# Donald Trump winks and nods to the Second Amendment people **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [August 9, 2016, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283 "2016-08-09T22:03:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![Chihuahua](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dec6dc/32.png) [@Chihuahua](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chihuahua)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/221 "2016-08-10T23:57:03Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > And that’s all that matters. > > Someone who’s a nominee for president ought to know that not everyone will see it as a joke. And if someone can’t understand that, they’re simply not qualified for office. > > Sometimes I think Trump honestly is just an experiment to show how utterly fucking stupid the average American is and why we should scrap democracy. Yup. Anyone who interpreted it as a joke or claims it was a joke is deliberately ignoring the context in which it takes place. This is a country where Presidents have been murdered by lone and apparently self motivated snipers, where mass shootings happen almost daily, and where in the not-too-distant past an Arizona politician was shot in the head by an assailant after being subject to similar threats. The Gabbie Giffords shooting is particularly instructive because a Republican PAC had implied that she should be targeted. But the connection was vague enough that no one could definitely prove the PAC literally meant violence. Further, I would point to Gary Kasparov’s recent statements about how business gets done in Russia. The government actively advocates for aggression against political opponents with the same kind of rhetoric and then shrugs when the target mysteriously winds up dead. Anyone who tries to minimize Trump’s statements is ignoring the fact that this is EXACTLY what fascists do and it routinely does end in REAL violence. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/222 "2016-08-11T00:16:01Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > By “success” you mean “losing an election against the worst Democratic candidate in a generation,” right? I just googled “Richard Nixon in a pantsuit” and got a lot more hits than I expected. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/223 "2016-08-11T00:31:57Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > I just googled “Richard Nixon in a pantsuit” and got a lot more hits than I expected. How many were actually Nixon in a pantsuit? ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/224 "2016-08-11T00:38:08Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Wait, I missed the page break. Did **octopus** really just claim that “not raping and enslaving” is a silly and arbitrary standard? It’s not that hard to click and read a previous page. How about not asking stupid and deliberately misleading questions that if you really were trying to get the answer of looking a page back would have been quicker than typing you’re posted question? Answer it for yourself and quote where I said what you insinuate I said. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/225 "2016-08-11T00:42:21Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > By “success” you mean “losing an election against the worst Democratic candidate in a generation,” right? Because that’s like Charlie Sheen tiger-blood winning, and I’m satisfied if that’s how Trump goes down. > > The fact that moral axioms aren’t universal does not signal their irrelevancy, despite what some college-dorm-level nihilism philosophy would suggest. Who in this thread suggested they were irrelevant? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/226 "2016-08-11T00:42:55Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > Could someone plese explain to me what’s in this for Rudy Giuliani? For some reason, the press is giving him time whenever he feels the need to mop up what Trump has spilled on the floor. He couldn’t wait to spin Trump’s 2A call to arms yesterday. What is Rudy after, a fat cabinet position? A member of the inner circle of advisers? > > Rudy better hope Trump doesn’t make a sharp turn least Rudy ends up with a broken nose. > > I agree with what Dan Rather said today about this whole mess of an election. > > \*“To anyone who still pretends this is a normal election of Republican against Democrat, history is watching. And I suspect its verdict will be harsh,” \* > > I think the worst thing a Republican can have on their resume post November will be “I endorsed Trump.” I personally think Rudy wants to be appointed AG so he can carry through on filing those charges against Hillary that he said he would’ve while the FBI investigation was still going on. ETA: Not surprisingly, I was very late to that particular party. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/227 "2016-08-11T00:48:43Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Who in this thread suggested they were irrelevant? Oh, I’m sorry, is that the kind of discussion you’re seeking, where you say something outrageous and then try to nitpick to death any paraphrase of your position instead of admitting it’s outrageous? I wish you the best of luck having that conversation with someone else; I find it a contemptible sort of conversation to engage in. