# Donald Trump's 2016 General Election Campaign **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 4, 2016, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901 "2016-05-04T02:37:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 107
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2122 "2016-07-01T14:18:52Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Well it might change some people who are just voting against Hillary but aren’t really Trump supporters. If it gets cemented that he’s “just as much a crook as she is” then maybe some of them will vote for the coherent sane crook. “Vote for the coherent sane crook. It’s important!” ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2123 "2016-07-01T14:22:10Z")
I’m sorry - are you suggesting that we shouldn’t investigate Donald’s shady charity because Donald’s idiot fans will go on being idiots? Because that’s what it sounds like you’re suggesting. As for whose mind I’m hoping to change - that would be the minds at the IRS and the NY attorney’s office. I’d like to see them open investigations for fraud on the part of Donald’s Foundation and his efforts to raise money for charity. Or, you know, “charity”. Or - wait, is that your objection? You don’t want anyone looking too closely at anyone’s eponymous charity? ---
**Author:** ![ebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c57346/32.png) [@ebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ebb)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2124 "2016-07-01T14:36:07Z")
[QUOTE=Donald Trump] “I go to Ohio, we were there two days ago, and Pennsylvania and near Pittsburgh and we — I was in West Virginia, the crowds are massive. And you know, I walked out of one, and I said, ‘I don’t see how I’m not leading,'” Trump said, invoking the size of his crowds. "We have thousands of people standing outside trying to get in, and they’re great people and they have such spirit for the country and love for the country, and I’m saying, you know, ‘Why am I not doing better in the polls? … "But you know, you have to understand, your show, no, but many shows it’s just a constant hit from mainstream media, no matter what you do, it’s always a negative.” [/QUOTE] It’s like he built a Potemkin village for himself and now believes it to be true. There’s no realization at all of the gap between thousands of dedicated fans showing up for a rally and the tens of millions of supporters you need to win an actual election. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2125 "2016-07-01T14:40:59Z")
@Merneith: Since we are in the elections forum and a thread on Trump’s election campaign, I think DSeid can be forgiven for focusing on how all that charity fraud affects the election rather than future IRS audits. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2126 "2016-07-01T14:46:31Z")
He loves it! He _loves_ the roaring crowds, he feeds on the energy like a tick feeds on blood! There is no drug on Earth comes even close, especially for an ego-bloated narcissist. Bumping uglies with a supermodel wife, sure, pretty good. Not bad. But being the focus of insane love from ten thousand nutbars? Nothing to compare. He doesn’t want to hear about toning down his rhetoric, doesn’t want to hear that rallies are not as effective as having campaign workers and offices, he believes in magic, he _feels_ magic, he knows it is real and it works! And if it doesn’t? Then he was _robbed_, the people are totally with him, he just saw the people the other day, and they _love_ him! ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2127 "2016-07-01T14:53:14Z")
**Merneith** , No, I am merely saying that it is not so much “a gift” other than within our already detesting him circles. It has and will have no impact on the assessments held by most voters. Sure prosecute away because crooks should be punished\*, but in terms of impacting the election? **CarnalK** ’s response is the most meaningful one. Depending on the poll something like one in five registered voters are undecided or preferring a third party. If they are not voting against him based on all of his other negatives, will his being a long time relatively petty crook and tax cheat have much impact as they decide? “Joe Schlobotnik … he’s a drug-dealer, a rapist and a murderer who says what I want to say but can’t … maybe I’ll vote for him … oh he claimed a charitable donation he wasn’t entitled to? Well in _that_ case …” \*And after all even Al Capone was taken down on tax evasion. ---
**Author:** ![Uncle\_Jocko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uncle_jocko/32/2932_2.png) [@Uncle\_Jocko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uncle_Jocko)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2128 "2016-07-01T15:00:50Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > @Merneith: > Since we are in the elections forum and a thread on Trump’s election campaign, I think DSeid can be forgiven for focusing on how all that charity fraud affects the election rather than future IRS audits. Well, if _Trump_ ends up being the presidential candidate getting indicted before the election, in an ironic turn of events that puts Donald’s face in the dictionary next to the word “irony,” that might have some affect on the election. Maybe. Or maybe all the blowhards calling for Hillary to be in jail would just ignore the situation completely. Like so many of The Donald’s other wilder statements/policies/tweets that would have sunk a “lesser” candidate months and months ago. (Not that I think this charity fraud rises to the level of indictment, but if it did - man, would that be funny!) ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2129 "2016-07-01T15:04:11Z")
I think what DSeid may be suggesting is that there is a rock-bottom minimum amount of support that a major candidate for POTUS can assume…and Donald is right there. If you’re a Republican and you’re caught in an act of necro-homo-bestiality in the middle of Times Square with ISIS funding stuffed in your pockets, you’re still going to get 20 million votes. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2130 "2016-07-01T15:11:30Z")
