# Don't you have a better reason for disliking Kerry? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 1, 2004, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404 "2004-11-01T21:17:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![C3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/c3/32/3108_2.png) [@C3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C3)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2004, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/21 "2004-11-01T23:08:02Z")
> [@danceswithcats](#): > > I’ll pass, thanks. You have a very interesting technique for remaining uninvolved in something that doesn’t interest you. I was talking to my mom yesterday about the election. She agrees with a lot of the Democratic platform, especially the social issues. She’s actually very aware of the issues. She still voted for Bush, though (early voting), because she thinks Kerry is “phony.” I asked her what she meant. She said he seems like he’s out for his own self-interest. 😕 Wha??? Can anyone say Halliburton? Oil-man cronies?? I blame it on my father’s influence - he’s exposed her to too much Fox News & Rush Limbaugh. She lives in Florida, by the way. FLORIDA!!! ---
**Author:** ![smartini](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/22d042/32.png) [@smartini](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smartini)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2004, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/22 "2004-11-01T23:09:15Z")
> [@danceswithcats](#): > > **Elenia28** indicated that one should vote for their candidate based upon an intelligent and informed opinion, and to that, I take no exception. > > I consider my own opinion to be equally well-based, but not in the opinion of the community dogpile. The bottom line is that there is absolutely no possible reason I can give for feeling as I do which will pass muster, so my opinion is what it is. > > Your opening line was disappointing to me, **Elenia**. “I KNOW it’s been done before, but not by me.” > > When someone starts the 8th “Ray Charles is dead” thread, other posters remind that search is your friend, because duplicity isn’t. That was my point, and if it causes me to lose favor in your eyes, so be it. > > This horse is dead, the flesh long ago flayed from the bleached, white bones remaining. Beat them to powder and thence into the dirt if you wish. I’ll pass, thanks. Thanks for the explanation. I did not realize that your comment was directed at the thread duplication issue. I don’t exactly see you as an “I don’t know” kind of guy hence the confusion. Woof! Woof! from the dogpile 😃 \* – hurry tomorrow!!\* ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2004, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/23 "2004-11-01T23:24:46Z")
> [@wolfman](#): > > Somebody got ambushed by somebody sticking their nose where it doesn’t belong, and decided not to get into it. Good for them. > > There are a lot of supporters for both sides who range from enthusiastic to appoplectic fanatacism. “I just don’t like him” is often code for “Will you shut the fuck up and get out of my face, I don’t have the time to defend my poltical feelings one more fucking time, and don’t wanna get you set off again, because I have a fucking job to do!” If that was the case, shouldn’t the initial conversation have gone something like: **Co-worker 1:** “So, who are you voting for?” **Co-worker 2:** “Oh, I never discuss politics at work.” Or even: **Co-worker 1:** “So, who are you voting for?” **Co-worker 2:** “Oh, uh, well–Bush.” **Elenia28:** “May I ask why you’re voting for Bush?” **Co-worker 2:** “Oh, you know, I really don’t like to discuss politics at work. I’m sorry; I shouldn’t have even answered the question to begin with.” ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2004, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/24 "2004-11-01T23:26:35Z")
> [@wolfman](#): > > Somebody got ambushed by somebody sticking their nose where it doesn’t belong, and decided not to get into it. Good for them. > > There are a lot of supporters for both sides who range from enthusiastic to appoplectic fanatacism. “I just don’t like him” is often code for “Will you shut the fuck up and get out of my face, I don’t have the time to defend my poltical feelings one more fucking time, and don’t wanna get you set off again, because I have a fucking job to do!” Perhaps then, her coworker should have said, “I’d really rather not get into all the details?” Or rather than, “I just don’t like him, he looks evil!” she could say, “I disagree with him on most of the issues”, or whatever. Or she simply could have said, “I’d rather not discuss politics at work, thank you.” ---
**Author:** ![meathead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f07891/32.png) [@meathead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/meathead)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2004, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/25 "2004-11-01T23:26:38Z")
I happen to also agree with **wolfman**. It may make me look ignorant, but sometimes I just do not want to have to justify who I vote for - especially at work. I’ve used the “I don’t know” response after I had inadvertently answered someone’s query as to my vote (which has actually changed). At work I don’t have the time - and am not being paid - to seriously debate politics. There are rabid people on both sides of this election who would never leave me alone no matter what my stance may be. To seriously examine the issues (education, environment, gay rights, terrorism, national security, civil rights, affirmative action, monetary policy, corporate governance, 2nd amendment, abortion, taxes, just to name a few) would require a serious effort. Also, in the course of a debate, in order to give someone a fair possibility of changing my mind, I would need to take notes (for later scrutiny) of where they are getting any information that may be in dispute. I’m not saying that this is what happened in the OP’s case. My point is that there is a place for debate, and work might not be it. Saying “I don’t like {candidate}” may make me look stupid but it doesn’t mean that I am stupid. ---
