# Dope on FL senate election **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 20, 2010, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703 "2010-04-20T01:56:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/61 "2010-04-30T03:27:33Z")
> [@jtgain](#): > > “Gutted public education in Florida” is a bit of hyperbole, don’t you think? > > There were some flaws in the bill, but **let’s get that merit pay system in place and then tweak the bad parts.** > > But Crist favored this bill from the outset. The legislature spent months and many dollars putting this bill together, but in the end, Crist showed his true colors by being a political whore and listening to the teachers unions, once again putting his finger to the wind to check the direction. Had he really been concerned about the bill, he could have worked with the legislature and produced a quality merit pay system to make Florida the leader in this area. But he doesn’t think like that. > > The guy has no character, or no core values. He does what he thinks is best for Charlie Crist at that particular moment. > > Yesterday the bill was good for him, today he thinks not, so he vetoes it. He’s a Republican, but now that he can’t be a U.S. Senator in the party, he will be an independent tomorrow. It’s all about Charlie I agree with all of your post except the bolded part. I’m sick of the Legislature passing bills with a promise to fix it later. Term limits have proven that they have a negative incentive to _ever_ fix it. It just goes on and on and on. Florida is fucked until we undo term limits. Case in point is that Florida’s current budget crisis was caused, in large measure, by…wait for it…RUBIO! But does anybody remember that now? Nope. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/62 "2010-04-30T13:46:31Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > What does N\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*l stand for? Is Rubio really a Narwhal? 4 across: An extinct species of humans, or subspecies of _Homo sapiens,_ inhabiting Europe in prehistoric times. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/63 "2010-04-30T16:27:37Z")
Nerfball. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/64 "2010-04-30T16:49:24Z")
The real reason that the GOP prefers Rubio to Crist is not idealogy. If Crist had enough support to win the primary and the general election he would be just as a reliable vote for the leadership as Rubio will be. The difference is ethnicity. Rubio is a good looking, articulate Latino. Previous Latino politicians have been pretty uninspiring, but Rubio has a charisma that few politicians have. If he becomes a senator he will be a national figure and the face of the GOP toward Hispanics. Then in 2012 or 2016 he goes on the presidential ticket and it makes it harder to paint the GOP as rascist. Like most politicians Crist is an egomaniac and an opportunist. This empty senate seat is his best shot at a cushy job with lots of power so he will do whatever it takes to have it. The problem is his biggest advantage is name recognition and after Rubio spends a couple score millions of dollars that advantage will be gone. The guy from the Democrat party is being overshadowed and having Crist siphon away the support of the teacher union can only hurt him. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/65 "2010-04-30T16:52:21Z")
Perhaps. The teachers’ unions certainly seem grateful - they’re running a series of statewide “thank you” ads which don’t mention the election at all and simply applaud Crist for the veto. That could make things very interesting, though; if Crist’s funding base really does dry up as sharply as the GOP says it will, he’ll _have_ to move to the left, and maybe even end up caucusing with the Democrats if he wins. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/66 "2010-04-30T18:47:43Z")
Other than teachers unions, who have already got what they wanted out of Crist, why would a liberal give to him over Meeks? With Lieberman potential donors knew what they were going to get. Crist could move left, but Meeks is already there and donors will be afraid of Crist moving back to the right if the wind starts to blow that way. Potential donors to Crist seem to be limited to those who think Crist is indispensable to the country or state of Florida. My guess is there are fewer of those than Crist believes. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/67 "2010-04-30T19:13:41Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > Other than teachers unions, who have already got what they wanted out of Crist, why would a liberal give to him over Meeks? To keep Rubio out i would vote for Crist. Very liberal latino Floridian here. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/68 "2010-04-30T19:17:09Z")
What he said. Florida voters are pragmatic, and we’ve\* never fallen for the trap of letting excellence stand in the way of the good. Anyway, most of us don’t know Kendrick Meeks from a hole in the ground. Crist may be unpredictable, but he’s predictable in his moderation. \*I’m not a citizen so I can’t vote. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/69 "2010-04-30T20:39:17Z")
One of the things that worries me about Meek is that he hasn’t faced any competitive elections in any of his House races. His mother held the seat until 2002, and then the 2002 race that he won, as well as every subsequent election, he’s run unopposed. It makes me wonder if his campaign skills are up to snuff. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/70 "2010-04-30T21:03:17Z")
I wonder if there will be a three-way televised debate? Meek will demand one, because of his name-recognition problem, and Crist and Rubio will try to duck it for the same reason. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/71 "2010-04-30T22:11:58Z")