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/228 "2016-08-11T01:00:02Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > We haven’t had a slave-owning President since [Ulysses Grant](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Presidents_of_the_United_States_who_owned_slaves) > > Who was the rapist president? Trump has a rape case, pre-trial hearings start on September 9th - were you talking about him, **Octopus**? > [@octopus](#): > > Wasn’t Jefferson a rapist? Can a slave give consent? And the point was that as history has shown the standards for president, senator, governor, or mayor aren’t that high. So, your arguments are like Newt Gingrich’s: “By the standards of the 19th century, in some ways he’s very qualified!” You may wish to check your calendar. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/229 "2016-08-11T01:03:54Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Oh, I’m sorry, is that the kind of discussion you’re seeking, where you say something outrageous and then try to nitpick to death any paraphrase of your position instead of admitting it’s outrageous? > > I wish you the best of luck having that conversation with someone else; I find it a contemptible sort of conversation to engage in. If you read what I wrote you’d find nothing outrageous. Reread what I wrote and quote what the outrageous part is. Neither you nor Chronos can even when you accuse and insinuate otherwise. That’s what’s contemptible. Why “paraphrase” when it’s more accurate and quicker to directly quote? What do you gain from paraphrasing instead of directly quoting? ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/230 "2016-08-11T01:04:22Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > And your proof for that is that someone posted it on the internet? Really?? You’re going to hang your hat on that? How about [a Trump supporter calling in to C-SPAN to say Trump is telling them to prepare for a revolution?](http://www.rawstory.com/2016/08/trump-backer-tells-c-span-second-amendment-remark-means-brace-for-armed-revolt-not-assassination/) ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/231 "2016-08-11T01:06:51Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > So, your arguments are like Newt Gingrich’s: “By the standards of the 19th century, in some ways he’s very qualified!” > > You may wish to check your calendar. Hmm. Funny that a truthful answer to a simple question is so contentious and misunderstood. The question was about the requirement of standards for a presidential candidate. The answer was Trump meets them and actually exceeds the behavior of actual former presidents. It’s a simple statement that doesn’t require endless inaccurate nitpickery or analysis. Reminds me of those who called me a racist for suggesting that those who own a Confederate flag may own it for reasons other that those who dislike said flag may imagine. People have a hard time reading simple sentences for what they are. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/232 "2016-08-11T01:09:14Z")
> [@MN\_Maenad](#): > > Look! A new explanation! [Linky](http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/katrina-pierson-second-amendment-nra) Trump didn’t hire Katrina Pierson for her intellectual acumen. He hired her for Blow Job Mouth. Not sure why the campaign lets her talk on the teevee. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/233 "2016-08-11T01:19:00Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > If you read what I wrote you’d find nothing outrageous. Reread what I wrote and quote what the outrageous part is. Gee, you make that sort of conversation sound like so much fun! But no, it’s not something I’ll engage in with you. Good luck finding a partner for it! If you need to get in the last word, feel free to imagine that I’ve repeated this response as needed :). ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/234 "2016-08-11T01:24:52Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > How about [a Trump supporter calling in to C-SPAN to say Trump is telling them to prepare for a revolution?](http://www.rawstory.com/2016/08/trump-backer-tells-c-span-second-amendment-remark-means-brace-for-armed-revolt-not-assassination/) How about folks in this thread saying his remarks can only be interpreted as assassination? I have no idea how serious this guy is. Lots of people make crank phone calls. He could be serious, he could be a crank. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/235 "2016-08-11T01:45:08Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Hmm. Funny that a truthful answer to a simple question is so contentious and misunderstood. The question was about the requirement of standards for a presidential candidate. The answer was Trump meets them and actually exceeds the behavior of actual former presidents. It’s a simple statement that doesn’t require endless inaccurate nitpickery or analysis. > > Reminds me of those who called me a racist for suggesting that those who own a Confederate flag may own it for reasons other that those who dislike said flag may imagine. People have a hard time reading simple sentences for what they are. > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Gee, you make that sort of conversation sound like so much fun! But no, it’s not something I’ll engage in with you. Good luck finding a partner for it! > > If you need to get in the last word, feel free to imagine that I’ve repeated this response as needed :). Get that strawman. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/236 "2016-08-11T01:47:27Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Hmm. Funny that a truthful answer to a simple question is so contentious and misunderstood. The question was about the requirement of standards for a presidential candidate. The answer was Trump meets them and actually exceeds the behavior of actual former presidents. It’s a simple statement that doesn’t require endless inaccurate nitpickery or analysis. > > Reminds me of those who called me a racist for suggesting that those who own a Confederate flag may own it for reasons other that those who dislike said flag may imagine. People have a hard time reading simple sentences for what they are. [Quote=Newt Gingrich 8-9-16] Sure. I mean, he is at least as reliable as Andrew Jackson, who was one of the most decisive presidents in American history [/quote] Trail of Tears anyone? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/237 "2016-08-11T02:15:10Z")