**Author:** ![sinjin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ebca7d/32.png) [@sinjin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sinjin)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2004, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/26 "2004-11-01T23:27:06Z")
I posted this in another forum. My mom is not voting for that “Larry” fellow (she means Kerry) because his wife is a bitch. That’s it, the only reason. I did not solicite this opinion, she brought it up. Then she asked what I thought about her voting decision:dubious: and wanted to know who I was voting for. I changed the subject. I think my real parents took the wrong kid home from the hospital. ---
**Author:** ![Zoff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/6de8d8/32.png) [@Zoff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoff)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2004, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/27 "2004-11-01T23:34:39Z")
> [@](#): > > Perhaps then, her coworker should have said, “I’d really rather not get into all the details?” Or rather than, “I just don’t like him, he looks evil!” she could say, “I disagree with him on most of the issues”, or whatever. Or perhaps she could have said “I just don’t like him”. Your opinions on workplace issues is noted but have we really sunk so low that we’re now criticizing somebody because people who’ve never met her think her response could have been better? ---
**Author:** ![GaWd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f08c70/32.png) [@GaWd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaWd)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2004, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/28 "2004-11-01T23:45:56Z")
> [@Zoff](#): > > The fact that you will discuss your views at work if pushed doesn’t mean the person who won’t is ignorant. Never said it did. I said people who would vote for one candidate or the other because of how they look or because of X, Y, or Z are ignorant and that most people who would say something that fucking lame probably weren’t using it as code for “I don’t talk about politics at work”. You turned it into an argument about people who refuse to talk about politics at work. Sam ---
**Author:** ![GaWd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f08c70/32.png) [@GaWd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaWd)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2004, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/29 "2004-11-01T23:48:07Z")
> [@PictsiePat](#): > > I posted this in another forum. My mom is not voting for that “Larry” fellow (she means Kerry) because his wife is a bitch. That’s it, the only reason. I did not solicite this opinion, she brought it up. You sure she’s not just saying that as code for “I don’t want to talk about politics with you”, because there seems to be a glut of posters here who think it’s a universal response for that. Sam ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/30 "2004-11-02T00:09:17Z")
This is the sort of thing that puts your faith in democracy to the test: that it conflicts with your faith in rationalism. But is your faith in democracy based in an assumption that the people will rule rationally, or is it based on the the assumption that they have the right to rule _regardless_? I take the latter position. I would sooner be ruled by an irrational, emotional, and selfish mass of people than a irrational, emotional, and selfish elite. It is unreasonable to expect all voters to be able to articulate their reasoning to our satisfaction. A self-selected sample, we are by definition more articulate than our fellow citizens, by gravitating to an argument oriented Board, we announce our preference of rational argument (more or less…) 'Struth, people don’t make that many rational choices, we generally operate on hunch and instinct and back fill the reasoning as it suits us. We decide what human we will mix our genetic structure with, eat breakfast with and fuss about minor privileges with…based on something we call “love”. For the same reason, we make entirely unreasonable sacrifices and efforts on behalf of short, scabby-kneed, snot-sleeved ruffians. What’s rational about that? Not the least thing. Perhaps, at bottom, the only time you can make a rational decision between two candidates is when you don’t much _like_ either of them. So I’m not at all sure there is anything wrong with making a judgement based on whether or not you “like” someone. Its not what I’d prefer, since I am entirely convinced my judgement of the candidates is soberly and reasonably derived. But I am committed to democracy, it is my political faith. I am determined that the fool will have equal privilege with me, and hope for the same reciprocal tolerance for my pointless and unseemly intelligence. ---
**Author:** ![Zoff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/6de8d8/32.png) [@Zoff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoff)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/31 "2004-11-02T01:04:37Z")
> [@](#): > > You turned it into an argument about people who refuse to talk about politics at work. No, I merely mentioned that “I just don’t like him” isn’t the same as “I’m ignorant”. You clearly know that’s not true apparently. ---
**Author:** ![laigle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ce7236/32.png) [@laigle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/laigle)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/32 "2004-11-02T01:19:26Z")
Mistake number one: attributing reason to the average human. Humans are much easier to understand when you start thinking of them as extremely violent chimpanzees. ---
