# Donald Just Lost The Election **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 16, 2016, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103 "2016-09-16T18:03:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/201 "2016-09-20T02:29:43Z")
My fear and prediction is that Clinton has no effective manner to oppose Trump’s lies. Burdened by inherent societal misogyny, 25 years of slander embedded into the public consciousness, and the lack of charisma, the general public just won’t buy anything she says standing next to the supremely confident bluster of a man who is unburdened by knowledge, scruples, policy, or thought. He won’t need a friendly crowd to pull it off. The only way I can see it going badly for him is if Clinton and the moderators actually goad him into popping a gasket and he actually throws an uncontrolled, wild-eyed, drooling fit. I have no confidence in the mainstream press as moderators when they have spent the last year alternately kissing his ass and giving him a pass on every damn thing. Political journalism is dead. The last year of press coverage shows you how a democracy elects a dictator. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/202 "2016-09-20T02:49:58Z")
Why are you throwing the “D” word around? What particular Trump proposals do you feel are most dictator-like? ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/203 "2016-09-20T02:52:56Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > My fear and prediction is that Clinton has no effective manner to oppose Trump’s lies. Burdened by inherent societal misogyny, 25 years of slander embedded into the public consciousness, and the lack of charisma, the general public just won’t buy anything she says standing next to the supremely confident bluster of a man who is unburdened by knowledge, scruples, policy, or thought. He won’t need a friendly crowd to pull it off. > > The only way I can see it going badly for him is if Clinton and the moderators actually goad him into popping a gasket and he actually throws an uncontrolled, wild-eyed, drooling fit. > > I have no confidence in the mainstream press as moderators when they have spent the last year alternately kissing his ass and giving him a pass on every damn thing. > > Political journalism is dead. The last year of press coverage shows you how a democracy elects a dictator. That’s some hyperbole. How would The Donald amass the power over the other branches and American people and military to act as a despot? ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/204 "2016-09-20T02:55:17Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Why are you throwing the “D” word around? What particular Trump proposals do you feel are most dictator-like? His thoughts on [libel laws](http://thefederalist.com/2016/03/22/donald-trump-doesnt-understand-libel-laws/) are pretty dictatory. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/205 "2016-09-20T02:56:22Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Why are you throwing the “D” word around? What particular Trump proposals do you feel are most dictator-like? For starters he said first that he would torture prisoners. And even kill the families of our enemies. Had to back away from those when he found it was against the law now. But never fear, he has said later that if he becomes president he will remove those pesky laws. > **[U.S. Spies Slam Donald Trump’s Torture Push](https://www.thedailybeast.com/us-spies-slam-donald-trumps-torture-push)** > > The candidate’s threats after the Brussels attacks to ‘do a lot more than waterboarding’ may have his rally crowds going wild—but intel officials tell The Daily Beast they’re alarmed. > **[Donald Trump on terrorists: ‘Take out their families’ | CNN Politics](https://www.cnn.com/2015/12/02/politics/donald-trump-terrorists-families/)** > > Donald Trump said Wednesday that he would kill the families of terrorists in order to win the fight against ISIS. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/206 "2016-09-20T03:27:56Z")
> [@Lance\_Turbo](#): > > His thoughts on [libel laws](http://thefederalist.com/2016/03/22/donald-trump-doesnt-understand-libel-laws/) are pretty dictatory. Meh, respect for the First Amendment seems on the decline on both the left and the right. The left wages war against the Citizens United decision, Trump threatens libel lawsuits, the Dems on the FCC wants to stifle conservative voices on the radio and internet, the IRS targets conservative organizations, college kids cry to the university president when people chalk “Trump for President” on the sidewalk, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Tee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@Tee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tee)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/207 "2016-09-20T03:40:02Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > The fact that Trump (and the other birthers) kept birthering on after the long-form was released in 2011 shows (if it wasn’t abundantly clear before) that birtherism was never about records, never about proof or evidence, and never about anything other than deligitimizing and de-Americanizing Barack Obama. …yes and no. It could be _all_ about the birth certificate, and not the question of, or the doubting of, Obama’s place of birth. When I worked for Republican politicians in NH, in 2008, there were questions about both Obama and McCain with respect to citizenship. These quieted among most people before the election. The issue turned into some people loudly demanding that Obama release his actual birth certificate, then for some third party or other to produce one. I had a unique insight into this that legions of other people did not – when my first child was born, her father and I weren’t married. Her birth certificate from a small, sleepy New England town reflects this with additional layers of privacy and some rather surprising and outdated phrasing upon it. Her long form is strictly official, and does not have any of that. So I had a pretty good guess as to the answer to both questions that ran concurrently for a while – why won’t they shut up about the birth certificate, and why won’t Obama release it? It’s the documentation itself that was the prize, IMO, and not the vetting questions it would purportedly satisfy. You can see Trump sort of hinting around at it in this [transcript](http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1104/26/acd.02.html) in 2011. I’ve just skimmed today’s stories but he hasn’t exactly challenged my beliefs here - Obama being born in the US is not in doubt (according to Trump), Trump did not start the rumors that he wasn’t (granted), but he’s long aspired to obtain that record anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/208 "2016-09-20T03:42:31Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > That’s some hyperbole. How would The Donald amass the power over the other branches and American people and military to act as a despot? Besides the mass deportation of US citizens, declaring that criminal suspects shouldn’t receive medical care or legal representation or food, wanting to detain people indefinitely without trial, censoring the media, wanting to shut down parts of the internet, calling “freedom of expression” a threat to national security, imposing religious tests on the population, declaring that only he can “fix” the country, wanting to replace the military leadership with people loyal to him and massively build up its size, threatening to start wars unilaterally, and suggesting that his opponents be murdered? I’m sure I’ll think of something. