# Dollhouse premier - Feb 13, 2009 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 12, 2009, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613 "2009-02-12T23:54:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Ice\_Cream\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9f8e36/32.png) [@Ice\_Cream\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ice_Cream_Man)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/121 "2009-02-16T04:52:59Z")
> [@brownie55](#): > > OK, can some of you that seemed to actually understand this explain something to me? > > We get the geeky guy explaining the glasses and asthma with “you get the whole package.” Yet we also learn that the personalities are to some degree composites. > > So, why pick nearsightedness and asthma to include in the “active” you hire out? I took that whole thing as “It was a big success because: We got his daughter back, we got his money back for him, etc.” ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/122 "2009-02-16T05:14:00Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > It was **Knorf** ’s comparison, not mine. > > ETA: Everything I’ve heard seems to suggest that Dollhouse has been FUBAR’d by Fox. Didn’t production shut down for two weeks because of a dispute between Whedon and Fox execs who wanted to tinker with the show? I’ve **not** heard that Fox is showing the eps out of order and Whedon is supposed to have said that the news which has leaked out about Fox “tampering” with the show, is the kind of tweaking which happens to **any** series before launch. Nor is having the network request changes automatically a Bad Thing[sup]TM[/sup]. The original concept for _House_ was to have Laurie in a wheelchair, which everyone involved in the production admits was a mistake and they’re grateful that the network folks vetoed the idea. **dropzone** , I speak as someone who has **never** seen anything of Whedon’s work besides the movie _Serenity_ and the first episode of _Dollhouse_, and I do **not** think that the series deserves to have a fork stuck in it just yet. There are a number of really interesting possibilities for the show to take, and while I’m inclined to believe that the nature of Follywood is such that the most interesting ideas will **never** be touched upon, I think that the show _could_ be worth watching. The issue is what they’ll do with the FBI agent, IMHO. Its awfully easy to fall into the same pattern as the _A-Team_ with that character. ---
**Author:** ![DaphneBlack](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/daphneblack/32/5389_2.png) [@DaphneBlack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DaphneBlack)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/123 "2009-02-16T05:34:00Z")
I liked it. I’ll keep watching, at least because I want to know the story behind Echo’s ‘handler’ and Amy Acker’s character. I don’t really care if it’s ‘plausible’. _House_ sure isn’t plausible, I like that too. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/124 "2009-02-16T05:53:00Z")
> [@Tuckerfan](#): > > Whedon is supposed to have said that the news which has leaked out about Fox “tampering” with the show, is the kind of tweaking which happens to **any** series before launch. Nor is having the network request changes automatically a Bad Thing[sup]TM[/sup] I agree with you that network intervention isn’t universally bad. I did read the Whedon quote about it being normal studio tweaking, either in TV Guide or EW, but my first reaction was to call bullshit. Shutting down for two weeks isn’t normal. The pilot thing is kinda similar. With both Firefly and Dollhouse, Whedon didn’t get the pilot he wanted showed first; both were changed by studio intervention. With Dollhouse, they made him write a new pilot. With Firefly, IIRC they simply showed a different episode first. Why I have no idea, as I have never seen Firefly. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/125 "2009-02-16T06:00:12Z")
After googling, I may have to retract. [http://www.dose.ca/tv/story.html?id=39656fcd-8e62-4c3f-8b46-c389d2a21d02](http://www.dose.ca/tv/story.html?id=39656fcd-8e62-4c3f-8b46-c389d2a21d02) > [@](#): > > The situation mirrors that another Fox drama: on Sept. 5, 24 shut down production for two weeks in order to rethink the season’s story arc and rewrite several scripts. Because both 24 and Dollhouse won’t join the Fox roster until midseason, network execs and the writing staffs of both shows assure fans that the setbacks will not delay premiere dates. [http://www.dose.ca/tv/story.html?id=70ba7e8d-bf60-4428-9f05-9fd6b1ad07a5](http://www.dose.ca/tv/story.html?id=70ba7e8d-bf60-4428-9f05-9fd6b1ad07a5) > [@](#): > > “The idea to do a new first episode wasn’t the network’s. It was mine,” Whedon continued. “I understood their consternation, and saw the gap between my style and their expectations, and I suggested I shoot a new ep and make the one I’d shot the second. It isn’t going to be buried, like the pilot of Firefly.” So okay, maybe shutting down for a couple weeks isn’t all that unusual, and maybe the rewrite wasn’t due to network pressure. It sure sounded good, though. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/126 "2009-02-16T06:14:22Z")
The rumor mill says that critics absolutely _lurve_ the second episode of _Dollhouse_. We’ll have to see if that’s true or not. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/127 "2009-02-16T06:20:15Z")
> [@Knorf](#): > > When _Firefly_ came out, the bellyaching and comments about supposed lack of originality and poor acting were almost identical. Comically so, actually. And yet somehow many, many people came around regardless, and now _Firefly_ is practicality a classic, and widely regarded as some of the best entertainment ever available on TV. Rightly so, in my opinion. > > When it came out though, there was little besides “cowboys in space, big deal” and similar comments. This is true. But you forget - a lot of us who made those complaints right as Firefly started did watch the rest of the episodes…and still dislike the show. Watching it and giving it the classic “chance” didn’t improve our opinion of it at all. ---
