# "Don't call me 'cisgender'!" **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 30, 2015, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903 "2015-04-30T15:23:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/41 "2015-04-30T19:30:00Z")
I think it’s more than that. A lot of people are uncomfortable being described by some strange term invented by gender studies weirdos. Personally I think the term doesn’t come up too often IRL anyway and seems like a pretty neutral and inoffensive descriptor when it does, and as long as everyone understands what it means and it helps keep things clear I’m all for it. But my guess is that the discomfort is as above. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/42 "2015-04-30T19:33:18Z")
> [@Hershele\_Ostropoler](#): > > It’s easy enough for someone who doesn’t intend the baggage of “normal” to not use the word “normal” even if they don’t know “cisgender.” Well…I’m not sure about that. As **Miller** said, lacking that term, folks might tie themselves in knots trying to avoid offensive language. “Non-transgender” kind of works, except it defines cisgender by the absence of transgender, which is a little unusual, like defining right-handed people as non-lefthanded or defining folks who like eating wheat as non-gluten-intolerant. It’s nice having a term that defines folks for what they are rather than for what they aren’t. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/43 "2015-04-30T19:35:12Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > They’re objecting to the term “cisgender” because they don’t want to have to use an entirely new term to describe what they are, even though it’s needed, because it was never needed _before_. It’s like if somebody came up with a term to use to refer to time-travellers, or people who had been raised from the dead. Actually it is more like a term being created to describe not being a time traveler. If one is heavily involved in this area, cisgender as a term makes a lot of sense. However most people are not, and they find themselves being defined in contrast to things they have no part of. If we need a term, and I agree normal does not work, how about “static” to show a lack of movement/transition? However in cases where the transition is not important to the discussion, a self-identified gender might be adequate. In a truly accepting world, where one is is more important than how one got there. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/44 "2015-04-30T19:47:26Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I think this is something you’re just going to need to get over. So your advice to someone who is offended being called by a certain name is ‘just get over it’? ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/45 "2015-04-30T19:48:57Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Are there gays who object to the use of “straight”? If there are, could they all fit into a phone booth? Are there even any phone booths for them to fit into anymore? I prefer the term “non-gay,” and I’m not the only one. This phone booth can get damn crowded (not a bad thing, depending). ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/46 "2015-04-30T19:49:14Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > A lot of people are uncomfortable being described by some strange term invented by gender studies weirdos. Interesting. Are they similarly pissed-off by other technical terms? “Goddamn it, don’t you go calling me ‘lactose-intolerant’, you weirdo! I’m a tolerant person! I just don’t like cheese! Don’t you go applying your strange, made-up labels to me!” ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/47 "2015-04-30T19:55:58Z")
It seems like the more equivalent example would be Lactose-intolerant people inventing a new word for Lactose tolerant people, like “Milkies” or “cislactose” or something. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/48 "2015-04-30T20:00:47Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > So your advice to someone who is offended being called by a certain name is ‘just get over it’? No, my advice to people offended by being called “cisgender” is to “just get over it.” My response to people being offended by being called other names is dependent on what that other name is. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/49 "2015-04-30T20:06:41Z")
Sorry, born female, never had to have surgery or chemicals to change, so I am a normal female. Anybody else is not a normal female, they can be anything they want - but not normal, regular, original … sucks to be you guys, but thems the breaks. I don’t care, I will be happy to consider you female if that is how you self identify, but you will never be ‘normal female’. You just popped into the wrong body and needed some medical correction. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/50 "2015-04-30T20:07:11Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > No, my advice to people offended by being called “cisgender” is to “just get over it.” My response to people being offended by being called other names is dependent on what that other name is. So you don’t take other peoples’ feelings about being called certain words into consideration when you determine if they should or should not just “get over it”, only your own personal beliefs on what they should be offended about? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/51 "2015-04-30T20:09:09Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > It seems like the more equivalent example would be Lactose-intolerant people inventing a new word for Lactose tolerant people, like “Milkies” or “cislactose” or something. Like “lactose tolerant”? That seems like a good parallel. “What do you mean I’m ‘lactose tolerant’? Why do you have a special word for it! Why don’t you just say I’m ‘normal’?” It seems a weird thing to get worked up about. There have been times when I’ve described myself as “cis”. There are times that I’ve described myself as “hetero”. There are times that I’ve described myself as “Oklahoman”. Sometimes making these sorts of distinctions is important, sometimes it’s not. It’s not like every situation requires you to explain every aspect of your background. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/52 "2015-04-30T20:13:45Z")
> [@The\_Hamster\_King](#): > > Like “lactose tolerant”? That seems like a good parallel. > > “What do you mean I’m ‘lactose tolerant’? Why do you have a special word for it! Why don’t you just say I’m ‘normal’?” > > It seems a weird thing to get worked up about. > > There have been times when I’ve described myself as “cis”. There are times that I’ve described myself as “hetero”. There are times that I’ve described myself as “Oklahoman”. Sometimes making these sorts of distinctions is important, sometimes it’s not. It’s not like every situation requires you to explain every aspect of your background. That’s sort of my point. Lactose intolerant people DIDN’T invent a new term for Lactose tolerant people, it’s just the default. I’ve never heard anyone describe themselves or anyone else for that matter as “Lactose Tolerant” If you are lactose tolerant, you are just normal. Only when you are Lactose intolerant does a distinction need to be made. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/53 "2015-04-30T20:24:33Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > I’ve never heard anyone describe themselves or anyone else for that matter as “Lactose Tolerant” It’s not a common term, but it’s certainly used. (I’ve used it jokingly myself.) The point is, it’s used in situations where making the distinction is important. What word should be used instead? “Normal”? But in most of the world, lactose intolerance IS the norm. If you’re at a conference with a fairly large number of trans people, (as I was last week) then referring to yourself as “cisgendered” in conversation might be a useful distinction to make. Certainly better than referring yourself as “normal”. It’s a technical term (like “heterosexual”) that’s primarily useful in situations where there’s a particular distinction you’re trying to make. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/54 "2015-04-30T20:34:19Z")
