# Donald Trump is now a birther **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 17, 2011, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044 "2011-03-17T17:38:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 42
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/821 "2011-04-27T03:02:57Z")
I will still reitereate, incidentally, that I don’t know how anyone can listen to Obama speak extemporaneosly for more than 30 or 40 seconds and not see that he’s got a lot going on upstairs. I have a lot going on upstairs and I can see that Obama is smarter than me. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/822 "2011-04-27T03:05:54Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > [Not usually, but exceptions are made for students from wealthy, politically well-connected families](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_W._Bush). We’re not talking about just being admitted into Harvard. Yes, Bush got in as a legacy (affirmative action for rich people), but he wasn’t chosen as President of the Harvard Law Review, which is a different kettle of fish. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/823 "2011-04-27T03:38:56Z")
**’luci** ’s post didn’t specify, and Trump was crowing about getting into Harvard, so slag off, my point stands. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/824 "2011-04-27T03:40:24Z")
They were probably impressed that he incorporated so much _sharia_ law and Marxism into his writing, as well as charming folk tales from his native Kenya. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/825 "2011-04-27T04:05:18Z")
Well, it looks like _CNN_ is inadvertently throwing fuel on the fire regarding Obama’s birth. In [this article](http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/04/25/birthers.obama.hawaii/index.html?hpt=C1) entitled “ **CNN investigation: Obama born in U.S.** ”, _CNN_ reveals that, contrary to strenuous assertions made by some on this board, Obama could indeed view and make copies of his original birth certificate (the one his legal certificate is based upon) through the Freedom of Information Act. This of course is merely going to fan the flames of those who question why he doesn’t do just that. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/826 "2011-04-27T04:08:39Z")
Sure. And then what? He’s going to travel to the home of each and every person who questions his birth certificate and go over it in detail in person with each and every one of them? I mean, pictures of it online and on TV clearly aren’t enough. The word of every government official that has access to it isn’t enough. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/827 "2011-04-27T04:09:39Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > Sure. And then what? He’s going to travel to the home of each and every person who questions his birth certificate and go over it in detail in person with each and every one of them? I mean, pictures of it online and on TV clearly aren’t enough. The word of every government official that has access to it isn’t enough. Pictures of it haven’t been online or on TV. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/828 "2011-04-27T04:12:56Z")
Could be because he doesn’t want to go on air to deny he fucks pigs. 'sides, the birthers would just say he showed a forgery anyway. There’s really no point in bothering. ---
**Author:** ![Lamar\_Mundane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lamar\_Mundane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamar_Mundane)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/829 "2011-04-27T04:15:57Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Well, it looks like _CNN_ is inadvertently throwing fuel on the fire regarding Obama’s birth. In [this article](http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/04/25/birthers.obama.hawaii/index.html?hpt=C1) entitled “ **CNN investigation: Obama born in U.S.** ”, _CNN_ reveals that, contrary to strenuous assertions made by some on this board, Obama could indeed view and make copies of his original birth certificate (the one his legal certificate is based upon) through the Freedom of Information Act. > > This of course is merely going to fan the flames of those who question why he doesn’t do just that. The same reporter in the same report also interviews the Republican head of the Department of Health in the prior Republican administration, where she says she has seen the original birth certificate, which is not a legal document like the Certificate of Live Birth. It also confirms a woman who gave birth in the same hospital hours later as seeing the baby Barack in the nursery. It also has an interview with an editor at the Honolulu paper which printed a birth announcement where it was confirmed that the birth data came from the Hawaii Department of Health and not from parents or grandparents. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/830 "2011-04-27T04:18:10Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Pictures of it haven’t been online or on TV. [God](http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/06/obama-birth.html), [you’re](http://fightthesmears.com/articles/5/birthcertificate.html) [fucking](http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html) [stupid.](http://urbanlegends.about.com/od/barackobama/a/obama_birth_certificate.htm) You were doing better when you were trying to claim that honest but ill-informed opinions were just as legitimate as well-researched ones. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/831 "2011-04-27T04:19:08Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Pictures of it haven’t been online or on TV. Point of order, you \*\*are \*\*supposed to be just a defender of recently born people that are not aware of the issue, you are now going birther. Obama showed the legal certificate that Hawaii gave him and Obama posted it already on TV and the video is shown on the article you posted. As the courts already demonstrated, there is no need for other documents. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/832 "2011-04-27T04:26:43Z")
None of them say “long form” anywhere. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/833 "2011-04-27T04:56:34Z")
