# Don Imus, you ruined my reputation, and now I want my money. Bitch!
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700
**Category:** The BBQ Pit
**Created:** [August 15, 2007, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700 "2007-08-15T18:47:52Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Li\_l\_Pluck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Li_l_Pluck)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/1 "2007-08-15T18:47:52Z")
NOTE: If you noticed two now-closed threads of my authorship and you want to know what the deal is, just ask, and I’ll fill in the blanks. Y’all probably know, though, that the board has had some issues today, so maybe I won’t have to offer and explanation. And many thanks, BTW, to **fluiddruid** or **Giraffe** , (don’t know which one) for his/her assistance earlier today. If this post doesn’t go through…well, I reckon that I’ll just look like some kind of fool.
Link from News 12 in Northern New Jersey:
[http://www.news12.com/NJ/topstories/article?id=198733](http://www.news12.com/NJ/topstories/article?id=198733)
> [@](#):
>
> (08/14/07) NEW YORK (AP) - A member of the Rutgers women’s basketball team sued Don Imus and CBS on Tuesday, claiming the radio personality’s sexist and racist comments about the team damaged her reputation.
>
> Vaughn’s lawsuit [for defamation of character]…says Imus and his former co-host Bernard McGuirk along with CBS Corp., CBS Radio, MSNBC and other media outlets that broadcast his show are legally responsible for damage done to her character and reputation. There is no dollar amount listed in the suit.
>
> “This is about Kia Vaughn’s good name,” [Ms. Vaugn’s attorney] Ancowitz said. “She would do anything to return to her life as a student and respected basketball player - a more simple life before Imus opened his mouth.”
>
> “The … false, defamatory, sexually denigrating and slanderous statements and comments against the women athletes of said basketball team were heard, believed and understood by millions of listeners … as factual pronouncements concerning the character, chastity and reputation of the plaintiff,” the lawsuit says.
>
> Vaughn was humiliated, embarrassed and publicly mocked for the comments, the suit claims.
>
> A telephone message left for Imus’ attorney was not immediately returned Tuesday. A spokeswoman for CBS Radio declined to comment and CBS network spokesman Dana McClintock did not immediately return a message. MSNBC said it hadn’t seen the lawsuit.
>
> A Rutgers athletics spokeswoman didn’t immediately return a call for comment on Tuesday night.
>
> Vaughn…said the comments completely overshadowed her team’s amazing season… .
>
> …
What a pity–my first pitting, and having slept for 2.5 hours out of the last 36 hours, I don’t even have the energy to work up the requisite vitriol and intelligent commentary (it might not make a difference, anyway\*), but here goes.
What. The. Holy. Mother. Fuck?!
Now, don’t y’all go gettin’ me wrong and shit. I’m a Black dude in America, so I totally get the whole “racism-and-other-isms-and-phobias suck” thing. Been called nigger? Done. Been called faggot? Done. With aplomb. Does it suck? Yep. Does it hurt, especially when you’ve done nothing (well, 'cept to be born into a world full of shit-for-soul malcontents) to deserve it? Absolutely! But does it besmirch _my_ character? Nuh-uh. Not by a long shot, baby!
I understand how people spreading malicious lies about you (or your group)–especially when said lies are disseminated to folks who either don’t have enough experience with you (or your group) to counter the lies or whose own self-esteem is so abysmally low that that they just HAVE to feel superior to someone else–can be harmful in many ways, and how you can feel powerless to do anything about it except to just live your life and hope for the best. Several of “my” peoples (the Blacks, the Jews, and the gays) have been dealing with this shit since…well, goddman, it seems like forever. I also understand the need to challenge, wherever and whenver and as vociferously as is necessary, the bastards who tell such lies about us. HOWEVER, the notion that what one foul-hearted man (who had only so many listeners to begin with) says about you can irreparably and forevermore damage your reputation and your character to the degree that you feel that your only redress is to file civil suit against him leaves me speechless.
