# Dopers afraid of DC **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 8, 2009, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759 "2009-11-08T03:17:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/61 "2009-11-09T04:46:43Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > To be honest I wouldn’t want to be lost in any black ghetto. Acting like it’s unreasonable to be afraid is kind of dishonest. It’s not that any given neighborhood is always safe. I wouldn’t want to be moseying around South L.A. on foot after dark myself. But for some people that would only be the beginning of the anxiety. For them, just to drive on the surface streets for a few miles between the 10 and the Civic Center, even in the bright morning, is too risky to consider doing. I know someone who thinks GPS navigators are worthless, because they tell you to take routes that are contrary to this “wisdom”. There’s definitely some areas around here where I wouldn’t feel comfortable at night, even if driving. But I can’t think of any that I’d be afraid to drive through, or even walk in, during a normal day. ---
**Author:** ![not\_alice](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_alice/32/7283_2.png) [@not\_alice](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_alice)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/62 "2009-11-09T05:01:52Z")
> [@Belowjob2.0](#): > > Fort Washington homeboy here. > > Part of what we’re doing here is reminiscing. DC is rapidly losing its black majority. This will probably be the last generation where DC remains a “black” town. Really? That would be news to me. Not saying it aint so, I just don’t know. I regularly read Baltimore news online, occasionally the Washington Post, but haven’t heard this before. Can you provide a citation or two please? ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/63 "2009-11-09T05:29:26Z")
> [@Zsofia](#): > > _Las_ cucarachas. Is that an indictment of DC black public schools? 🙂 I believe She Who Is Never Wrong (at least in the past 36 years, as far as she will admit) was referirng to all schools she had access to, black, white, asian, and or/Other, and I was wrong. Mea Maxima culpa. Okay, kids these days laugh at the distinctions that were forced on us back then. They really, truly, have no idea. When your parents and grandparents ruled the scene you were seen as \*\*\*\*, ESPECIALLY by those who had fought the battles. Look it up. Otherwise you are pretending that nothing meant something. And all of that was a century old. What thwy know is bull\*\*\*\*. ---
**Author:** ![Belowjob2.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/64 "2009-11-09T05:44:21Z")
[http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/11000.html](http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/11000.html) > [@](#): > > White persons, percent, 2008 (a) 40.1% > > Black persons, percent, 2008 (a) 54.4% [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics\_of\_Washington,\_D.C.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Washington,_D.C.) > [@](#): > > In 2007 the population distribution was 55.6% black, 36.3% white, 8.3% Hispanic (of any race), 5% other (including Native Americans, Alaskans, Hawaiians, and Pacific Islanders), 3.1% Asian, and 1.6% mixed .[20] Even though they compose the city’s largest ethnic group, Washington has a steadily declining black population, due to many African Americans’ leaving the city for suburbs. At the same time, the city’s Caucasian population has steadily increased, in part due to effects of gentrification in many of Washington’s traditionally black neighborhoods.[11] This is evident in a 7.3% decrease in the African-American population, and a 17.8% increase in the Caucasian population since 2000.[13] > [@](#): > > Ethnic Makeup of Washington, D.C.[17] > Year White Black Asian Native > Americans Other Hispanic > (any race) > 1800 69.6% 30.4% - - - - > 1810 66.9% 33.1% - - - - > 1820 68.8% 31.2% - - - - > 1830 69.9% 30.1% - - - - > 1840 70.9% 29.1% - - - - > 1850 73.4% 26.6% - - - - > 1860 80.9% 19.1% - - - - > 1870 67.0% 33.0% - - - - > 1880 66.4% 33.6% - - - - > 1890 67.1% 32.8% - - - - > 1900 68.7% 31.1% 0.2% - - - > 1910 71.3% 28.5% 0.1% - - - > 1920 74.7% 25.1% 0.2% - - - > 1930 72.7% 27.1% 0.2% - - - > 1940 71.5% 28.2% 0.2% - - - > 1950 64.6% 35.0% 0.4% - - - > 1960 45.2% 53.9% 0.6% 0.1% 0.2% - > 1970 27.7% 71.1% 0.7% 0.1% 0.4% - > 1980 26.9% 70.3% 1.0% 0.2% 1.6% 2.8% > 1990 29.6% 65.8% 1.8% 0.2% 2.5% 5.4% > 2000 30.8% 60.0% 2.7% 0.4% 3.8% 7.9% > 2007 36.3% 55.6% 3.1% 0.2% 4.8% 8.3% Not that Wikipedia is the best source, but the data’s good, and the trend is unmistakable and widely recognized by people in the DC area. White majority in twenty years, I’d say. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/65 "2009-11-09T06:46:21Z")
The idea that someone from Loudon County is going to comment on what neighborhoods are good in DC makes as much sense as me, a resident of DC, commenting on what neighborhoods in Baltimore are good, or bad. It’s fine to be scared of the unknown, or different, but when you spout off your uninformed fear based “facts” about a community you are perpetuating stereotypes. It’s also funny to me to read these stay out of SE comments for another reason. I live in Petworth (although currently in Kabul) and there are parts of SE that I find just unbearably pretentious and yuppified. My cousin lives down past the Marine Barracks and I can’t believe all the chocolate labs and yuppies with their baby stroller SUVS down there. I stay out of SE because I can’t afford to drink there. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/66 "2009-11-09T12:17:05Z")
A white coworker once told me, after doing a stint at Georgetown, that she had learned never never EVER go into Prince George’s County. She never mentioned that she’d ever done so to find out for herself, but nevertheless she accepted this as conventional wisdom. Just for those who don’t know, PG County is actually one of the most affluent counties in the state. And just happens to be 50% black. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/67 "2009-11-09T12:21:19Z")
