# Donald Trump's 2016 General Election Campaign **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 4, 2016, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901 "2016-05-04T02:37:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 352
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7023 "2016-09-21T19:07:32Z")
> [@Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](#): > > Reich’s argument is that Trump started life with such an advantage that his fortune should be far greater than what it is if he is truly a great businessman. No. The argument, based on simple arithmetic and statistics, is that Trump’s fortune should be far greater than it is if he is _not so incompetent as to do significantly worse than a monkey with a handful of darts and the Wall Street Journal listings would have done_. > [@](#): > > Let’s use that same criteria. Ever hear of Sam Reich? Ever hear of Adam Reich? Those are his sons and should be far more successful than they are given how supposedly brilliant their father is. How about Chelsea Clinton? Irrelevant, as none of them were given tens of millions of dollars to start with. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7024 "2016-09-21T19:10:23Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > You have misunderstood how much tax relief would go to each quintile. Those in the top would benefit much, much, much more. I haven’t misunderstood anything. All I did was quote directly from _your source_. As for your second sentence, I haven’t claimed otherwise. I only said that I would benefit from it, and quoted some of the numbers from your source to quantify the amount. You are arguing against a figment of your imagination, not a post by me. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7025 "2016-09-21T19:10:42Z")
Yes, Pearl Clutching’s argument is stupid and the idea that he could go toe to toe with Reich is laughable. I quoted a perfectly good argument though. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7026 "2016-09-21T19:21:53Z")
> [@Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](#): > > I could go toe to toe with Reich. To quote Woody Allen, “The thing about intellectuals is that they can sound absolutely brilliant and have no idea what’s going on.”… Not quite. The actual quote, from _Annie Hall_, > [@](#): > > …They prove that you can be absolutely brilliant and have no idea what’s going on… Your version is slightly, but importantly, different. Your version has it that intellectuals “can sound” brilliant, but not “be”. His version has it that one can be brilliant but have no idea what’s going on. Also, you change the pronoun from the singular to the plural, which is important. Allen identifies a group, and says that an individual member of that group (“you”)\* might well have a weakness, your version implies that the group _as a whole_ suffers from that weakness. The other problem is Allen’s fault. How many people, brilliant or not, “have no idea what’s going on”? We are not advised. Are we to take it that intellectuals have _no_ idea what’s going on? Surely, even the dullest of us have _some_ idea what’s going on, however incomplete. Are intellectuals _just_ as unknowing as any other group? Or do they know more, but do not have a _complete_ understanding of “what’s going on”? Well, shit! Who does? Many of Mr Allen’s jokes have some heft, insight that goes beyond the chuckle. This, alas, is not one of them. - I take some pains to emphasize that my use of “you” is strictly a matter of specifying a grammatical construct. I do not accuse **PCP** of being an intellectual. ---
**Author:** ![leftfield6](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leftfield6/32/18780_2.png) [@leftfield6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leftfield6)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7027 "2016-09-21T19:30:53Z")
> [@Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](#): > > Yeah, some creepy troll approaches you and you don’t have all the answers at your fingertips means nothing. There are a lot of “man on the street interviews” where people get embarrassed for being ignorant. Tim Kaine could walk down the street of almost any city and not be recognized. I doubt 50% of Democrats know who he is. Not recognizing Reich isn’t really the point. The story works even if Reich IS seen as just another guy on the street. The actual point is that so much of Trump’s appeal to his supporters is this stupid idea that (a) we need a President who runs the government “like a business” and (b) that Trump is a mega-successful businessman. The story points out the fallacy of B. He is not. He has, by the most advantageous and generous versions of the comparison, mildly outperformed the S&P 500. Mildly outperform is not what you would have expected out of someone with Trump’s rolodex and family connections. The fallacy of A is another thread. This thread is about Trump. ---