Okay, it doesn’t, hence What. The. Holy. Mother. Fuck?!
And, really, let’s think about this for a second. He called y’all nappy-headed ho’s. Make no mistake, that’s bad. I mean, totally uncalled for, seriously uncool, and (for those of us who actually have some semblence of \*real \* experience with the world and who use our brains for purposes other than wiping our asses) absolutely not true. Here’s my thing, though: Given a choice between having random people think of me as a nappy-headed ho and having them think of me–on both sight unseen and, uh, seen–as a rapist, a thief, a murderer, unintelligent, lazy, etc., and then having them deny me a job, an apartment, or just basic goddamn human dignity because they think those things about me, I’m going to go with nappy-headed ho.
Yeah, really.
I know, I know–I am not a Black woman (no matter how much I might pretend to be on the 2nd and 4th Saturday nights of any given month (well, Black _lady_, I should say))–and I know that y’all have some \*serious \* societal shit tossed your way. The point is, though, that, IMNSHO, “nappy-headed ho” doesn’t rise nearly to the level of \*half \* the shit that so many non-Black people have in store for Black folks, and if Ms. Vaughn doesn’t grasp that simple reality very, very soon, she’ll never, ever be ready for life as a Black person–male or female–in 21st century America. IOW, Sistah, if you really want somethin’ to cry about, don’t worry, they’ll give you something to \*\*really \*\* cry about!
'Nuff said.
Interested parties may now commence to telling me how lame (or even wrong-headed) my pitting is. (Though, really, it’s not so much a pitting–although there’s some of that going on–as it is an expression of my befuddlement and, yeah, concern that this young lady might be getting things just a little too twisted too early in what I hope will be a long, productive, successful life for her.)
\*'Cause it’ll probably sink faster than my thread last month about my visit (last month) to Atlanta in which I invited any interested Atlanta-area Dopers to hook up with me (well, to at least \*meet \* with me, anyway). 😉 And only two people responded, one of whom did so out of pity for the lack of responses I’d received. Yeah, bitches, I’m still licking those wounds! 😃 And just a little of this: ☹ .
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### Author:  [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/2 "2007-08-15T18:59:32Z")
I don’t understand it. What Imus said was deplorable, inexcusable, assholish; but it seems to me that the general response\*\* by far\*\* was in favor of the Rutgers student athletes. Is it really the case that her reputation has been damaged by Imus? Did anyone seriously believe that the team was comprised of whores?
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### Author:  [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/3 "2007-08-15T19:02:48Z")
I was going to say this is one of the cases that will disappear immediately because she cannot prove financial harm. But then I think this might be covered by per se defamation, seeing as calling someone a “ho” is impugning the chastity of a woman, in which case I seem to remember you don’t need to prove financial loss to win the case.
But then again, I don’t know anything about the law of New Jersey, assuming that is where she filed suit.
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### Author:  [@An\_Arky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Arky)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/4 "2007-08-15T19:04:22Z")
never mind…
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### Author:  [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/5 "2007-08-15T19:09:13Z")
The key issue here is Don Imus is rich. CBS and MSNBC are much richer still, there’s the possibility of a payout here, which is her primary motivation.
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### Author:  [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/6 "2007-08-15T19:13:09Z")
He called the entire team a name, not this one individual. If she’s so worried about her delicate reputation, perhaps she shouldn’t be filing high-profile frivolous lawsuits. To me, that makes her look like a ho indeed. Attention ho.
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### Author:  [@athelas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/athelas)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/7 "2007-08-15T19:21:50Z")
[QUOTE=Martin Hyde]
The key issue here is Don Imus is rich. CBS and MSNBC are much richer still, there’s the possibility of a payout here, which is her primary motivation.