> [@Ukulele\_Ike](#): > > Trump didn’t hire Katrina Pierson for her intellectual acumen. He hired her for Blow Job Mouth. > > Not sure why the campaign lets her talk on the teevee. The most amusing part is how all the spokesbots are on their own to come up with an explanation. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/238 "2016-08-11T02:25:55Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > How many were actually Nixon in a pantsuit? No no no - it was Hoover in a pantsuit! ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/239 "2016-08-11T03:22:27Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Lots of people make crank phone calls. Hey grandpa, 1989 called. They want to know if your refrigerator is still running! ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2016, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283/240 "2016-08-11T03:35:26Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > So he’s postulating a Hillary win and saying there’s nothing that can be done to stop her from picking judges. Except for 2nd amendment people my have a way. Obvious to me that he advocates shooting somebody, particularly when the next sentence says how horrible that would be. Yes, and moreover: if it’s about mobilizing voters who care about the SCOTUS, why wouldn’t religious conservatives be at the top of that list? They are usually the ones most concerned about, and motivated by, the Court; yet they were curiously absent from his remark there. > [@aldiboronti](#): > > Calm down, guys. I get the outrage but this was clearly a joke. Sure, in extremely bad taste and highly dangerous but surely nobody believes he was serious. There is no such thing as “just a joke”: [https://storify.com/5thCircAppeals/on-trump-just-joking](https://storify.com/5thCircAppeals/on-trump-just-joking) > [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > I remember her saying this and found it extremely gross and indefensible. Good reminder that Hillary isn’t above saying irresponsible things, too. I found it perfectly defensible at the time, if not advisable in retrospect. I thought it was obvious (and I was a strong Obama supporter at the time) that she was not even hinting “hey, maybe Obama will get assassinated, you never know” but rather “let’s not declare the race over so soon: we remember Bobby Kennedy getting assassinated in June, when he won the California primary in what was still an actively contested race” (whether Bobby had any realistic shot at the nomination was doubtful, but…). > [@JohnT](#): > > We haven’t had a slave-owning President since [Ulysses Grant](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Presidents_of_the_United_States_who_owned_slaves) As a huge fan of Grant, I would like to add this context from your cite: > [@](#): > > Although he later served as a general in the Union Army, Grant had control of slaves owned by his wife. He owned a slave, William Jones, from 1857 to 1859. Grant freed Jones rather than sell him, despite financial need. During the Civil War, he enlisted displaced slaves into the Union war effort and had them paid for their service. > [@Steve\_MB](#): > > An overlooked aspect of the story – [Wilmington, North Carolina’s](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/08/10/1558813/-Wilmington-NC-Massacre,-TerrorWhite-Supremacist-Coup-of-1898:-Trump-Went-There) connection to “Second Amendment solutions” has a certain resemblance to [Philadelphia, Mississippi’s](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reagan's_Neshoba_County_Fair_%22states'_rights%22_speech) connection to “state’s rights”. Good catch. I hope people never forget how despicable Reagan was. > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > So your objection to people trying to hold presidential candidates to a standard is that in the past people didn’t hold presidents to a standard? Are you sure that’s the best you can do? It’s an interesting question. When Ralph Nader was running for president, he was asked on PBS Newshour which president he saw as a role model, and without hesitation he answered “Jefferson”. I always thought that was kind of interesting given that he represented the sort of purist left, yet he most admired a president who had slaves and arguably raped at least one of them. > [@Folly](#): > > It’s a perfectly cromulent word. Used because there is no adverb form of embiggens. Heh, that must be it. > [@jsc1953](#): > > As a sidebar on this latest outrage, an interesting development in how the media is covering Trump. > > I’ve noticed several times, most lately on NPR’s coverage of this story, that the reporting on what Trump has said will point out his blatant falsehoods in the body of the story. Not with some link to fact-check, and not with a pair of fair & balanced talking heads arguing both sides…no, they’re flat out calling him a liar. > > Example: they said Trump “falsely” claimed that Hillary wants to repeal the 2nd Amendment, and added that the President has no power to do so. Yes, I noticed that too–and good on them, as otherwise the back-and-forth on this would reinforce a notion that Hillary is going to repeal the 2nd Amendment. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trump-winks-and-nods-to-the-second-amendment-people/762283.md?page=13)