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/209 "2016-09-20T03:54:43Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Besides the mass deportation of US citizens, declaring that criminal suspects shouldn’t receive medical care or legal representation or food, wanting to detain people indefinitely without trial, censoring the media, wanting to shut down parts of the internet, calling “freedom of expression” a threat to national security, imposing religious tests on the population, declaring that only he can “fix” the country, wanting to replace the military leadership with people loyal to him and massively build up its size, threatening to start wars unilaterally, and suggesting that his opponents be murdered? > > I’m sure I’ll think of something. But first, a question for **octopus** : Would you consider the actions described by **Smapti** to be those of a despot…or those of a president you desire to be in power? ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/210 "2016-09-20T04:25:10Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Why are you throwing the “D” word around? What particular Trump proposals do you feel are most dictator-like? That as President, he would issue an Executive Order requiring a mandatory death penalty for anyone who kills a police officer. Legislation by executive order is tyranny. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/211 "2016-09-20T04:31:53Z")
Honestly, don’t know what to believe any more, but cite? Not suspicious, just dazed and confused. In a way I don’t like. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/212 "2016-09-20T11:40:36Z")
FWIW, and it’s early yet, the first polls including the date the op identified as “the day” are out this morning. NBC/SM Clinton +5 in the two-way and the two-way LV both. RV to RV it was +6, up two points from the previous week. The LA Times tracker moved two points Clintonward too. Note, the majority of the polling period was not after the date in question. Trackers may not be great for absolute amount but they do well for trends, especially when they agree. Not enough to conclude anything from but consistent with the premise of the op so far. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/213 "2016-09-20T13:16:35Z")
At the very least, the Clinton slide seems to have been arrested. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/214 "2016-09-20T13:45:35Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > the Dems on the FCC wants to stifle conservative voices on the radio and internet, the IRS targets conservative organizations Cite for these please. > [@](#): > > college kids cry to the university president when people chalk “Trump for President” on the sidewalk, etc. Ummm…“crying to the university president” is an action protected by the first amendment. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/215 "2016-09-20T14:46:29Z")
THe latter was already admitted by the IRS, the former is harder to prove, but the Democrats on the FEC want to start regulating the internet: > **[FEC opening door to Internet regulation – again?](https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fec-opening-door-to-internet-regulation-again)** > > Democrats on the nation's top campaign finance regulator may be opening the door once again to regulating political content on the Internet, Republicans warn – despite claims to the contrary a year ago. And the impetus was a conservative organization running youtube ads. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/216 "2016-09-20T14:48:41Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > THe latter was already admitted by the IRS, the former is harder to prove, but the Democrats on the FEC want to start regulating the internet: > > [FEC opening door to Internet regulation – again? | Fox News](http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/08/19/fec-opening-door-to-internet-regulation-again.html) > > And the impetus was a conservative organization running youtube ads. Have you got a link that doesn’t have a Fox Editorial filter attached to it? Something more “newsy”? ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/217 "2016-09-20T15:21:54Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > the former is harder to prove, but the Democrats on the FEC want to start regulating the internet By “harder to prove” do you mean “there is no proof”? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/218 "2016-09-20T15:24:19Z")
Many people think that makes it harder. Not so many as we might hope, but still… ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/219 "2016-09-20T15:48:51Z")
> [@Tee](#): > > …yes and no. It could be _all_ about the birth certificate, and not the question of, or the doubting of, Obama’s place of birth… > > The issue turned into some people loudly demanding that Obama release his actual birth certificate, then for some third party or other to produce one. I had a unique insight … when my first child was born, her father and I weren’t married… So I had a pretty good guess as to the answer to both questions that ran concurrently for a while – why won’t they shut up about the birth certificate, and why won’t Obama release it? > > It’s the documentation itself that was the prize, IMO, and not the vetting questions it would purportedly satisfy. You can see Trump sort of hinting around at it in this [transcript](http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1104/26/acd.02.html) in 2011. I’ve just skimmed today’s stories but he hasn’t exactly challenged my beliefs here - Obama being born in the US is not in doubt (according to Trump), Trump did not start the rumors that he wasn’t (granted), but he’s long aspired to obtain that record anyway. I cannot make sense of your post. :o I don’t understand the intents of parts. Some parts that I do understand are clearly false. Something I might glean is a concern that Obama’s parents weren’t married — is that it? I didn’t study the transcript you linked to. I did scan it for the first quote by Mr. Trump. Here it is: (Was this your point?) [QUOTE=Donald J. Trump in 2011 CNN interview] There was supposed to be a birth certificate. _ **I don’t think it exists** _, Anderson. I hope it exists, but _ **I don’t think it exists** _. [my emphasis] [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103/220 "2016-09-20T15:51:43Z")
Doesn’t necessarily mean it _never_ existed! Only that it does not _currently_ exist. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-just-lost-the-election/766103.md?page=12)