# Dopers francais---is the new Hebdo cartoon of Mohammed what I think it is?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [January 14, 2015, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843 "2015-01-14T19:09:27Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@ccccalc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ccccalc)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/1 "2015-01-14T19:09:27Z")
In the new Hebdo newspaper, the cover features Mohammed.
> **[hebdo cover - Bing](http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=hebdo%20cover&qs=n&form=QBIR&pq=hebdo%20cover&sc=0-0&sp=-1&sk=)**
>
> Intelligent search from Bing makes it easier to quickly find what you’re looking for and rewards you.
Now my interpretation per my broken high school French is that Mohammed is crying ‘crocodile tears’ while holding the “I am Charlie” sign----with the phrase “All is forgiven” above.
Is this a correct interpretation?
PS, I believe that other threads are dealing with the pros/cons/etc. of free speech, Islam, etc.
I’m just looking for a “correct” interpretation of the Mohammed cartoon from a French speaker.
Thanks!
---
### Author:  [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/2 "2015-01-14T19:16:31Z")
At first glance, it looks like he is forgiving those who do violence in his name. Not mocking the religion at all.
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### Author:  [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/3 "2015-01-14T19:51:38Z")
Here is the [answer](http://www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/2015/01/13/charlie_hebdo_new_cover_translated_and_explained_cartoonist_luz_on_new_mohammed.htmlhttp://) from the cartoonist
> [@](#):
>
> I had this idea that I was stuck on: to draw my caricature of Mohammed, the one that had started all the chatter. And to do him holding a “Je Suis Charlie” sign. It made me laugh. It was my last-ditch effort. So I drew my little drawing, and I looked at his face, and it made me laugh. I saw this character who had been used in spite of himself by nut jobs who set shit on fire, by terrorists. Humorless assholes: That’s what these terrorists are. Of course everything is forgiven, my man Mohammed. We can overcome, because I managed to draw you. I showed my drawing to Richard Malka, then to Gérard Biard, and then we cried. Because we had it, a cover that looked like us, and that didn’t look like everyone else or like the symbols that have been imposed on us over the last few days. Not a cover with bullet holes, but just a cover that makes us laugh.
So basically the paper forgives the cartoon depiction of Mohammed for all the trouble he caused, and makes him hold a I am Charlie sign because they can.
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### Author:  [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/4 "2015-01-14T19:58:23Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#):
>
> Here is the [answer](http://www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/2015/01/13/charlie_hebdo_new_cover_translated_and_explained_cartoonist_luz_on_new_mohammed.htmlhttp://) from the cartoonist
>
> > [@](#):
> >
> > I had this idea that I was stuck on: to draw my caricature of Mohammed, the one that had started all the chatter. And to do him holding a “Je Suis Charlie” sign. It made me laugh. It was my last-ditch effort. So I drew my little drawing, and I looked at his face, and it made me laugh. I saw this character who had been used in spite of himself by nut jobs who set shit on fire, by terrorists. Humorless assholes: That’s what these terrorists are. Of course everything is forgiven, my man Mohammed. We can overcome, because I managed to draw you. I showed my drawing to Richard Malka, then to Gérard Biard, and then we cried. Because we had it, a cover that looked like us, and that didn’t look like everyone else or like the symbols that have been imposed on us over the last few days. Not a cover with bullet holes, but just a cover that makes us laugh
>
> So basically the paper forgives the cartoon depiction of Mohammed for all the trouble he caused, and makes him hold a I am Charlie sign because they can.
I’ve read this twice, and I still don’t understand what he is saying. Who is forgiving who, and for what?
Regards,
Shodan
---
### Author:  [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/5 "2015-01-14T20:03:42Z")
I interpreted the tear as sincere. Why would it be a “crocodile tear”?
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### Author:  [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/6 "2015-01-14T20:21:42Z")
> [@Shodan](#):
>
> I’ve read this twice, and I still don’t understand what he is saying. Who is forgiving who, and for what?
I understood what he was saying until **Buck Godot** explained it. “It’s not really supposed to mean anything. It just made us chuckle when we were sad.”
I read it the same way as **Czarcasm** initially, and I suspect that’s what most of the editorial staff were thinking.
> [@](#):
>
> At first glance, it looks like he is forgiving those who do violence in his name. Not mocking the religion at all.
---
### Author:  [@camille](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/camille)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/7 "2015-01-14T20:33:35Z")
> [@Shodan](#):
>
> I’ve read this twice, and I still don’t understand what he is saying. Who is forgiving who, and for what?