**Author:** ![Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pearl_Clutching_Provocateur)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7028 "2016-09-21T19:35:04Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Yes, Pearl Clutching’s argument is stupid and the idea that he could go toe to toe with Reich is laughable. I quoted a perfectly good argument though. If you can get in touch with him, let’s do it! Rocky versus Apollo Creed ---
**Author:** ![Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pearl_Clutching_Provocateur)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7029 "2016-09-21T19:38:00Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Not quite. The actual quote, from _Annie Hall_, > > Your version is slightly, but importantly, different. Your version has it that intellectuals “can sound” brilliant, but not “be”. His version has it that one can be brilliant but have no idea what’s going on. Also, you change the pronoun from the singular to the plural, which is important. > > Allen identifies a group, and says that an individual member of that group (“you”)\* might well have a weakness, your version implies that the group _as a whole_ suffers from that weakness. > > The other problem is Allen’s fault. How many people, brilliant or not, “have no idea what’s going on”? We are not advised. Are we to take it that intellectuals have _no_ idea what’s going on? Surely, even the dullest of us have _some_ idea what’s going on, however incomplete. Are intellectuals _just_ as unknowing as any other group? Or do they know more, but do not have a _complete_ understanding of “what’s going on”? > > Well, shit! Who does? > > Many of Mr Allen’s jokes have some heft, insight that goes beyond the chuckle. This, alas, is not one of them. > > - I take some pains to emphasize that my use of “you” is strictly a matter of specifying a grammatical construct. I do not accuse **PCP** of being an intellectual. Thanks for the correction on the quote. I should have googled it. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7030 "2016-09-21T19:39:15Z")
Go, and sin no more. Or somewhat less, whatever you can manage. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7031 "2016-09-21T19:43:29Z")
[https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/09/21/donald-trumps-absolutely-ridiculous-response-to-the-posts-trump-foundation-story/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/09/21/donald-trumps-absolutely-ridiculous-response-to-the-posts-trump-foundation-story/) > [@](#): > > Donald Trump’s absolutely ridiculous response to The Post’s Trump Foundation story > [@](#): > > On Tuesday morning, The Washington Post published a story headlined: “Trump used $258,000 from his charity to settle legal problems.” Written by David Fahrenthold, who has reported extensively about the Trump Foundation, the piece details how Trump directed more than $250,000 of the charity’s money to help pay fees related to his businesses. Those payments could qualify as “self-dealing” and violate laws governing how the leaders of nonprofit organizations can use the money they receive in donations. > > On Tuesday night, Trump communications director Jason Miller issued a statement disputing Fahrenthold’s reporting. Sort of. Actually, not really. > [@](#): > > In the second paragraph of his statement, Miller asserts that “there was not, and could not be, any intent or motive for the Trump Foundation to make improper payments.” Okay. But that’s not what The Post’s article alleges. Fahrenthold knows better than to suggest intent or motive; he is simply noting that Trump diverted $258,000 – money that wasn’t his – given to the foundation to pay for things tied to Trump’s businesses. Those are facts. And they simply are not in dispute, not even by Miller. (More on that below.) Trump is really a miser that uses others people money to pay for his legal needs, and even his much heralded charities looks like if they are just as imaginary as Trump telling it “like it is” > **[The Trump Foundation: what's known is shocking. We need to know more | Jill...](https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/sep/21/trump-foundation-charity-settle-legal-disputes-reporting)** > > Revelations that Donald Trump’s so-called charity helped him settle legal disputes are extraordinary, and would sink Clinton. This is vital reporting > [@](#): > > Imagine if Hillary Clinton had a 6ft portrait of herself painted for a charity auction. Then Bill bid it up and paid for it with $20,000 from the Clinton Foundation. And the Clinton Foundation donated $100,000 to the ACLU or Naral. > > Then imagine that she spent $258,000 from the foundation to cover expenses arising from legal challenges. > > And here’s the really beautiful bit: imagine that the Clinton Foundation has no discernible purpose as a charity. > > If the Clinton Foundation had done all of these things, Hillary (and perhaps Bill and Chelsea too) might well be headed to prison, the place Donald Trump and his supporters insist she belongs. > > But it’s the Trump Foundation, not the Clinton Foundation, which reportedly bought a portrait of its namesake, settled legal claims for him, donated money to a rightwing advocacy group and whose