# DOJ/Jack Smith Investigation into Trump and Election Interference, January 6th Insurrection (Re-Indicted August 27, 2024) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [November 23, 2022, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455 "2022-11-23T20:14:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 50
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/982 "2023-08-08T20:33:54Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > What happens to this juror when the judge notices them looking bored and daydreaming every day at trial? Or openly rolling their eyes every time the prosecutor is talking about the evidence? The jury will have at least two alternates selected, quite possibly more given how high-profile this case is, and they will sit through the whole trial, ready to be slotted in if one of the official jurors has to be excused during the proceedings. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/983 "2023-08-08T20:37:54Z")
We sat 6 alternates in a high profile criminal case I once worked on. It was a 4-month trial and if I recall correctly, we didn’t need any of them. But better to have them and not need them than get halfway through the case and not have them. ---
**Author:** ![Ziberian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/919ad9/32.png) [@Ziberian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ziberian)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/984 "2023-08-08T21:05:40Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > Serious question: How mich does a person in the jury pool have to divulge? And how easy is it to hide your social media comments from the court? > > All of us here at the Dope use anonymous handles. And all of us are careful to not reveal our real life names, because we don’t want to get fired from our jobs, or embarrass ourselves,or hurt the feelings of somebody. > > There must be millions of similar folks out there in MAGA land. > People who believe in the cult of Trump, but are smart enough not to blast it on Facebook under their real names. > For example, there is a forum on reddit called “conservative”. ([Reddit - Dive into anything](http://reddit.com/r/conservative). )They carry out a little bit of reasonable discussiion, with a whole lot of MAGA nonsense . But it is all, like us Dopers, under anonymous usernames. > > It would be easy for a conservative member there to appear in the jury pool as unbiased, with no social media presence ,but in reality he could be a full blown fanatic. I know several very dedicated MAGAts who either have no social media presence at all, or only a very minimal one. I would bet this is fairly common among MAGAts. They also don’t generally share their views with casual acquaintances or in public forums of any kind. In other words, unless the lawyers do a deep dive into interviewing their personal connections, they could land on this jury with ease. Comforting, isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/985 "2023-08-08T21:09:40Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > A smart, educated, informed MAGA, who had a strong understanding of the legal process, probably could sneak onto the jury. Still worried, but that made me laugh out loud. I mean, name one smart, educated informed MAGA. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/986 "2023-08-08T21:46:21Z")
Thinking about the upcoming trial: What are the odds that Mark Meadows is a cooperating witness, and will appear to give testimony that is damaging to Trump? My guess is 99.4% What are the odds that Trump will go off the rails at some point, and obliquely suggest that the world would be a better place if someone, anyone were to drive their car into Mr. Meadows? ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/987 "2023-08-08T21:51:55Z")
10 am Friday is the hearing date and time. ( per msnbc) Should be fun as trump has said publicly that he will not obey any orders. Count down to fines and a holding cell. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/988 "2023-08-08T21:55:16Z")
> [@rocking\_chair](#): > > as trump has said publicly that he will not obey any orders. I’d love to see a cite to this. (I believe you, I just want to read it myself) ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/989 "2023-08-08T22:07:41Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > I’d love to see a cite to this. He did declare that he will refuse any order telling him to be quiet. > **[Trump says a protective order would violate his First Amendment rights: 'I...](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/trump-says-protective-order-violates-first-amendment-rights-will-talk-rcna98881)** > > The order would prevent Trump from disclosing certain government evidence in the case examining efforts to overturn the 2020 election. > “I will talk about it, I will,” he said. “They’re not taking away my First Amendment rights.” Now, that doesn’t necessarily mean he will not obey **any** orders, but he has said that he will not obey an order that won’t let him say whatever he wants. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/990 "2023-08-08T22:08:22Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > Now, that doesn’t necessarily mean he will not obey **any** orders, but he has said that he will not obey an order that won’t let him say whatever he wants. Thanks. That should make for an interesting hearing. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/991 "2023-08-08T22:09:15Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > I mean, name one smart, educated informed MAGA. There’s plenty of them, if you include _amoral_. Case in point: Stephen “We All Float Down Here” Miller. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/992 "2023-08-08T22:10:06Z")
Just a prediction pulled from my posterior (how is that for alliteration?) but it’s possible that what he’s saying is just colorful Trump Tough Guy Talk for, “My lawyers will appeal the order on First Amendment grounds.” He might end up complying if it is made clear that there will be serious consequences if he doesn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/993 "2023-08-08T22:17:59Z")