> [@Lamar\_Mundane](#): > > The same reporter in the same report also interviews the Republican head of the Department of Health in the prior Republican administration, where she says she has seen the original birth certificate, which is not a legal document like the Certificate of Live Birth. It also confirms a woman who gave birth in the same hospital hours later as seeing the baby Barack in the nursery. It also has an interview with an editor at the Honolulu paper which printed a birth announcement where it was confirmed that the birth data came from the Hawaii Department of Health and not from parents or grandparents. You are correct. > [@Bosstone](#): > > God, you’re fucking stupid. Not one of those links pertains to the original document referred to in the _CNN_ article. > [@GIGObuster](#): > > Point of order, you are supposed to be just a defender of recently born people that are not aware of the issue, you are now going birther. Not a bit of it. I’m merely relaying information from a _CNN News_ article which reveals Obama could indeed view and make copies of his original certificate. This is called “fighting ignorance”, since many posters here have claimed that Hawaiian law prevents his doing so. Have we finally reached the point on this board where unpopular facts are verboten and grounds for character assassination? > [@GIGObuster](#): > > Obama showed the legal certificate that Hawaii gave him and Obama posted it already on TV and the video is shown on the article you posted. > > As the courts already demonstrated, there is no need for other documents. Unfortunately, we’re not in a court of law, we’re in the court of public opinion. And like it or not, as long as the original certificate exists, people are going to wonder what it contains that may be different from the secondary, albeit legally accepted, document. > [@elucidator](#): > > None of them say “long form” anywhere. You’ll note that I referred to it the same way the article did, which was as his “original birth certificate.” ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/834 "2011-04-27T05:03:31Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Unfortunately, we’re not in a court of law, we’re in the court of public opinion. And like it or not, as long as the original certificate exists, people are going to wonder what it contains that may be different from the secondary, albeit legally accepted, document. Like it or not, the opinion of many dopers is that you are not fooling anyone with your act of defending the poor fringe of a fringe of a fringe. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/835 "2011-04-27T05:12:45Z")
Meh, people will believe what they want to believe. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/836 "2011-04-27T05:16:11Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Not a bit of it. I’m merely relaying information from a _CNN News_ article which reveals Obama could indeed view and make copies of his original certificate. This is called “fighting ignorance”, since many posters here have claimed that Hawaiian law prevents his doing so. > > Have we finally reached the point on this board where unpopular facts are verboten and grounds for character assassination? Read it again, I did clarify on the same post that since the courts (and congress) did not demand other documents, the point you are making is a moot one. And still a silly a one, a freedom of information request does not guarantee that the person requesting it will get what it wants. And typically: a mess of names and personal information from others is blackened out if they release the images. Perfect fodder for conspiracy theorists, so forget about it. As many republican leaders have already done. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/837 "2011-04-27T05:18:03Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > …Have we finally reached the point on this board where unpopular facts are verboten and grounds for character assassination? … Yes. We are on the banks of the Crimea River. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/838 "2011-04-27T05:32:02Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Meh, people will believe what they want to believe. On that we can agree. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/839 "2011-04-27T05:46:09Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > Read it again, I did clarify on the same post that since the courts (and congress) did not demand other documents, the point you are making is a moot one. It’s legally moot but not politically moot, as the reason for this very thread illustrates. > [@GIGObuster](#): > > And still a silly a one, a freedom of information request does not guarantee that the person requesting it will get what it wants. And typically: a mess of names and personal information from others is blackened out if they release the images. Perfect fodder for conspiracy theorists… This may be a valid point. Though I can’t help but think that if the President of the United States made a legal request for his original birth document to be released without redactions, given that the only other people likely to be mentioned are his parents and doctor and already publically known, it would be relatively easy for him to do so. I could see where things like his parents’ address or telephone number could be subject to redaction in order to prevent their becoming a bother to the people who have them now, but that’s about it. > [@GIGObuster](#): > > …so forget about it. As many republican leaders have already done. I’m not a birther so there’s nothing to forget. It just seemed to me to be a good idea to post the CNN article which seems a credible source for the ability of Obama to obtain and release copies of his original certificate - something which has been vehemently denied around here for ages. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044/840 "2011-04-27T06:30:37Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > I’m not a birther so there’s nothing to forget. Ah, good to kno… > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > It just seemed to me to be a good idea to post the CNN article which seems a credible source for the ability of Obama to obtain and release copies of his original certificate - something which has been vehemently denied around here for ages. Darn, not even you can lie to yourself huh? Do you have a cite from any of the people you are defending that had no position on this issue until recently? As for the people here “vehemently denying it”. Can you have a cite for that? AFAIR most of the people did point out to the law restrictions, even a freedom of information act does not automatically remove other laws in the books. As I have learned in past discussions on FOI requests. That is also a reason why it is not a guarantee that you will get it, so unless you can show deniers pointing to the FOI act issue in this board and most of us denying it, you are just deluding yourself. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044.md?page=41) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-is-now-a-birther/575044.md?page=43)