Trump indicted a third time after special counsel’s 2020...](https://www.msnbc.com/trump-investigation/live-blog/trump-indictment-jack-smith-2020-election-jan-6-live-updates-rcna97476#rcrd16178)** > > The latest news and live updates on Trump’s potential second federal indictment as Jack Smith continues to probe 2020 election interference and Jan. 6, 2021. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/345 "2023-08-02T02:03:03Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > No kidding. What is the over/under on the number of days before he calls her a racist? I don’t know. How long will it take for his lawyers to draft a groundless demand the that charges be dismissed. Maybe a week? I think it will be one day after that. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/346 "2023-08-02T02:03:29Z")
Did I hear properly? He will be arraigned at 4 pm on Thursday? What is that going to do to rush hour traffic? That should be fun. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/347 "2023-08-02T02:11:53Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > But, I’d like to see better evidence that the Defendant was aware of his own criminal intent, before I’d be comfortable with taking a former President to court. I would defer to our American lawyers on this, but that’s not what “guilty mind” normally means. _Mens rea_ is that the accused intentionally committed the prohibited acts. It’s not normally a defence that the accused didn’t think they were committing a criminal offence. A lot of crooks, especially white collar ones, especially some fraudsters, convince themselves that what they are doing is legal. A conviction has to depend on an objective assessment: did the accused’s intentional acts break the law? It can’t depend on: did the accused think they were breaking the law? ETA: That’s especially the case here, where the accused has a track record of apparently assuming that if he does it, it must be legal. Eg - his statements that he had every right to keep all those documents in his bathroom at Mar-a-Lago, because he was a former president. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/348 "2023-08-02T02:18:31Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > Smith doesn’t offer any evidence, in the indictment, that Trump ever broke and admitted the truth. This is not true. He refers to the Joint Chiefs meeting referenced above. But I must say “you cannot indict without a confession” is a helluva legal standard! Makes criming easy! ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/349 "2023-08-02T02:59:22Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > He actually is a very moral person, just that many of us do not accept that code of right wing religious morals. I’m not familiar with that, just with Christian morals. But does the right wing religion include praising and kissing the ass of the person who tried to have you killed? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/350 "2023-08-02T03:21:34Z")
Crikey. 160 new posts since this morning. No way I can get through them all. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/351 "2023-08-02T04:01:18Z")
> [@MulderMuffin](#): > > But my money is still on Navarro. I think you’ve got it. By my reckoning after reading the full indictment: Co-Conspirator 1 = Rudy Giuliani Co-Conspirator 2 = John Eastman Co-Conspirator 3 = Sidney Powell Co-Conspirator 4 = Jeffrey Clark Co-Conspirator 5 = Kenneth Chesebro Co-Conspirator 6 = Peter Navarro (not a lawyer) ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/352 "2023-08-02T04:17:53Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Crikey. 160 new posts since this morning. No way I can get through them all. Let me explain. No, there is too much. Let me sum up. Trump indicted. 4 counts. Six unindicted co-conspirators: Giuliani Eastman Powell Clark Chesbro ??Navarro maybe Trump says “what took you so long” (just like many other guilty criminals) And there was much rejoicing. ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/353 "2023-08-02T04:28:52Z")
“Yay.” 😁 ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/354 "2023-08-02T04:35:56Z")
I’m not convinced about Navarro. It seems to me that the primary contribution of CC6 was a well-heeled conservative Rolodex - CC6 recommended lawyers all across the country and confirmed the phone numbers of Senators on Jan 6th. Because I’m half-baked on schadenfreude and edibles, I’m going to bet the long shot and make a case for Ginni Thomas. She certainly has the right kind of Rolodex and it seems like the kind of help she’d offer. She seemed to communicate mostly through Mark Meadows, who’s apparently been vigorously cooperating. CC6 got on a call with PA electors in order to encourage them to cast fake electoral votes and it’s been reported that Ginni Thomas made the same type of call to AZ electors. I guess it’s possible that Peter Navarro was on the PA call, but why? His is not a name that would help them convince the electors that this was something approaching legitimate. Hers is. Then we have the very fact that the identity of CC6 is so well masked. The malfeasance that lead to January 6th was very heavily reported, and most of what is in the indictment is not a new story. The other 5 were very easy to identify because the actions in the indictment were well reported. But the four incidents in the indictment that involve CC6 ( supplying lawyer contact info, Dec 12th phone call, Dec 13th phone call, supplying Senator contact info as the insurrection was happening) were never publicly reported, I checked and I’m sure all the news organizations did as well. It’s almost like Jack Smith took pains to make sure CC6 could not be identified from the indictment and I have to wonder why that is. It would be epic. It’ll probably turn out to be some little known staffer, but a girl can dream. ---
**Author:** ![outlierrn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/outlierrn/32/3005_2.png) [@outlierrn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outlierrn)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/355 "2023-08-02T06:07:31Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Damn, we’ve waited a long time for this headline! Yes, we have! ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/356 "2023-08-02T06:11:54Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > Because I’m half-baked on schadenfreude and edibles, I’m going to bet the long shot and make a case for Ginni Thomas. I had a conversation when the indictment was announced, with a friend of mine, who is a lifelong political junkie. He, too, immediately speculated that #6 is Ginni Thomas. It’ll be very interesting to see how the next few days unfold. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/357 "2023-08-02T06:16:37Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > Because I’m half-baked on schadenfreude and edibles, I’m going to bet the long shot and make a case for Ginni Thomas. I’m nowhere near baked, half or not, and I don’t do edibles. But I will say that I had a couple of more beers than I would normally have on a Tuesday. But hey, we all celebrate in our own way, right? 🙂 Now, Thursday. Does anybody know at what time Trump is expected in court in Washington DC? I’d like to be able to catch what I can on TV—I know there will be no cameras in the courtroom, but I remember the indictment in New York, where the officer just let the door swing shut into his face. I’m sure that there will be that kind of coverage, before and after the actual court appearance, and I’d like to see it. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/358 "2023-08-02T06:27:13Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > > [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > > > Because I’m half-baked on schadenfreude and edibles, I’m going to bet the long shot and make a case for Ginni Thomas. > > I had a conversation when the indictment was announced, with a friend of mine, who is a lifelong political junkie. He, too, immediately speculated that #6 is Ginni Thomas. I think the real longshot is Patrick McGoohan. Just don’t expect him to flip and testify. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/359 "2023-08-02T07:11:44Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > I think the real longshot is Patrick McGoohan. **He is not a number!!!** ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 7:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/360 "2023-08-02T07:34:51Z")
Wow. I just finished reading the indictment … every last word. For those who haven’t yet, I can’t urge you strongly enough to do so. We lived through months and months of these sociopaths just shitting all the election process and you kind of lose perspective with everything so spread out. This document lays out everything so clearly - written crisply and so well organized - it brings a certain amount of clarity to the whole fucked up situation. Trump was so pathetically desperate from Nov to Jan it almost makes you feel sorry for him. Then you remember what worthless human being he is in total, you kind of get over it. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 9:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/361 "2023-08-02T09:52:20Z")
As always, I wonder if the prosecutors strategically revealed/concealed witness names in order to see who Trump decides to contact/influence. Or just generally to see if there’s any frenzied calling between persons of interest and named co-conspirators. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455.md?page=19)