**Author:** ![willthekittensurvive](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/91b2a8/32.png) [@willthekittensurvive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/willthekittensurvive)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 11:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/128 "2009-02-16T11:03:54Z")
> [@brownie55](#): > > OK, can some of you that seemed to actually understand this explain something to me? > > We get the geeky guy explaining the glasses and asthma with “you get the whole package.” Yet we also learn that the personalities are to some degree composites. > > So, why pick nearsightedness and asthma to include in the “active” you hire out? Didn’t the tech dude try to explain that genius does not appear a vacuum; it came from overcompensating for other shortcomings. The profiles she was based on reached their excellence in their chosen field because of mentioned handicaps. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/129 "2009-02-16T14:01:18Z")
Boooooriiiiing. ---
**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/130 "2009-02-16T14:31:07Z")
I recorded the first hour - didn’t realize the opener was a two-hour show. I thought it started slowly, but you have to have some back story and set up. I’ll try it again next week, even though I missed the ending last week. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/131 "2009-02-16T14:32:34Z")
> [@Khadaji](#): > > I recorded the first hour - didn’t realize the opener was a two-hour show. I thought it started slowly, but you have to have some back story and set up. I’ll try it again next week, even though I missed the ending last week. It was two hours? ---
**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/132 "2009-02-16T14:36:12Z")
> [@Contrapuntal](#): > > It was two hours? I dunno, maybe I messed up the recording. In any case, I only saw half of the first show. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/133 "2009-02-16T14:51:26Z")
> [@Knorf](#): > > Elizu Dushku is not a terrible actress. If you think she’s a poor actress, then you shouldn’t be able to tolerate basically _any_ TV. I’m not saying she’s great, but I’ve got to question anyone who thinks she’s awful and purports to watch and enjoy, well, anything at all outside of the highest-caliber theatre. A bunch of you are fans of shows with _far_ more questionable acting. You’re not persuasive. Name two good television shows with worse _lead_ actors. I’ll spot you CSI: Miami, if you aren’t sick of CSI. Name another. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/134 "2009-02-16T15:44:39Z")
Zach Braff on Scrubs? ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/135 "2009-02-16T16:02:04Z")
Now here’s the improtant question that hasn’t been addressed yet: Dichen Lachman - the other “hot chick” doll. Hot or not? According to IMDB her parents are Tibetan and Austrailian. ---
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/136 "2009-02-16T16:09:52Z")
> [@Contrapuntal](#): > > It was two hours? No, it was only one hour. It was shown after “The Sarah Connor Chronicles” and FOX only has two hours of primetime per weekday. ---
**Author:** ![Orual](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/779978/32.png) [@Orual](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Orual)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/137 "2009-02-16T17:01:50Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Name two good television shows with worse _lead_ actors. _Ugly Betty_. _Ghost Whisperer_ (not a good show, but at least relatively popular). David Boreanaz didn’t figure out how to act until some time in the second season of _Angel_. I don’t think Dushku is a bad actress. I certainly don’t think she’s found the groove of this Echo character yet. That takes time. The premise is ludicrous, and the pilot was weak. I don’t think that’s reason to write the whole show off yet. I mean, _Buffy_ was pretty terrible for its entire first season - I just didn’t notice 'cause I was 16. I actually liked a couple of characters, which is more than I was expecting to from reading about the premise. Echo’s handler is interesting - I want to know how he ended up doing what he’s doing. The FBI agent also seems cool. And I want to know what led Caroline to letting herself become Echo. It’s not the best show on TV, but I think it’s worth giving a chance to. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/138 "2009-02-16T18:20:46Z")
I might have to put my distaste for Eliza Dushku on hold - I think part of my thinking of her as a terrible actress has a lot to do with not being able to get the picture of her saying things like, “Five by five, B.” out of my head. I will attempt to judge her acting in this show on its own merits. ---
**Author:** ![Superfluous\_Parentheses](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8edcca/32.png) [@Superfluous\_Parentheses](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superfluous_Parentheses)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2009, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/139 "2009-02-16T19:03:44Z")
Yes the premise is insane - but I think it has potential. And Eliza is smoking hot. Out-law hi-tech memory-swapping corporation? Possibly much more interesting than amoral hi-tech memory-swapping semi-government agency. The only issue I can see so far is that wiping the main character every episode is either going to make her uninteresting, or they’ll go for the obvious route of having her remember more and more, which is probably not going to be very interesting either. The fact that she signed up for it more or less by choice makes it a bit harder to predict where things are going. 7/10, would watch again 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2009, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613/140 "2009-02-17T01:41:19Z")
> [@Orual](#): > > I don’t think Dushku is a bad actress. I certainly don’t think she’s found the groove of this Echo character yet. That takes time. Since they went back and shot the first episode later, it’s possible that she’d already played the entire first season through before doing this one episode. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dollhouse-premier-feb-13-2009/485613.md?page=8)