>
> Regards,
> Shodan
[Zineb El Rhazoui, who works for Charlie Hebdo, has revealed the meaning behind the controversial front cover:](http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/551692/Charlie-Hebdo-Je-Suis-Charlie-Cover-Prophet-Mohammed-cartoon-Survivors-Edition)
> [@](#):
>
> Ms Rhazoui - who was on holiday at the time of the attack – said staff “cannot feel any hate towards” the two gunmen.
>
> Explaining the choice of headline, she added: "It is addressed to us because we feel we have to forgive what happened.
>
> "We feel as the Charlie Hebdo team the need to forgive the two terrorists who killed our colleagues.
>
> "We cannot feel any hate towards them. We know that the struggle is not with them as people but the struggle is with an ideology.
>
> “This mobilisation here in France after this horrible crime is something that must open the door to forgiveness and everyone must think about this forgiveness.”
---
### Author:  [@ccccalc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ccccalc)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/8 "2015-01-14T20:41:13Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#):
>
> I interpreted the tear as sincere. Why would it be a “crocodile tear”?
mainly because Mohammed isn’t exactly drawn reverently. Look at how “South Park” drew Mohammed in the episodes “Super Best Friends”. [south park super best friends mohammed - Search Images](http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=south+park+super+best+friends+mohammed&go=Submit&qs=ds&form=QBIR)
The Hebdo cover’s Mohammed looks like, for lack of a better description, “a big-nosed Arab guy in a turban” and draws parallels between unflattering drawings of Jews as big-nosed Shylocks in yarmulkes. which was why I was confused as to the intent of the cartoon.
again that’s only to my eyes and I appreciate the above links quoting the actual cartoonist----but still leaves me confused. does the cartoonist not understand that he could put a bit more effort into making Mohammed look more reverent?
and thanks for the links quoting the cartoonist.
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### Author:  [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/9 "2015-01-14T20:48:21Z")
> [@ccccalc](#):
>
> I believe that other threads are dealing with the pros/cons/etc. of free speech, Islam, etc.
>
> I’m just looking for a “correct” interpretation of the Mohammed cartoon from a French speaker.
So, then, what’s the debate?
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### Author:  [@Hank\_Beecher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hank_Beecher)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/10 "2015-01-14T20:50:40Z")
> [@ccccalc](#):
>
> does the cartoonist not understand that he could put a bit more effort into making Mohammed look more reverent?
Sure, but they don’t revere him. The irreverence is a big component of the message.
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### Author:  [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/11 "2015-01-14T20:53:17Z")
> [@ccccalc](#):
>
> does the cartoonist not understand that he could put a bit more effort into making Mohammed look more reverent?
Do you understand what cartoons are?
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### Author:  [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/12 "2015-01-14T21:11:35Z")
> [@ccccalc](#):
>
> mainly because Mohammed isn’t exactly drawn reverently. Look at how “South Park” drew Mohammed in the episodes “Super Best Friends”. [south park super best friends mohammed - Search Images](http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=south+park+super+best+friends+mohammed&go=Submit&qs=ds&form=QBIR)
>
> The Hebdo cover’s Mohammed looks like, for lack of a better description, “a big-nosed Arab guy in a turban” and draws parallels between unflattering drawings of Jews as big-nosed Shylocks in yarmulkes. which was why I was confused as to the intent of the cartoon.
>
> again that’s only to my eyes and I appreciate the above links quoting the actual cartoonist----but still leaves me confused. does the cartoonist not understand that he could put a bit more effort into making Mohammed look more reverent?
>
> and thanks for the links quoting the cartoonist.
Please explain why this particular religious leader should get preferential treatment over all the other religious leaders that have been drawn in that style of caricature in that magazine over the years? How they made him look is how they make everyone look, pretty much-it is a caricature, not a portrait.
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### Author:  [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/13 "2015-01-14T21:57:07Z")
> [@camille](#):
>
> [Zineb El Rhazoui, who works for Charlie Hebdo, has revealed the meaning behind the controversial front cover:](http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/551692/Charlie-Hebdo-Je-Suis-Charlie-Cover-Prophet-Mohammed-cartoon-Survivors-Edition)
> Ms Rhazoui - who was on holiday at the time of the attack – said staff “cannot feel any hate towards” the two gunmen.
>
> Explaining the choice of headline, she added: "It is addressed to us because we feel we have to forgive what happened.
>
> "We feel as the Charlie Hebdo team the need to forgive the two terrorists who killed our colleagues.
>
> "We cannot feel any hate towards them. We know that the struggle is not with them as people but the struggle is with an ideology.