> [@raindog](#): > > If you actually lived in West End Atlanta then I’d expect a broader awareness of urban life. > > Your ethnicity (white or black) in an urban environment may may not confer you some special protection, but it may sure garner you some special attention. The same can be said about just about any neighborhood, urban, rural, or suburban. And if you doubt that I lived in the West End, there’s another poster on this board who will vouch for me. ---
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/68 "2009-11-09T12:30:33Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > The same can be said about just about any neighborhood, urban, rural, or suburban. > > And if you doubt that I lived in the West End, there’s another poster on this board who will vouch for me. I don’t doubt you. I’m just saying that being the wrong color can get you in a heap of trouble in many urban neighborhoods. (although I think that is often overblown and exaggerated) ---
**Author:** ![joebuck20](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/74df32/32.png) [@joebuck20](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joebuck20)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/69 "2009-11-09T15:30:01Z")
Every city has a similar area that inspires fear among the suburbanites. When I lived in Houston I got an apartment on the southwest side of the city which is heavily immigrant Hispanic. I was new in town and didn’t know the good areas from the bad. But the rents there were fantastic and the complex I lived in was really nice and had 24-hour security. When I told people at work where I was living, though, they all gave me a look like “Dude, you need to get out of there.” One supervisor even went so far as to circle some apartment ads in the classifieds and suggest that I seek out different living arrangements. Granted it was the type of neighborhood where I wouldn’t go jogging at night, but you could say that of any number of urban areas even ones that have a good reputation. In the year that I lived there I never had any problems. A coworker who started about the same time I did and lived in a “nice” part of town, however, got their car broken into. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/70 "2009-11-09T15:41:39Z")
> [@Belowjob2.0](#): > > White majority in twenty years, I’d say. I’m not sure about majority white. I think it is going to be like California, where there is no majority. I was talking to someone in the DC government not long ago who said that the DC political establishment (codeword for most of the African-American city council) is going to go apoplectic when the 2010 census is done, because the current numbers on the shrinking black majority don’t fully account for the growth in the Hispanic population here; and that, in fact, the city could be less than 50% black next year. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/71 "2009-11-09T15:44:18Z")
When I lived in suburban Maryland my car was stolen. In Petworth, I’ve had a deer in my driveway and a possum in my basement. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Joe\_Meager](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bb73d2/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Joe\_Meager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Joe_Meager)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/72 "2009-11-09T16:19:32Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > I think a lot of people still believe Alphabet City and the Lower East Side of Manhattan are dangerous ghettos. Ah, the good old days. When Tompkins Square was ringed in chain link, ABC No Rio was still cool (and unknown), and plenty of record stores that didn’t sell any records. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Smashy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mr\_Smashy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Smashy)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/73 "2009-11-09T16:21:44Z")
Hi everyone, long time lurker on these boards (we’re talking many years), but this thread finally got me to register. I’d have to say that, like so much in life, ‘it depends’. It depends on what you like, and depends on where in SE we’re talking about: Parts of SE (near the stadium and Navy Yard, Cap Hill, and soon possibly by St E’s what with the coming DHS HQ and therefore requisite gentrification) are, or will be soon, nice. But parts are definitely to be avoided, no matter your color. Living in affluent, gated (and yes, very white) Western PW County, it may only be 40 miles but might as well be on another planet. Very very few people that I know, maybe 1%, would ever want to have anything to do with SE; either moving there, going to dinner there, raising a family there. Of course it’s not just crime: DC government is way too disfunctional (my brother lives in Cleveland Park so I hear the horror stories), parking is a pain, the schools suck, and long time one-party government has led to patronage and corruption. I completely understand that to some, life out in braindead suburbia, with the strip malls, long commutes, and lack of constant action, is a fate worse than death. To each his own I suppose. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Joe\_Meager](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bb73d2/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Joe\_Meager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Joe_Meager)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/74 "2009-11-09T16:25:32Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > In Petworth, I’ve had a possum in my basement. Better than a coon. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Arky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/87869e/32.png) [@An\_Arky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Arky)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/75 "2009-11-09T16:26:17Z")