And there is a rock bottom that he seems to be getting now and it is such that moving up just 4 points would make an electoral college victory a coin flip even with a popular vote loss. If what is already clear about his despicableness is not enough to make the undecideds vote against him a little tax evasion through a foundation and relatively petty theft sure aint. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2131 "2016-07-01T16:40:33Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > @Merneith: > Since we are in the elections forum and a thread on Trump’s election campaign, I think DSeid can be forgiven for focusing on how all that charity fraud affects the election rather than future IRS audits. I would have thought that it was self-evident that exposing a major Presidential candidate’s shady charity activities was relevant to that candidate’s campaign efforts. It is, I believe, both a symptom and a disease that anyone would just shrug it off. No, I don’t expect Trump’s supporters to care - but I don’t think that the rest of us should be complacent about it. I think we should, in fact, be outraged at Donald Trump’s blatant attempt to subvert our democratic process in order to increase his personal fame and fortune. I think Trump’s candidacy, along with Republican games with congress and the supreme court, is an actual threat to our democratic institutes and, as such, a threat to the entire American government which is the backbone of the whole American experiment. Turning a blind eye to Donald’s shady behavior is how he came to win the Republican nomination in the first. The Washington Post and every other organization which wants to be considered a serious news operations should have run this expose a year ago. He should have been facing unpleasant questions about his finances from the beginning. Instead he played footsie with tv personalities who gave him weeks of favorable free air time - provided they didn’t make him angry. Well, it’s time to stop carrying water for him in the name of “fair” and “balanced” “access”. Donald Trump’s shady charity problems should be center stage on the nightly news. Instead, everyone’s grabbing their pearls because Bill Clinton talked to Lorretta Lynch at an airport. Instead, we’re hearing, “Oh, well, his supporters won’t care so why bother talking about it.” The rest of us are entitled to be furious about Donald Trump’s blatant attempt to use our Democratic institutions for his own enrichment. If Donald’s media whoring is now turning up unpleasant facts about him, we’re entitled to enjoy that. Donald’s shady financial schemes _ought_ to affect the election. If they don’t, the rest of us are entitled to take umbrage about it. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2132 "2016-07-01T17:02:11Z")
Well take all the umbrage you want. By the way, I wouldn’t worry about the Bill-Lynch meeting much. Hillary’s supporters won’t care so why bother talking about it. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Lowry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sam\_Lowry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Lowry)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2133 "2016-07-01T17:02:20Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > **Merneith** , > > No, I am merely saying that it is not so much “a gift” other than within our already detesting him circles. It has and will have no impact on the assessments held by most voters. Sure prosecute away because crooks should be punished\*, but in terms of impacting the election? > > **CarnalK** ’s response is the most meaningful one. Depending on the poll something like one in five registered voters are undecided or preferring a third party. If they are not voting against him based on all of his other negatives, will his being a long time relatively petty crook and tax cheat have much impact as they decide? > > “Joe Schlobotnik … he’s a drug-dealer, a rapist and a murderer who says what I want to say but can’t … maybe I’ll vote for him … oh he claimed a charitable donation he wasn’t entitled to? Well in _that_ case …” > \*And after all even Al Capone was taken down on tax evasion. Buying Tim Tebow’s helmet isn’t a bombshell that would change anyone’s mind. But I would think that it’s another small bit that adds up with all the other instances of him lying or cheating or otherwise being untrustworthy that will make some people have second thoughts about voting for him. Also, if money at his charity was misused for that, I would guess that it was also misused in other ways. I’d be surprised if other than for this purchase, everything is 100% legitimate and the charity is otherwise a great one that does lots of great work. I’d think a lot of people would be okay with whatever strange accounting and bankruptcy stuff he’s done with his businesses, because that could be seen as smart business and a way to keep his money and not give money to the government or other losers. But doing fishy things with charity money is a step beyond that and harder to defend. Also, out of all the things to misuse charity money on, to have spent $12,000 on a Tim Tebow helmet? I’d think that even some evangelicals would think he overpaid. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2134 "2016-07-01T17:10:20Z")
The thing is, this isn’t that juicy. Yes, he may have violated some charity rules but he bought it at a charity auction so the $12k went to a charity. Not excusing it, just don’t think this will outrage the masses. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Lowry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sam\_Lowry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Lowry)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2135 "2016-07-01T17:10:46Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > It’s not enough that he’s a domestic laughing stock…[Trump is now hitting up foreigners for donations to his campaign.](http://www.snopes.com/2016/06/30/donald-trump-foreign-fec/) I’m confused why the FEC isn’t investigating, unless it’s just so clear that the Trump campaign is so inept that they didn’t mean to ask for foreign donations and just sent out the email to whatever list of emails they had. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2136 "2016-07-01T17:20:59Z")