>
> “This mobilisation here in France after this horrible crime is something that must open the door to forgiveness and everyone must think about this forgiveness.”
Why would Muhammed forgive the gunmen? And what is the significance of the “Je suis Charlie”?
On preview - never mind. I am trying to have a joke explaned, and that never works.
Regards,
Shodan
---
### Author:  [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/14 "2015-01-14T22:14:30Z")
To me it makes sense if I replace “all is forgiven” with “now we’re even.” IOW, Mohammed needs to pay a little penance for what his followers did in his name, and the penance is being cartooned holding a “je suis Charlie” sign.
---
### Author:  [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/15 "2015-01-14T22:16:07Z")
Of course, there are those who are claiming that the headpiece resembles a penis.
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### Author:  [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/16 "2015-01-14T22:28:53Z")
> [@levdrakon](#):
>
> To me it makes sense if I replace “all is forgiven” with “now we’re even.” IOW, Mohammed needs to pay a little penance for what his followers did in his name, and the penance is being cartooned holding a “je suis Charlie” sign.
IMO, it works best with no headline at all. I’ve read the explanations, and like **Shodan** I’m still a bit baffled by the implication of forgiveness. I’m not convinced that they were even clear what they meant by it.
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### Author:  [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)
#### Post date: [January 14, 2015, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/17 "2015-01-14T22:32:34Z")
I thought the headpiece resembled a butt - like it’s an asshat. But I don’t know if that was the artist’s intention.
And yes, I thought Mohammed was telling Charlie that he (Mohammed) was forgiving them (Charlie Hebdo) for making fun of him. But I guess reading the artist’s explanation - it’s the artist (and the magazine) saying Everything Is Forgiven, to the terrorists who hurt them. So sort of a repeat of their Love Will Conquer All message from that cover they did where Mohammed and Charlie are kissing.
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### Author:  [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)
#### Post date: [January 15, 2015, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/18 "2015-01-15T02:23:24Z")
> [@ccccalc](#):
>
> Now my interpretation per my broken high school French is that Mohammed is crying ‘crocodile tears’ while holding the “I am Charlie” sign----with the phrase “All is forgiven” above.
Frenchie here, and that was indeed my interpretation of the cartoon as I wrote elsewhere on the board. i.e. That the “All is forgiven” was dripping with sarcasm, and that the caricature itself was mockery of the crocodile tears of Muslims who now join the solidarity thing. Because he really look like he’s pulling something like [the Puss In Boots face](http://2e130c55e0c2763c8a20-c7a4d0feffd26319b59c92c4aecae366.r18.cf1.rackcdn.com/f565831f11dc9d8a5e4866856088a79216355bd0.jpg), right ?
Or, possibly, another way to read the cartoon I figured was that it could be mocking how the “Je Suis Charlie” slogan has been co-opted and instrumentalized by just about everyone by now and already doesn’t mean anything at all.
But apparently neither is how Luz (or what’s left of the Charlie team) intended it at all. Communication is hard.
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### Author:  [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)
#### Post date: [January 15, 2015, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/19 "2015-01-15T02:35:15Z")
I don’t get how you guys are reading this as anything other than “We forgive the attackers.” It’s the most natural meaning of the cartoon, and it’s exactly what both explanations have said it meant. Who else could “All is forgiven” be addressed to? Who else did anything wrong?
Yes, maybe if there were Muslims going around saying they forgave Charlie Hebdo for their actions, maybe it would make sense to mock them. But they aren’t. There’s no forgiveness for the title to be satirizing.
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### Author:  [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)
#### Post date: [January 15, 2015, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843/20 "2015-01-15T02:43:40Z")
> [@BigT](#):
>
> I don’t get how you guys are reading this as anything other than “We forgive the attackers.” It’s the most natural meaning of the cartoon, and it’s exactly what both explanations have said it meant. Who else could “All is forgiven” be addressed to? Who else did anything wrong?
Well Charlie covers have basically always used antiphrase, sarcasm and irony to get their points across, so that’s how I took it. If they suddenly start saying exactly what they mean and meaning exactly what they say, it catches me off-balance :p.
There’s also the fact that while Charlie’s been criticized by many political sides for many reasons over the years, #JeSuisCharlie has become a whole… \*Thing, \*so it could have meant “hey, now that something horrible as happened to us the same guys show up and say they’ve always supported us, look what wonderful forgiveness they found in their little hearts”, that kind of thing.
[Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dopers-francais-is-the-new-hebdo-cartoon-of-mohammed-what-i-think-it-is/709843.md?page=2)