**madmonk28** , I’m not sure why you single my post from a thread several months ago out; I wasn’t saying that stuff because I’m personally averse to any of that stuff. Sometimes, you answer questions based on what the asker might have in mind, regardless of your personal feelings on the issue. To be quite honest, I’m closer to your side in this issue than you think. You’re painting with far too broad a brush, though, IMHO. My post then certainly was worded more harshly than I would have with more review, but I was trying to just lay the issue out there, not say “ooh, scary black people” or anything. I do work in and hang out in DC, in some places many suburbanites and far-NW residents wouldn’t. It’s part of the experience of being in a DC band (we practice in my drummer’s basement, not far at all from Petworth, actually). The thing is, it’s getting better in lots of parts of DC, it really is. There are nicer things going up in areas I wouldn’t have dreamed of 20 years ago when I first moved here. So I absolutely have no qualms saying to somebody moving here “Hey, try Petworth” or something, but it depends on the person. But as often as not, I encounter folks who don’t seem game to the “Hey, try Petworth” gambit. That’s certainly worthy of some scorn, but it’s more about how folks are raised and educated that get us to this point; a larger issue than DC neighborhoods, to be sure. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/76 "2009-11-09T17:09:41Z")
It’s alternating current that’s really dangerous! The electric chair uses AC ya know. ---
**Author:** ![Belowjob2.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/77 "2009-11-09T18:43:29Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > I’m not sure about majority white. I think it is going to be like California, where there is no majority. I was talking to someone in the DC government not long ago who said that the DC political establishment (codeword for most of the African-American city council) is going to go apoplectic when the 2010 census is done, because the current numbers on the shrinking black majority don’t fully account for the growth in the Hispanic population here; and that, in fact, the city could be less than 50% black next year. I take your point, but I’m guessing that gentrification will ultimately force out much of the working class Latino population as well. The hillside city views and old housing stock in Anacostia are amazing. It hasn’t really been affected by gentrification, but it will be. DC will be less of a black, Southern city, and more like Frisco on the Potomac. (No sexual connotations there, just pointing to demographics, economics and lifestyle.) ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2009, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/78 "2009-11-10T03:55:26Z")
> [@An\_Arky](#): > > **madmonk28** , I’m not sure why you single my post from a thread several months ago out; I wasn’t saying that stuff because I’m personally averse to any of that stuff. Sometimes, you answer questions based on what the asker might have in mind, regardless of your personal feelings on the issue. To be quite honest, I’m closer to your side in this issue than you think. You’re painting with far too broad a brush, though, IMHO. My post then certainly was worded more harshly than I would have with more review, but I was trying to just lay the issue out there, not say “ooh, scary black people” or anything. > > I do work in and hang out in DC, in some places many suburbanites and far-NW residents wouldn’t. It’s part of the experience of being in a DC band (we practice in my drummer’s basement, not far at all from Petworth, actually). The thing is, it’s getting better in lots of parts of DC, it really is. There are nicer things going up in areas I wouldn’t have dreamed of 20 years ago when I first moved here. So I absolutely have no qualms saying to somebody moving here “Hey, try Petworth” or something, but it depends on the person. But as often as not, I encounter folks who don’t seem game to the “Hey, try Petworth” gambit. That’s certainly worthy of some scorn, but it’s more about how folks are raised and educated that get us to this point; a larger issue than DC neighborhoods, to be sure. I linked to your post because I think it perfectly made my point. People are claiming that it’s not a race thing, but you had the courage of your convictions to say what you really thought. One thing that really bothers me is when people try to be cute and talk in code with statements like “stay out of SE” and then when you call them on it, they try to pretend that I’ve misinterpreted their comments. Anytime someone makes a comment about the south being racist or backwards, peole jump on the statement immediately and call them out on it, but people who don’t even live in DC feel perfectly comfortable writing off an entire quadrant without demostrating that they have ever even set foot in that quadrant. ---
**Author:** ![athelas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5e9695/32.png) [@athelas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/athelas)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2009, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/79 "2009-11-10T05:12:33Z")
Oh noes, people make mostly-accurate generalizations that are occasionally overly cautious or erroneous in small details! Clearly, all of them must be bigoted morons! ---
**Author:** ![tim314](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim314/32/3468_2.png) [@tim314](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tim314)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2009, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759/80 "2009-11-10T06:59:51Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > I see it on this board all the time: Dopers saying things like “stay out of SE,” or “whatever you do, don’t live in SE.” So why don’t you name some of these dopers instead of just taking potshots at everyone from Nothern Virginia. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-afraid-of-dc/516759.md?page=5)