I figure as long as they say it was an honest mistake and don’t actually accept foreign money, he’s off the hook. [Snopes has an article](http://www.snopes.com/2016/06/30/donald-trump-foreign-fec/) up on it where they quote former FEC Chairman Michael Toner: > [@](#): > > “The key is for the campaign to not knowingly solicit contributions from foreign nationals and to exercise due diligence in reviewing solicitation lists and examining contributions when they are received to confirm that they are lawful,” Toner told CNN. > > One way campaigns can demonstrate due diligence is by getting a copy of a donor’s passport photo if the donation comes from foreign bank accounts. > > “All this being said, if a campaign inadvertently solicits contributions from a few foreign nationals and refunds any foreign national contributions that are brought to its attention, I don’t believe the FEC would take any adverse action against the campaign,” ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2137 "2016-07-01T17:27:14Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > The thing is, this isn’t that juicy. Yes, he may have violated some charity rules but he bought it at a charity auction so the $12k went to a charity. Not excusing it, just don’t think this will outrage the masses. He didn’t buy it, his foundation did. If he has it in his home and is making use of it, then the rules broken would be the foundation using donated money to provide Trump with material goods rather than it coming out of his pocket. From **Merneith’s** link. > [@](#): > > Instead, the Susan G. Komen organization — the breast-cancer nonprofit that hosted the party — \*\*got a $12,000 payment from another nonprofit , the Donald J. Trump Foundation. > \*\* > Trump himself sent no money. (In fact, a Komen spokesperson said, Trump has never given a personal gift of cash to the Komen organization.) **He paid the bill with money from a charity he founded in 1987, but which is largely stocked with other people’s money.** Trump is the foundation’s president. But, at the time of the auction, Trump had given none of his own money to the foundation for three years running. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2138 "2016-07-01T17:28:55Z")
Of course, when Trump-affiliated PACs _also_ [start spamming the same foreign MPs](http://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/welp-that-s-weird-but-of-course-it-is), things get dicier; > [@](#): > > Now, normally (i.e., completely separate from anything to do with Trump) it would be entirely unremarkable that someone was getting fundraising emails both from a campaign and also Super PACs supporting the campaign. They’re likely both buying lists from the same vendor or even different vendors of likely Trump voters. > > But remember, Tim is a foreign citizen and part of the government in another country. We’ve already speculated about the various ways all these foreign legislators could have ended up on Trump’s list. The more we’ve looked into it, it seems increasingly implausible that he got this list from a list vendor. Not impossible just not likely at all. It now seems more probable that the Trump Organization simply had these emails in some business related database and decided to dump them into the email hopper for the fundraising blitz or just found some site that had a zip file of foreign government officials and used that. As I’ve said, all of these possibilities are outlandish and ridiculous. But we know for a fact that he has and continues to spam members of Parliament in the UK, Australia, Canada, Denmark, Finland and Iceland and possibly others. So one of these completely preposterous set of facts has to be true. > > And here’s where we get to coordination, which is a big no no. > > Given what I’ve said above, the existence of this list almost has to originate in Trump Derpland. A virtual certainty. So how did the same list end up in the hands of a Trump SuperPac? I looked up Crippled America PAC and as of their last filing just a couple weeks ago, they’re total budget was 40. No m or b after that sign, forty bucks, the price of a fancy dinner. So obviously CAP was just stood up and actually started operating just now. And now they’re showing up in Tim’s inbox. > > Again, normally you’d just say, they’re both buying the list from the same vendor. I’m also pretty sure that a good campaign finance lawyer could find a way to get lists from a campaign to its supportive SuperPacs without running afoul of the rules against campaigns coordinating with SuperPacs. But let’s be honest, does any of this look like its done by anyone who has the slightest clue about fundraising or campaign finance law? Of course, not. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2139 "2016-07-01T17:37:30Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > He didn’t buy it, his foundation did. > If he has it in his home and is making use of it, then the rules broken would be the foundation using donated money to provide Trump with material goods rather than it coming out of his pocket. > From **Merneith’s** link. Yeah, I read the article - I know all that and clearly stipulated that he could have broken some rules. My point was that the Trump foundation money went to a breast cancer non-profit so it’s less of a juicy story. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2140 "2016-07-01T17:50:41Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Of course, when Trump-affiliated PACs _also_ [start spamming the same foreign MPs](http://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/welp-that-s-weird-but-of-course-it-is), things get dicier; Yeah, I’m betting no way in hell is the Trump campaign coordinating with Crippled America PAC: [http://juanitajean.com/bad-nickels-and-pacs-they-just-keep-turning-up/](http://juanitajean.com/bad-nickels-and-pacs-they-just-keep-turning-up/) Looks like some kid who took Colbert’s idea and ran with it. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/2141 "2016-07-01T18:00:14Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Yeah, I’m betting no way in hell is the Trump campaign coordinating with Crippled America PAC: > [Juanita Jean's | Bad Nickels and PACs – They Just Keep Turning Up](http://juanitajean.com/bad-nickels-and-pacs-they-just-keep-turning-up/) > Looks like some kid who took Colbert’s idea and ran with it. Huh. Well, as they say in Texas; “Fool me, we won’t get fooled again”. Meanwhile, Trump wants everyone to know that he _won’t_ be speaking every night at the convention; [he insists that “everybody” asked him to](http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/02/us/politics/donald-trump-republican-convention.html?_r=0) and he turned them down. You know, because of how humble he is. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901.md?page=106) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901.md?page=108)