purpose is somewhat opaque. > [@](#): > > A separate and much smaller Clinton Family Foundation handles their personal contributions to charities. According to their tax returns, the Clintons as a couple have donated about 10% of Bill and Hillary’s multimillion-dollar incomes in recent years to various well-known charities, more than most super-wealthy people, who give an average of about 3%. > > Though his vice-presidential running mate, Mike Pence, has said that Trump personally contributes “tens of millions of dollars” to charities, as with so much about Donald Trump, absolutely nothing has been made public to back up the claim. We are just supposed to accept Pence’s word and the statement in a recent CNN interview by his campaign manager, Kellyanne Conway, who calls reporters’ questions about his charitable foundation “badgering”, that Trump is indeed “a very generous man”. > > Personally generous he may sometimes be. The work of the Trump Foundation, however, is an entirely different question. For journalists, for regulators, for any citizen who cares about the future of this country, this isn’t badgering. It’s an urgent democratic duty. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7032 "2016-09-21T19:44:43Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I haven’t misunderstood anything. All I did was quote directly from _your source_. As for your second sentence, I haven’t claimed otherwise. I only said that I would benefit from it, and quoted some of the numbers from your source to quantify the amount. You are arguing against a figment of your imagination, not a post by me. Enjoy your $500. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7033 "2016-09-21T20:02:05Z")
> [@Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](#): > > If you can get in touch with him, let’s do it! > > Rocky versus Apollo Creed He’s former Secretary of Labor and a prof at Berkeley. I’m thinking Tyson vs Pee Wee Herman. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7034 "2016-09-21T20:12:48Z")
My question is this: If you had a candidate and he said just three things that were insane, would you elect him President? That’s Donald Trump’s problem. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7035 "2016-09-21T20:14:41Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > He’s former Secretary of Labor and a prof at Berkeley. I’m thinking Tyson vs Pee Wee Herman. If we’re talking “toe-to-toe” it’s more like a millipede vs a Tribble. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7036 "2016-09-21T20:15:17Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > He’s former Secretary of Labor and a prof at Berkeley. I’m thinking Tyson vs Pee Wee Herman. Even if that was _Neil deGrasse_ Tyson, Pee Wee would be toast. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7037 "2016-09-21T20:19:14Z")
Tribbles have toes? ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7038 "2016-09-21T20:20:49Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > If we’re talking “toe-to-toe” it’s more like a millipede vs a Tribble. How about, Ronald McDonald vs Oscar Pistorius. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7039 "2016-09-21T20:31:30Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > Tribbles have toes? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7040 "2016-09-21T20:33:01Z")
> [@leftfield6](#): > > The story points out the fallacy of B. He is not. He has, by the most advantageous and generous versions of the comparison, mildly outperformed the S&P 500. Mildly outperform is not what you would have expected out of someone with Trump’s rolodex and family connections. The problem, as I pointed out, is that Reich’s likely fictional argument is based on error and guess work. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7041 "2016-09-21T20:39:21Z")
[Trump will propose a national stop-and-frisk law tonight](https://twitter.com/ajjaffe/status/778671095499087872?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw). (the source is an NBC reporter. He will be proposing it on an already-taped NBC town hall tonight). [Not only has it already been ruled unconstitutional](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/aug/12/new-york-stop-and-frisk-unconstitutional-judge), [it doesn’t work](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2014/08/21/12-years-of-data-from-new-york-city-suggest-stop-and-frisk-wasnt-that-effective/). ---
**Author:** ![Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pearl_Clutching_Provocateur)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2016, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901/7042 "2016-09-21T20:46:56Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > He’s former Secretary of Labor and a prof at Berkeley. I’m thinking Tyson vs Pee Wee Herman. I think it’s awful you compare Reich to Pee Wee Herman. And voice is deeper than Tyson’s. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901.md?page=351) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/donald-trumps-2016-general-election-campaign/753901.md?page=353)