Has anyone ever succeeded in making consequences clear to Trump? ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/994 "2023-08-08T22:23:39Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > Now, that doesn’t necessarily mean he will not obey **any** orders, but he has said that he will not obey an order that won’t let him say whatever he wants. Thanks for the cite. As I read it (in conjunction with historic Trump BS) is that he’s telling his supporters he’s being silenced, and he’ll Fight Like Hell To Show Those Bullies! Or in other words, keep the grift rolling. Meanwhile, per the article, his -lawyers- aren’t saying that, but that they want fewer restrictions. So as usual, court of public opinion trial vs actual trial tactics. Knowing Trump and his lawyer’s efforts to work with/around him, they’ll try to keep (successfully) most of the damaging material out of his tiny little fingers, since he can’t be bothered to read things. So Trump will keep talking in general terms, but still may trip over the line with the bluster and threats, and spew some 1/5 accurate things about a witness or the like, and end up with several pointed rebukes from the judge. I just don’t believe, in his mob boss way, he’ll quite get to something that cannot be dismissed as bluster, so I doubt he’ll end up with more than a verbal censure. Or, a true gag order if he goes farther than I expect. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/995 "2023-08-08T22:27:04Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > He might end up complying if it is made clear that there will be serious consequences if he doesn’t. He might. Or he might deliberately violate a court order to keep himself front and center in the news, and to show he’s willing to go to jail rather than be bossed around. The problem with the jail thing is that, I think, it would immediately drop him a couple points in the polls. That’s what his aides will be saying, if he has any numerate ones left. But experience shows he will bounce back. The worst thing for him would be news stories saying he’s an old guy who no longer knows how to dominate the news. Some here are probably convinced that he’s too much of a (if I can use my old-guy word) sissy to accept jail time as part of his play to be the victim. Me, I don’t believe in underestimating the adversary. So we’ll see. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/996 "2023-08-08T22:52:59Z")
I’m sure that there are many very clear Supreme Court verdicts on first amendment rights versus gag orders but Trump’s big path to winning is gaining immunity. If he can delay a verdict long enough then he’s effectively the winner so he has a motive to try and appeal everything that he can and make a big enough political stink that the Supreme Court might feel compelled to intervene. Ideally, the judicial system goes into overdrive to respond to and toss all of the side-suits and appeals that are going to come flying. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/997 "2023-08-08T23:04:15Z")
Question: If a defense team openly and publicly announces their intentions to use every delay tactic in the book, can/will a judge do anything about that? I mean, it’s one thing to delay, delay, delay, but usually it’s done without fanfare with at least a fig-leaf of deniability. To publicly announce this as a strategy seems to be a slap in the face to the judicial process and to the judge indirectly. Likewise if the defense lawyer goes to the media with completely fallacious arguments that they would never (and could never) use in court… are there any sanctions for this? Or are they allowed to spew complete and utter nonsense in the obvious attempt to pollute the jury pool before trial? (As an example, blathering on about how this is a “first amendment case” for Trump, when it is clearly, obviously, plainly not, and never will be) ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2023, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/998 "2023-08-08T23:26:30Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > A smart, educated, informed MAGA, who had a strong understanding of the legal process, probably could sneak onto the jury. But now we’re looking at a much, much smaller slice of the population. Well put. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2023, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/999 "2023-08-09T00:22:07Z")
> [@](#): > > A smart, educated, informed MAGA, who had a strong understanding of the legal process, probably could sneak onto the jury. But now we’re looking at a much, much smaller slice of the population. I don’t have statistics, but think it extremely unlikely that you would start out 11-1 on the initial jury vote, on all counts, and then you have no movement with a final 11-1 hung jury on all counts. It is just too hard to stand up to group pressure, hour after hour, with supreme stubbornness. There also is the possibility of 11 jurors going to the judge and saying that the consistent holdout was failing to deliberate. The likelihood is that voir dire will result in a jury with weak political convictions. If they hang on some counts, many here will not think much of the acquittal holdouts. But their reasons for holding out may not map to partisan politics. Now, if they hang on some counts but convict on others, it probably will not have a radical effect on the sentence, because judges usually let the sentences run concurrently. Despite all the claims about this case being a slam dunk, something tells me that mixed verdicts, when the defendant is a politician, are pretty normal. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2023, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/1000 "2023-08-09T00:32:45Z")
I’m fine with a mixed verdict as long as there’s “Guilty” on at least one count. ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2023, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455/1001 "2023-08-09T00:38:25Z")
And a fine attached to the “guilty” the size of his ego. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455.md?page=49) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doj-jack-smith-investigation-into-trump-and-election-interference-january-6th-insurrection-re-indicted-august-27-2024/975455.md?page=51)