[/QUOTE]
So your point is, she’s doing unscrupulous things in hope of monetary compensation? 😛
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### Author:  [@Li\_l\_Pluck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Li_l_Pluck)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/8 "2007-08-15T19:27:54Z")
[QUOTE=Contrapuntal]
I don’t understand it. What Imus said was deplorable, inexcusable, assholish; but it seems to me that the general response\*\* by far\*\* was in favor of the Rutgers student athletes. Is it really the case that her reputation has been damaged by Imus? Did anyone seriously believe that the team was comprised of whores?
[/QUOTE]
I recall similarly.
WRT her claims re defamation of character: I think that she’s getting at what I wrote in my post–that there are folks out there who’ll believe this shit (and I don’t think that, on its surface, that’s a specious claim–people who WANT to believe, against all evidence to the contrary, that Black women are all whores, or ho’s, will believe so because those people are seriously fucked up). My point is just that I don’t believe that Imus saying/implying it has the kind of power that Ms. Vaughn (or her attorney) is giving it, and certainly not \*solely \* because of Imus’s remarks. As you noted, the response was generally in favor of the women’s basketball team than in favor of Imus (among the less troglodyte of humans, anyway).
[QUOTE=villa]
I was going to say this is one of the cases that will disappear immediately because she cannot prove financial harm. But then I think this might be covered by per se defamation, seeing as calling someone a “ho” is impugning the chastity of a woman, in which case I seem to remember you don’t need to prove financial loss to win the case.
But then again, I don’t know anything about the law of New Jersey, assuming that is where she filed suit.
[/QUOTE]
I don’t know what’s involved in impugning the chastity of a woman (though I do long for the day when society leaves such Victorian concepts firmly in the past where they belong), but the suit was filed in Supreme Court in the Bronx (NY).
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### Author:  [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/9 "2007-08-15T19:30:37Z")
[QUOTE=Contrapuntal]
I don’t understand it. What Imus said was deplorable, inexcusable, assholish; but it seems to me that the general response\*\* by far\*\* was in favor of the Rutgers student athletes. Is it really the case that her reputation has been damaged by Imus? Did anyone seriously believe that the team was comprised of whores?
[/QUOTE]
Exactly my thought. I don’t think anyone but a bunch of fools whose opinions couldn’t be changed about the matter anyway agreed with Imus. We all realized that what he said was uncalled for, silly, hateful, and untrue. He was crucified (rightfully so) in the media for what he said. The girls on the team were shown as heroes for withstanding such hatred, as young, athletic, intelligent, college-aged women.
So how do you go about tarnishing that wonderful reputation that has been thrust upon you? Filing greedy and pointless lawsuits. Good job.
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### Author:  [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/10 "2007-08-15T19:32:28Z")
[QUOTE=Li’l Pluck]
I don’t know what’s involved in impugning the chastity of a woman (though I do long for the day when society leaves such Victorian concepts firmly in the past where they belong), but the suit was filed in Supreme Court in the Bronx (NY).
[/QUOTE]
Basically, calling a woman a ho is pretty much the text book definition (unless of course she is a ho). Other per se defamatory statements are one’s that say a professional sucks at his or her job, or states that a person has a social disease. I think, but can’t remember fully, that claiming someone eas gay used to be considered per se defamatory but is not any more.
I also should add, at this point, I know nothing about the laws of New York either.
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### Author:  [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/11 "2007-08-15T20:00:33Z")
[QUOTE=villa]
Basically, calling a woman a ho is pretty much the text book definition (unless of course she is a ho). Other per se defamatory statements are one’s that say a professional sucks at his or her job
[/QUOTE]
Well, there’s no actual contradition between being a ho _and_ sucking at one’s job.
In fact, I’d expect the latter to be a requirement of the former.
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### Author:  [@Omega\_Glory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omega_Glory)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/12 "2007-08-15T20:03:17Z")
[QUOTE=Contrapuntal]
I don’t understand it. What Imus said was deplorable, inexcusable, assholish; but it seems to me that the general response\*\* by far\*\* was in favor of the Rutgers student athletes. Is it really the case that her reputation has been damaged by Imus? Did anyone seriously believe that the team was comprised of whores?
