# "Doonesbury" mocks Starbucks open-carry policy **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 25, 2010, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689 "2010-03-25T00:17:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/81 "2010-03-27T16:46:27Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > CA Police are supposed to be armed at all times. I have an uncle (my dad’s brother) who is a CA police officer and he doesn’t carry when he’s off duty. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/82 "2010-03-27T16:47:39Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > Cops are armed _everywhere_, Dio. Not the ones I’ve known, and that includes two uncles.. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/83 "2010-03-27T17:06:29Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Yes,and why would they be armed at a convention? Depends on their department policy. Every department I know of dictates that officers who are on duty have all their equipment, including duty belt, weapon, etc.. I’ve been to several conventions representing a department. Even the times I wasn’t being paid I was mandated to have my duty belt on as I was in uniform. > [@Khaki\_Campbell](#): > > Been reading all of those “gun threads”, and excuse my European lack of understanding, but _why_ in the hell are pro-gun people so obsessed with carrying a weapon everywhere, even in some absolutely harmless coffee house ? Heres the thing: one never knows when a place is going to be harmless or not. Better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it. That nut that killed all those people in Omaha, Nebraska did it in a “harmless shopping mall”. And the "No guns allowed’ signs that Dio is so fond of didn’t do a goddamned thing to stop him. But it did give him a multitude of unarmed victims to choose from, didn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/84 "2010-03-27T17:10:27Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > CA Police are supposed to be armed at all times. I have to challenge this. Can you provide a cite that says this? Law enforcement officers are mandated by their individual departments official written policy. I know of few that dictate such a policy, and I know of no statewide mandate. But I may be ignorant. You made the claim, back it up please. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/85 "2010-03-27T17:14:24Z")
The idea that having dozens of John Waynes blasting away at each other in a situation like that is going to make things better is laughable. I’ll ask the same question I always ask. If multiple people have guns out, how is everyone (most importantly, law enforcement) supposed to know who the bad guy is and who the heroes are? “Danger” isn’t the point anyway. The point is that I don’t appreciate people scaring my kids unnecessarily by swaggering around with open firearms. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/86 "2010-03-27T17:28:56Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > The idea that having dozens of John Waynes blasting away at each other in a situation like that is going to make things better is laughable. I’ll ask the same question I always ask. If multiple people have guns out, how is everyone (most importantly, law enforcement) supposed to know who the bad guy is and who the heroes are? This is a good point but it is not laughable. With hundreds of millions of guns and 49 states having some kind of civilian carry this is not a scenario you can just scoff at. It is possible, probable, and inevitable. It’s happened before and it will happen again. People who carry weapons, including off duty cops, need to know how to act when on duty police arrive. Both the department I retired from and the department I’m on now had mandatory training in off-duty shooting situations. I would encourage civilians to seek the same type of training where available. Overall, armed law abiding civilians are a boon to law enforcement, not a hindrance. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/87 "2010-03-27T17:34:52Z")
How will the John Waynes know who to shoot at? How can the John Waynes behave when the cops get there that the real bad guy can’t also behave? ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/88 "2010-03-27T17:40:07Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Wheneevr you ask them this question, they just scream at you that it’s “because they CAN.” As has been said many times before, we do not owe you any explanation, justification or rationalization. And more to the point, you certainly aren’t going to get one if your only aim is to act like a prick in these sorts of threads. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/89 "2010-03-27T17:44:48Z")
The irony. It burns. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/90 "2010-03-27T17:53:20Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > The point is that I don’t appreciate people scaring my kids unnecessarily by swaggering around with open firearms. There are people who don’t appreciate their kids being exposed to Teh Gay Lifestyle[tm]. Shall we accommodate them as well? ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/91 "2010-03-27T17:55:34Z")
Really? Show me where I have acted like a prick in any gun-related threads. I’ll cite all the times that you have, and we’ll compare. It’s not like I have anything else to do this weekend, because that’s about how long it will take me to cover my end. It would take even longer if the word “nut” were searchable, as that is your favorite pejorative in these types of threads. For you it’ll be much easier, because 1) you won’t find too many instances, and 2) we’ve firmly established recently that while you can demand citation after citation, when it comes to you your post is your cite. ---
