# Don't Ask Any Questions In Kalamazoo! \[off-duty cop wishes he could carry a gun in Calgary\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [August 9, 2012, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996 "2012-08-09T19:57:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2012, 6:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/121 "2012-08-15T06:48:10Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > It’s not an unexpected reaction for a small town guy in another country for the first time when he’s used to not being treated in a way he considered unusual. It was Canada for the love of god! I don’t care what small town in the USA you come from Canada is NOT a exotic and threatening foreign nation, it is an English speaking essentially identical to the USA place. I mean I could understand him feeling threatened strolling through low income areas of Venezuela or something, but Canada? [http://21stcenturysocialism.com/files/thumbnails/caracas.jpg](http://21stcenturysocialism.com/files/thumbnails/caracas.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2012, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/122 "2012-08-15T11:20:56Z")
> [@grude](#): > > I mean I could understand him feeling threatened strolling through low income areas of Venezuela or something, but Canada? If he’d not been there before, surely. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2012, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/123 "2012-08-15T13:38:52Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > A blast of pepper spray up the snout, and most anyone will stop grilling you about seeing the local tourist attractions. That’s right - of course, it would then be replaced by him being grilled by the Calgary police about the assault with a restricted weapon that he just committed. I think most people would find that grilling a bit more worrisome. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2012, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/124 "2012-08-15T13:47:58Z")
I think you’ve been whooshed, NP. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2012, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/125 "2012-08-15T13:57:50Z")
> [@alice\_in\_wonderland](#): > > Huh - somehow I missed this story until now - it’s quite hilarious. > > I wonder if the two fellows handing out the Stampede tickets have been located - I would love to hear what their take on the whole thing was. Good question. Have the two guys been interviewed by the local media? ---
**Author:** ![EmAnJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d2c977/32.png) [@EmAnJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EmAnJ)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2012, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/126 "2012-08-15T14:06:24Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Good question. Have the two guys been interviewed by the local media? Not that I’ve seen. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2012, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/127 "2012-08-15T15:04:22Z")
The root of the problem is that police work hones ones perception abilities and instincts pretty finely. At the same time it _ **can** _, encourage bravado, ego and even a little paranoia. If you know any cops, you probably know this to be true. (You’d have to be inhuman not to grow a tad paranoid, dealing with what the average police office must see, over the course of a career!) But that’s a deadly combination, in truth. When someone begins to convince themselves that their _perception_ of a threat is so certain, it’s sufficient to take _preemptive_ action, we got a problem. Now this cop didn’t say he’d have drawn his gun, but his letter screamed of the exact thing. Ducati’s post did too. They might have wanted to ask him what he paid, since they were intending to buy gallons of it. There are a thousand innocent reasons for one guy to go a different direction, on the approach. While he didn’t point or fire his gun, he did use it to intimidate, two possibly entirely innocent, citizens into retreating, possibly in confusion and fear. Damn straight I’d have jumped in my car and bolted too! But I’m really talking about the blindness. His experience forces him to see it only one way. He _was_ threatened, he _was_ justified in showing his weapon, and he’s the hero because he _certainly_ averted a crime and avoided being a victim. Perception of a threat is not enough, it has to be _demonstratively_ harmful or threatening in some way, or you’re the criminal. I don’t know any place where unexpectedly being spoken to would qualify, in Canada or the US. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2012, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/128 "2012-08-15T15:07:12Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > It’s not an unexpected reaction for a small town guy in another country for the first time when he’s used to not being treated in a way he considered unusual. 😕😕 Ok, I don’t want to get all up in your grille in an unusual Canadian way, but is talking to someone in a park, in broad daylight, in a friendish way _UNUSUAL_?!?! I mean, I’ve traveled to the US a lot. I’ve been approached in greeted in a friendish way pretty much every time I’ve been, by total strangers (oddly, this happened a LOT in Minot, ND. Why Not Minot, indeed!). At no time, when approached by these strangers being friendish did it occur to me that I should shoot one of them. I have to say, it sounds a bit like you’re defending a total loony. Now, it’s your prerogative to do so, but it seems a bit odd. I mean, when I read a story about one of my countrymen or countrywomen doing something retarded abroad I cringe, roll my eyes, and hope that people don’t assume that everyone from here is so much of a boob. Wawra is clearly a boob - I just think you should rethink your defense of his boob-ish-ness. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Colophon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f05b48/32.png) [@Colophon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colophon)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2012, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/129 "2012-08-15T18:10:10Z")
> [@grude](#): > > I mean I could understand him feeling threatened strolling through low income areas of Venezuela or something, but Canada? > > [http://21stcenturysocialism.com/files/thumbnails/caracas.jpg](http://21stcenturysocialism.com/files/thumbnails/caracas.jpg) Jeez, Canada looks pretty shitty. 😛 BTW, hasn’t the “they were handing out free tickets” rumour pretty much been disproven? Can’t find the link I was looking at yesterday but the oil company named had denied any knowledge. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2012, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/130 "2012-08-16T01:22:26Z")