[/QUOTE]
I agree with this, and \*_Lil’Pluck’s \*\* point that Imus doesn’t have enough power to sway people’s opinions on black women. I understand why she’d feel bad, but it’s time to let it go and move on. The man apologized, was bashed over a very long period by just about everyone and was fired. That’s enough_ in my opinion.
\*I do believe that the whole thing was blown way out of proportion though.
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### Author:  [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/13 "2007-08-15T20:46:50Z")
I think people take more crap right here in the Pit than she took from Imus. Maybe we should all sue each other.
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### Author:  [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/14 "2007-08-15T20:55:57Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal]
I think people take more crap right here in the Pit than she took from Imus. Maybe we should all sue each other.
[/QUOTE]
Should? You mean the process server STILL hasn’t gotten to your house? I tell ya, good help is hard to find these days…
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### Author:  [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/15 "2007-08-15T20:57:21Z")
[QUOTE=villa]
… per se defamatory statements …
[/QUOTE]
> [@](#):
>
> [**Defamation per se**](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slander_and_libel#Defamation_per_se)
>
> All states except Arizona, Arkansas, Mississippi, Missouri, and Tennessee recognize that some categories of statements are considered to be defamatory per se, such that **people making a defamation claim for these statements do not need to prove that the statement was defamatory**. In the common law tradition, **damages for such statements are presumed and do not have to be proven**. Traditionally, these per se defamatory statements include:
>
> ```
> * Allegations or imputations "injurious to another in their trade, business, or profession"
> * Allegations or imputations "of loathsome disease" (historically leprosy and sexually transmitted disease, now also including mental illness)
>
> ```
>
> \*\* \* Allegations or imputations of “unchastity” (usually only in unmarried people and sometimes only in women)\*\*
> \* Allegations or imputations of criminal activity (sometimes only crimes of moral turpitude)
Assuming Wikipedia (and my understanding) is correct, the case is a slam “dunk”.
CMC fnord!
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### Author:  [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/16 "2007-08-15T21:04:15Z")
[QUOTE=Zakalwe]
You mean the process server STILL hasn’t gotten to your house?
[/QUOTE]
Maybe he’s taking a nappy.
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### Author:  [@Xema](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xema)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/17 "2007-08-15T21:12:03Z")
[QUOTE=Li’l Pluck]
As you noted, the response was generally in favor of the women’s basketball team than in favor of Imus (among the less troglodyte of humans, anyway).
[/QUOTE]
It seemed to me that the public response was overwhelmingly against Imus. The strongest support he got was along the lines of “Well, I guess puerile, obnoxious, contemptible comments by a professional asshole are covered by the doctrine of free speech.”
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### Author:  [@descamisado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/descamisado)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/18 "2007-08-15T21:15:44Z")
[QUOTE=Xema]
It seemed to me that the public response was overwhelmingly against Imus. The strongest support he got was along the lines of “Well, I guess puerile, obnoxious, contemptible comments by a professional asshole are covered by the doctrine of free speech.”
[/QUOTE]
Don’t forget the supporters who reminded us of the fact that it was what he was paid to do. Long live capitalism!
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### Author:  [@BJMoose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BJMoose)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/19 "2007-08-15T21:17:26Z")
Gee, if imputing mental illness is now defamation _per se_, then I guess I can no longer say to someone, “You’re crazy!” ☹
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### Author:  [@Montgomery0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Montgomery0)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2007, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/don-imus-you-ruined-my-reputation-and-now-i-want-my-money-bitch/415700/20 "2007-08-15T21:52:27Z")
[QUOTE=athelas]
So your point is, she’s doing unscrupulous things in hope of monetary compensation? 😛
[/QUOTE]
Since the article specifically says there was no monetary amount specified, if she asked for a dollar and an apology, would that still make it unscrupulous? If not, what monetary amount would make it unscrupulous?
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