Well I wouldn’t call myself that, and would be offended if someone called me that. But according to some in this thread I should “just get over it” and not be offended because that’s what other people decided I should be called. THAT’S what I disagree with. ---
**Author:** ![DinoR](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dinor/32/2821_2.png) [@DinoR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DinoR)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/55 "2015-04-30T20:40:14Z")
> [@Hershele\_Ostropoler](#): > > If it isn’t, what do people object to about it? Aesthetics? I grant it’s useful to have terms for discussing gender issues. IME that’s an extremely limited usage for me, but it’s useful to have formal terms that are clear and not value laden. I like Una’s defining it in discussions where she knows the audience doesn’t know the definition. That’s just good communication when you are discussing any specifically defined term of limited or differing definitions. An economist shouldn’t discuss profit with a roomful of accountants without stopping to clarify that their professions have different definitions of the word. The term grates though. To some extent it’s because it’s used to label me based on external things which seems counter to the idea behind the terms. More importantly the whole discussion feels like it’s exclusive of me. I don’t feel any sense of internal gender identity. I don’t even get the conversation at anything other than a hypothetical level. It’s like discussing a painting that all looks like it’s the same color to my eye with people that can see the infrared. Agender, in some definitions, applies but in others not so much. At best it feels like a catch all label so that I have a label. ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/56 "2015-04-30T20:42:03Z")
> [@Hershele\_Ostropoler](#): > > In my experience, the assumption that people who complain about “cis-” want to avoid those terms is unwarranted. If it isn’t, what do people object to about it? Aesthetics? No, I think it’s because it’s a term almost solely created by one group that doesn’t really serve a great function, and shifts the framework of understanding towards one side for no particular reason. It’s not too different from when republicans started using “democrat” instead of “democratic” or when celebrities “consciously uncouple” instead of divorce. 1. Cisgendered is not a common term, and is going to confuse more people than it helps. It’s clinical and largely not that helpful. 2. Transgender people are like .3% of the population. The reality is that language in common parlance should not serve to characterize the overwhelming majority as a alternative to the characterization of the minority. It would be as if wheelchair bound people continually referred to walking people as ambulatory. Or if people without body dysmorphia were described as “body eumorphic”. Would really make sense to ask for an omnivore menu at a restaurant, or to make a point to mention I’m lactose tolerant? 3. I think many people reject the term because it reinforces the notion that language should attach and imply privilege to things that are largely not a matter of choice, and are overwhelmingly common place. As if the lack of any and every condition extends privilege which must be acknowledged linguistically. 4. It’s kinda bothersome because this type of jargon is slowly creeping into superficial conversations in which such specificity isn’t necessary or illuminating. For example, Facebook apparently has something like 70 gender options. How is that actually helpful to the majority of people? All that said, it doesn’t bother me to the point I would waste much time thinking about how annoying the term is. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/57 "2015-04-30T20:45:02Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Most people don’t spend a lot of time talking about transexuality. That’s because it, and most other non “cis” sexualities, make up a very small part of the human spectrum, and while I have complete acceptance of individuals with alternative sexualities and gender identifications, I find, in this case as in all similar ones that a special term to refer to the 99%\* is a bit absurdist. My reaction, on hearing it, is “uh-_huh_” and a pause to see if the conversation continues on mutually meaningful grounds or is a disguised attack on “normality.” - Or any overwhelmingly large number of those who do not require a special description of their biomorphogenetical conditioning. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/58 "2015-04-30T20:51:19Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Well I wouldn’t call myself that, and would be offended if someone called me that. But according to some in this thread I should “just get over it” and not be offended because that’s what other people decided I should be called. THAT’S what I disagree with. I can see confused, but why offended? It has no historically bad connotations, it wasn’t created as(or used as) a slur-what is offensive about the word? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/59 "2015-04-30T20:55:05Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Well I wouldn’t call myself that, and would be offended if someone called me that. You’d be offended if someone called you “lactose tolerant”? :dubious: > [@](#): > > But according to some in this thread I should “just get over it” and not be offended because that’s what other people decided I should be called. THAT’S what I disagree with. If you were in a situation where you were talking with someone who was transgendered and you wanted to make a point about your experiences as someone who isn’t transgendered, how would you refer to yourself? “As a \_\_\_\_\_\_ male, here’s my opinion.” What would you put in that blank? ---
**Author:** ![usedtobe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ec9cab/32.png) [@usedtobe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/usedtobe)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2015, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903/60 "2015-04-30T20:57:06Z")
Add +1 to OP. I was born male. Others were born female. Still others have changed - do we debate if they changed sex, or just gender\* - whatever it is, it has changed in some cases. Gender is like religion - if you say you’re _this_, then I’ll treat you as _this_. But don’t tell me that your being _this_ somehow changes what I am. - - that one is for all the Prescriptivists. Sex is male and female. Gender is masculine and feminine. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-call-me-cisgender/718903.md?page=4)