Good thing they didn’t ask him for a foursome. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2012, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/131 "2012-08-16T01:51:52Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > … > But I’m really talking about the blindness. His experience forces him to see it only one way. He _was_ threatened, he _was_ justified in showing his weapon, and he’s the hero because he _certainly_ averted a crime and avoided being a victim. … [_emphasis mine_] While I agree with your post in general, in defense of all [sane] US gun-owners I must point out that the second thing they teach in gun safety classes, is not to do things like that [see emphasis above]. You draw your weapon to fire it. You fire your weapon to severely injure some-one. You make damn sure you have good cause to do the second before you do the first. [The first thing they teach is how to make sure the gun is unloaded.] ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2012, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/132 "2012-08-16T04:32:44Z")
Two good rules for guns: 1. Never point a gun at somebody unless you’re willing to shoot them. 2. Never shoot somebody unless you’re willing to kill them. But the point of these rules are they’re supposed to cause restraint. They’re supposed to make you realize how serious pulling out a gun is and make you stop and think if it’s really the best choice. The problem is some people get it in reverse. They pull out the gun and point it at somebody and then, belatedly remembering the rule, they come up with a reason for what they just did. “Huh, I’m pointing a gun at this guy…I guess he must be threatening me or something.” ---
**Author:** ![Dallas\_Jones](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dallas_jones/32/3277_2.png) [@Dallas\_Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dallas_Jones)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2012, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/133 "2012-08-16T04:45:20Z")
> [@j666](#): > > While I agree with your post in general, in defense of all [sane] US gun-owners I must point out that the second thing they teach in gun safety classes, is not to do things like that [see emphasis above]. You draw your weapon to fire it. You fire your weapon to severely injure some-one. You make damn sure you have good cause to do the second before you do the first. > > [The first thing they teach is how to make sure the gun is unloaded.] Yes. Drawing your gun to show someone in a threatening manor or to scare some threat off is a crime in itself known as ‘brandishing.’ You can lose your concealed carry permit that way. You do not draw your weapon until you believe that you must respond to the threat, and you draw and shoot. ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2012, 10:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/134 "2012-08-16T10:50:25Z")
Hell I’m shocked there aren’t more dead panhandlers and proselytizing christians the way some people get on. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2012, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/135 "2012-08-16T15:48:50Z")
> [@grude](#): > > \ > > [http://21stcenturysocialism.com/files/thumbnails/caracas.jpg](http://21stcenturysocialism.com/files/thumbnails/caracas.jpg) That’s just Vancouver - the rest of Canada is pretty nice. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2012, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/136 "2012-08-16T22:33:00Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > That’s just Vancouver - the rest of Canada is pretty nice. 🙂 Wait a minute, is that Canada or a whoosh? It looks like everybody in Canada lives there if so. 😕 ---
**Author:** ![EmAnJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d2c977/32.png) [@EmAnJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EmAnJ)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2012, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/137 "2012-08-16T22:33:46Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Wait a minute, is that Canada or a whoosh? > It looks like everybody in Canada lives there if so. 😕 No, it’s Caracas, says so right in the file path. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2012, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/138 "2012-08-16T22:34:47Z")
> [@Dallas\_Jones](#): > > Yes. Drawing your gun to show someone in a threatening manor or to scare some threat off is a crime in itself known as ‘brandishing.’ You can lose your concealed carry permit that way. > > You do not draw your weapon until you believe that you must respond to the threat, and you draw and shoot. Well, yeah, but the bad guys in not the op went away, and are still alive. That sounds like a win-win thing. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2012, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/139 "2012-08-16T22:45:59Z")
> [@ducati](#): > > No, a crazy guy waving a gun didn’t scare him away in fear for his safety, preventing him from purchasing some much-needed orange-scented floor cleaner. > Rather, his intended robbery or carjacking victim gently let him know that this was not going to be an easy score, and he just remembered he hates being shot. You don’t know that, and if it were me, I would have left, too. There are plenty other places to buy cleaning supplies, and most of them don’t have people standing around who think guns should be used as pointing devices. > [@ducati](#): > > Can Wawra prove that his two chuckleheads were about to bust his head open with a Molsen Golden bottle? No, but I certainly wouldn’t dismiss his 20 years of experience and judgement just because you don’t like guns. As stated up-thread, his 20 years of experience and judgement were dead wrong. > [@ducati](#): > > I don’t know where some people get the idea that all gun owners want to shoot someone, or we pull guns out if someone is rude to us. Given that you pulled your gun out when somebody was NOT being rude to you, it’s not that great a leap to think you might if somebody WAS being rude. ---
**Author:** ![gunnergoz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e95f7d/32.png) [@gunnergoz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gunnergoz)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2012, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996/140 "2012-08-16T23:13:09Z")
I just wish the Canadians would invade San Diego so I could enjoy their healthcare and culture and not have to leave my sunny climate. 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-ask-any-questions-in-kalamazoo-off-duty-cop-wishes-he-could-carry-a-gun-in-calgary/630996.md?page=8)