**Author:** ![JXJohns](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jxjohns/32/469_2.png) [@JXJohns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JXJohns)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/92 "2010-03-27T18:00:35Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > How will the John Waynes know who to shoot at? If I saw a fat asshole walking around an Omaha mall dressed like a ninja, using an AK clone to mow down civilians, I guess I’d start with him. > [@](#): > > How can the John Waynes behave when the cops get there that the real bad guy can’t also behave? They can stow their carry gun, find cover and wait for the cops. ---
**Author:** ![JoelUpchurch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f05b48/32.png) [@JoelUpchurch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoelUpchurch)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/93 "2010-03-27T18:01:41Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > How will the John Waynes know who to shoot at? > > How can the John Waynes behave when the cops get there that the real bad guy can’t also behave? I not sure what point you are trying to make. Isn’t the ideal outcome when the uniformed police show up, that everyone puts their firearms on the floor and the police don’t have to shoot anybody? That applies to plain clothes police officers also. Too many police officers have been killed by mistake by other police officers. ---
**Author:** ![JXJohns](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jxjohns/32/469_2.png) [@JXJohns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JXJohns)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/94 "2010-03-27T18:04:05Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > Really? Show me where I have acted like a prick in any gun-related threads. I’ll cite all the times that you have, and we’ll compare. It’s not like I have anything else to do this weekend, because that’s about how long it will take me to cover my end. It would take even longer if the word “nut” were searchable, as that is your favorite pejorative in these types of threads. > > For you it’ll be much easier, because 1) you won’t find too many instances, and 2) we’ve firmly established recently that while you can demand citation after citation, when it comes to you your post is your cite. Use the term redneck instead. Second most favorite… :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/95 "2010-03-27T19:06:56Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > There are people who don’t appreciate their kids being exposed to Teh Gay Lifestyle[tm]. Shall we accommodate them as well? [I’m fine with this…](http://www.californiaopencarry.org/pics/SDOC_Priceless.jpg) [I’m not so fine with this…](http://www.theonion.com/articles/gaypride-parade-sets-mainstream-acceptance-of-gays,351) […but I’m willing to compromise!](http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_PGvSoaafXiI/R0wetFVYP_I/AAAAAAAABF0/qFYr03Rq5r4/s400/pink-pistols.jpg) 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/96 "2010-03-27T19:45:00Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > There are people who don’t appreciate their kids being exposed to Teh Gay Lifestyle[tm]. Shall we accommodate them as well? Firt of all, there’s no such thing as a gay lifesty;e, so therefore, there’s no way to expose anybody to it. Second of all, I already said I had no legal problem with it, so what is your point? I just said I wouldn’t ring my kids there. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/97 "2010-03-27T19:46:03Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > Really? Show me where I have acted like a prick in any gun-related threads. I’ll cite all the times that you have, and we’ll compare. It’s not like I have anything else to do this weekend, because that’s about how long it will take me to cover my end. It would take even longer if the word “nut” were searchable, as that is your favorite pejorative in these types of threads. > > For you it’ll be much easier, because 1) you won’t find too many instances, and 2) we’ve firmly established recently that while you can demand citation after citation, when it comes to you your post is your cite. Who’s going to be the arbiter of what constitutes “being a prick?” You? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/98 "2010-03-27T19:49:20Z")
> [@JXJohns](#): > > If I saw a fat asshole walking around an Omaha mall dressed like a ninja, using an AK clone to mow down civilians, I guess I’d start with him. What if you see 12 fat assholes walking around with guns? How do you know which one the bad guy is (and where are you getting this “ninja” shit? Most spree shooters don’t wear costumes). > [@](#): > > They can stow their carry gun, find cover and wait for the cops. Why can’t the bad guy do that too? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2010, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/99 "2010-03-27T19:52:06Z")
> [@JoelUpchurch](#): > > I not sure what point you are trying to make. Isn’t the ideal outcome when the uniformed police show up, that everyone puts their firearms on the floor and the police don’t have to shoot anybody? > > That applies to plain clothes police officers also. Too many police officers have been killed by mistake by other police officers. Yeah, it always works that easily and neatly in a chaotic situation, where people with firearms can be scattered throughout a building, none of them with any idea who’s a good guy and who’s a bad guy. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2010, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689/100 "2010-03-28T02:39:34Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > I have to challenge this. Can you provide a cite that says this? Law enforcement officers are mandated by their individual departments official written policy. I know of few that dictate such a policy, and I know of no statewide mandate. But I may be ignorant. > > You made the claim, back it up please. Required? That’s up to the dept. Permitted? Always. > **[Yahoo Search - Web Search](https://search.yahoo.com/)** > > The search engine that helps you find exactly what you're looking for. Find the most relevant information, video, images, and answers from all across the Web. [http://forums.officer.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-33797.html](http://forums.officer.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-33797.html) > **[Armed and Drinking: Rules about off-duty law enforcement officers consuming...](https://bbvm.wordpress.com/2008/11/25/armed-and-drinking-rules-about-off-duty-law-enforcement-officers-consuming-alcohol-while-carrying-guns-get-fresh-look/)** > > Yet, law enforcement officials in the Inland region and across the U.S. can’t seem to agree whether that rule should apply to off-duty officers. Some agencies have enacted policies that expli… _Allowing deputies to remain armed while off duty is important for public safety, said Jim Cunningham, executive director of the Riverside Sheriff’s Association. “When they’re off duty, they’re never really off duty,” he said. “They can be pressed back into duty at a moment’s notice.” It is also important to allow deputies to remain armed while off duty for personal protection, Cunningham added._ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doonesbury-mocks-starbucks-open-carry-policy/533689.md?page=6)