**Author:** ![interface2x](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c0e974/32.png) [@interface2x](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/interface2x)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/33 "2004-11-02T02:33:18Z")
> [@GaWd](#): > > You sure she’s not just saying that as code for “I don’t want to talk about politics with you”, because there seems to be a glut of posters here who think it’s a universal response for that. I don’t know about the person spoken of in the quoted passage, but I know someone who has made the same comment about hating Heinz-Kerry to her daughter (a friend of mine). She certainly wasn’t trying to get out of the conversation, she just said that she couldn’t imagine Kerry’s wife as the first lady. She was considering actually basing her entire vote on this and my friend thought about it. She later came to her senses. I don’t know about her mom, though, I haven’t been updated. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/34 "2004-11-02T02:48:20Z")
> [@wolfman](#): > > Somebody got ambushed by somebody sticking their nose where it doesn’t belong, and decided not to get into it. Good for them. > > There are a lot of supporters for both sides who range from enthusiastic to appoplectic fanatacism. “I just don’t like him” is often code for “Will you shut the fuck up and get out of my face, I don’t have the time to defend my poltical feelings one more fucking time, and don’t wanna get you set off again, because I have a fucking job to do!” I think it is often code for “In actuality, I have no idea why I should feel this way. I’m usually spouting the party line to an unquestioning group of dittoheads, so I have no ability to answer your question.” It comes across sounding pretty much the way a child sounds when he says “just cuz.” ---
**Author:** ![Rashak\_Mani](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@Rashak\_Mani](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rashak_Mani)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/35 "2004-11-02T05:40:37Z")
I heard a few “I think Bush is honest about things”… argghh… Still its incredible how many Bushites answer with the same ideas. Like as if they were cued by the same sources: Flip-flop, weak on defense and he is the most liberal senator. They use the same words ! I think if someone asked me I would probably do a better job of giving reasons not to vote for Kerry ! ---
**Author:** ![smartini](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/22d042/32.png) [@smartini](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smartini)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/36 "2004-11-02T05:47:14Z")
> [@Rashak Mani](#): > > Still its incredible how many Bushites answer with the same ideas. Like as if they were cued by the same sources: Flip-flop, weak on defense and he is the most liberal senator. They use the same words ! Republicans fall in line; Democrats fall in love. I hope we manage to have the good sense to fall in line tomorrow. \*ooops – I mean today – somebody make me go to bed \* 😃 ---
**Author:** ![yosemite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/3ab097/32.png) [@yosemite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yosemite)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/37 "2004-11-02T05:52:10Z")
I have to admit that my first gut reaction when opening this thread was: why are you asking, it’s none of your business, and: too damned bad if you are not satisfied with their “reasons,” it’s none of your damned business. > [@elicidator](#): > > It is unreasonable to expect all voters to be able to articulate their reasoning to our satisfaction. Yeah. I might ask someone their opinion out of curiosity, but I don’t think I’d skewer them as an imbecile because their answer wasn’t up to snuff. You ask a nosy question, you don’t like the answer, move along, move along. Mind your own damned business next time. I’m sorry, this sounds kind of hostile, doesn’t it? I guess it’s because I get a lot of people expecting me to justify my vegetarianism to them. My stock answer is, “Because I don’t want to eat meat.” This doesn’t seem to satisfy some people. They want me to _justify_ it to them, in a way that makes sense to them. Sorry, I don’t owe them that. I don’t owe them that with my voting choices either. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/38 "2004-11-02T14:15:37Z")
> [@danceswithcats](#): > > **Elenia28** indicated that one should vote for their candidate based upon an intelligent and informed opinion, and to that, I take no exception. > > I consider my own opinion to be equally well-based, but not in the opinion of the community dogpile. The bottom line is that there is absolutely no possible reason I can give for feeling as I do which will pass muster, so my opinion is what it is. > > Your opening line was disappointing to me, **Elenia**. “I KNOW it’s been done before, but not by me.” > > When someone starts the 8th “Ray Charles is dead” thread, other posters remind that search is your friend, because duplicity isn’t. That was my point, and if it causes me to lose favor in your eyes, so be it. > > This horse is dead, the flesh long ago flayed from the bleached, white bones remaining. Beat them to powder and thence into the dirt if you wish. I’ll pass, thanks. Yes but this is the Pit. Where people come to talk about what bothers them. If you don’t like what I’m talking about, dwc, then don’t read it. I think my title was clear enough that you knew. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/39 "2004-11-02T14:18:34Z")
Oh and one more thing: the person in question usually doesn’t have any problem discussing her politics, her kids, her social life or lack thereof, etc., etc. It wasn’t any kind of code for not wanting to talk about it more. I heartily disapprove of discussing politics at work, it creates for a tense atmosphere. However, this coworker of mine does not. The girl is in another office, though, so that helps. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404/40 "2004-11-02T17:13:06Z")
> [@Elenia28](#): > > Not everyone, but just these certain people. Kerry is bad because he flip-flops, because they don’t like him, because he looks French. Which isn’t surprising, since one of his grand fathers was french. He’s the first cousin of a minor french politician. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dont-you-have-a-better-reason-for-disliking-kerry/272404.md?page=3)