[From _The Nation:_](http://www.thenation.com/blogs/thebeat/556498/charlie_crist_s_declaration_of_independence_and_sanity) > [@](#): > > Crist is no liberal in the tradition of Republicans such as former New York Senator Jacob Javits, former New Jersey Senator Clifford Case or former Connecticut Senator Lowell Weicker – let alone former New York Mayors Fiorello La Guardia or John Lindsay. > > Crist is not even a moderate in the tradition, say, of a former Massachusetts Governor William Weld or one of the two remaining sort-of moderates in the Republican Senate Caucus, Maine outliers Susan Collins and Olympia Snowe. > > Crist is best understood as a ideological inheritor of Senate Majority Leader Bob Dole, R-Kansas, or, perhaps, former President George Herbert Walker Bush. For instance, Crist supports capital punishment and gun rights and opposes same-sex marriage and, though he opposes overturning Roe-v-Wade, he has appointed anti-choice jurists to the Florida Supreme Court. > > That’s hardly the profile of a social moderate in any realistic sense. > > But it has been the profile of a winner. Crist has been repeatedly elected in Florida, to the legislature and as the state’s education commissioner, attorner general and governor. In good years for Republicans and bad, he has been the party’s standard-bearer and frequently its unexpected winner. > > What makes the Floridian appealing is not so much his moderation as his relative sanity. > > Crist has refused to go off the ideological deep end that has claimed so many formerly mainstream conservative Republicans – making the party’s U.S. House and Senate caucuses over as “party of no” preserves of reaction rather than functional engagement with the governing process. > > Along with California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger, Crist acknowledges that climate change is a threat and proposes to address it. > > He’s for conservation and critical of offshore drilling. > > He’s mildly sympathetic to public education. > > If anything has distinguished Crist, it is his determination to reach out to African-American and Latino voters, as well as other ethnic and racial minorities. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2010, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/72 "2010-05-01T03:21:33Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > [From _The Nation:_](http://www.thenation.com/blogs/thebeat/556498/charlie_crist_s_declaration_of_independence_and_sanity) Oh my supporting gun rights, and the death penalty and opposing gay marriage (which many liberal politicians also support) and being a moderate on the abortion issue makes you socially reactionary, eh? :dubious: I like both Crist and Rubio. My main problem with Crist is his pro-abortion stance although he’s willing to appoint pro-life judges. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2010, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/73 "2010-05-02T05:27:52Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Nerfball. I’d have no problem voting for a Nerfball OR a Narwhal… ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2010, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/74 "2010-05-02T05:35:41Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Oh my supporting gun rights, and the death penalty and opposing gay marriage (which many liberal politicians also support) and being a moderate on the abortion issue makes you socially reactionary, eh? :dubious: Yep. The world moves on. By the time YOU can vote, homophobes will be looked at like we look at Bull Conner and Orval Faubus. (You might want to look those people up. Don’t know how accurately they’re teaching the Civil Rights era in that wingnut religious school of yours.) ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2010, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/75 "2010-05-02T15:08:54Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Yep. The world moves on. By the time YOU can vote, homophobes will be looked at like we look at Bull Conner and Orval Faubus. (You might want to look those people up. Don’t know how accurately they’re teaching the Civil Rights era in that wingnut religious school of yours.) I don’t think that’s true. Acceptance of gay marriage in increasing, and I think, assuming existing trends continue, that it eventually will be widely accepted in the US, but I think that it’ll take more than a few years. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2010, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/76 "2010-05-02T20:01:15Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Oh my supporting gun rights, and the death penalty and opposing gay marriage (which many liberal politicians also support) and being a moderate on the abortion issue makes you socially reactionary, eh? :dubious: In what sense are you a moderate on the abortion issue? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2010, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/77 "2010-05-02T20:27:51Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > In what sense are you a moderate on the abortion issue? He was saying the Crist was a moderate on the abortion issue. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2010, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/78 "2010-05-02T20:40:30Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > He was saying the Crist was a moderate on the abortion issue. If he was–I agree that’s what he meant to say–putting a comma after “Oh my” would have really wrapped it up nicely. And much quicker than usual. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/79 "2010-05-03T02:23:29Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Yep. The world moves on. By the time YOU can vote, homophobes will be looked at like we look at Bull Conner and Orval Faubus. (You might want to look those people up. Don’t know how accurately they’re teaching the Civil Rights era in that wingnut religious school of yours.) I go to a public school. > [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > He was saying the Crist was a moderate on the abortion issue. This. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703/80 "2010-05-03T02:30:41Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > I go to a public school. My apologies. I thought you’d mentioned going to a private Christian school before. A trip back through the search function proved me wrong. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dope-on-fl-senate-election/536703.md?page=3)