# Double Jeopardy- Gone. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [May 3, 2012, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745 "2012-05-03T12:44:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/1 "2012-05-03T12:44:33Z")
Now, in our state, you can be retried for a serious offence if new and compelling evidence comes to light. Goodbye double jeopardy. [Link.](http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/western-australia/double-jeopardy-legislation-passed/story-e6frg14c-1226346214356) ---
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/2 "2012-05-03T12:50:06Z")
I started to shout ‘What about the 5th Amm…oh’. Realized you’re in Australia. Is it possible that legal challenges will overturn that legislation? ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/3 "2012-05-03T12:57:40Z")
> [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > I started to shout ‘What about the 5th Amm…oh’. Realized you’re in Australia. > > Is it possible that legal challenges will overturn that legislation? It’s possible of course. This is State Legislation and federal law will always over ride state law. I think it is due to advances in science- obviously DNA- and hopefully will be used selectively. I haven’t seen the legislation so I don’t have any more details. However, in the past decade or two there were a number of cases where the person who was let off was later tried for perjury- until a few courts started to get tired of that as well. Australian law is rooted in UK law, and case law emanating from that. However, statute law can override case law. IANAL and I think we do have some Australian lawyers around who can give a far more correct version than I can. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/4 "2012-05-03T13:00:47Z")
Y’know, from the article this is a trend across the Australian states and it would not surprise me if people were trying everywhere, even to weasel it into the law in the USA, constitution or not. I suppose it comes partly from the inevitable tension between the notion of _procedural_ justice on which the system has been built until now and that of, how the hell do I call it, conceptual? justice, the gut feeling that “it’s not right they should get away with it”. And I see they latch on to progress in forensics, sort of along the lines of “if new evidence can be used to exonerate, it should be usable to convict” though they don’t explicitly say so. Are conviction and acquittal symmetrical things? ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/5 "2012-05-03T13:01:02Z")
What? Do you go straight to Final Jeopardy, then? ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/6 "2012-05-03T13:02:37Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > What? > Do you go straight to Final Jeopardy, then? Only if the price is right. ---
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/7 "2012-05-03T13:06:22Z")
If it’s based on new DNA processing abilities, perhaps they should start elsewhere: Review the cases of any person who is currently serving a life sentence, where there is DNA comparison available, if it wasn’t done during their initial trial. Verify that you already have the right people in jail, then go after ones that you couldn’t get a conviction on the first time. ---
**Author:** ![Xema](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9de053/32.png) [@Xema](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xema)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/8 "2012-05-03T13:18:37Z")
> [@Cicero](#): > > Goodbye double jeopardy. Shouldn’t this be “Hello” ? ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/9 "2012-05-03T13:22:38Z")
> [@Cicero](#): > > Now, in our state, you can be retried for a serious offence if new and compelling evidence comes to light. Is this a problem? ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/10 "2012-05-03T13:23:04Z")
> [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > If it’s based on new DNA processing abilities, perhaps they should start elsewhere: Review the cases of any person who is currently serving a life sentence, where there is DNA comparison available, if it wasn’t done during their initial trial. > > Verify that you already have the right people in jail, then go after ones that you couldn’t get a conviction on the first time. Who is “they”? The police investigate and try and find a guilty party- I doubt they see it as their responsibility to ensure every one in prison is proven guilty a second time. ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/11 "2012-05-03T13:24:39Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > Is this a problem? Not for me-I am quite happy to see it. There are a number of things that are historically based I would like to see examined in the light of our current society. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/12 "2012-05-03T13:31:31Z")
> [@Xema](#): > > Shouldn’t this be “Hello” ? I was going to post the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/13 "2012-05-03T13:34:10Z")
> [@sachertorte](#): > > I was going to post the same thing. I see your point- maybe I should have said “Goodbye Double Jeopardy Rule” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![74westy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/74westy/32/3950_2.png) [@74westy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/74westy)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2012, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/14 "2012-05-04T22:05:32Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > Is this a problem? Damn Canadians. Actually, I argued in high school that Canada should have a double jeopardy rule like the US has because of the way [Henry Morgentaler](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Morgentaler#Judicial_battles) was tried and acquitted three times on the same charge. Despite Morgantaler’s tribulations, I no longer think that double jeopardy is a bad thing. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2012, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/15 "2012-05-05T10:32:47Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > Is this a problem? Um, yeah. It means that a corrupt court can now repeatedly retry you until it gets the results it wants. (Remember, they are the ones who decide if the evidence is compelling.) That’s the whole point of the law. It’s why we have a trial by jury–it’s a check on the government’s power. This is stuff you learn in junior high civics. > [@Cicero](#): > > Who is “they”? The police investigate and try and find a guilty party- I doubt they see it as their responsibility to ensure every one in prison is proven guilty a second time. What are they doing then going out and finding evidence that someone did something after the court system has said they aren’t guilty? Clearly they think it’s their responsibility to actually catch the guilty, regardless of what the court says. If they can’t trust the court to say who is innocent, why should they trust it to say who is guilty? ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2012, 10:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/16 "2012-05-05T10:41:15Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Um, yeah. It means that a corrupt court can now repeatedly retry you until it gets the results it wants. (Remember, they are the ones who decide if the evidence is compelling.) That’s the whole point of the law. It’s why we have a trial by jury–it’s a check on the government’s power. > > This is stuff you learn in junior high civics. > > What are they doing then going out and finding evidence that someone did something after the court system has said they aren’t guilty? Clearly they think it’s their responsibility to actually catch the guilty, regardless of what the court says. If they can’t trust the court to say who is innocent, why should they trust it to say who is guilty? The stuff you learn in junior high school would also teach you that a Court- corrupt or not- does not start prosecution proceedings. We do not have a trial by jury as a check on the governments power. Try reading the history of common law. As for your last paragraph, is it for real? If a person has been through the court system and been found not guilty, then the police actually have an unsolved case. That is why they go out and search for evidence after a not guilty verdict. There is also the possibility that they already have the evidence but at the time it was collected the technology did not exist to use it . ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2012, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/17 "2012-05-05T12:11:34Z")
> [@Cicero](#): > > Only if the price is right. And you can make a deal. ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2012, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/18 "2012-05-05T16:52:44Z")
> [@Xema](#): > > Shouldn’t this be “Hello” ? I don’t know why you say, “Goodbye.” I say, “Hello.” ---
**Author:** ![The\_Man\_With\_The\_Golden\_Gun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dc4da7/32.png) [@The\_Man\_With\_The\_Golden\_Gun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Man_With_The_Golden_Gun)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2012, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/19 "2012-05-05T16:59:21Z")
Judge: Sir, you are hereby charged with two counts of armed robbery and one count of murder. How do you plead? Defendant: Not guilty, your honor. Judge: I hereby sentence you to a year in prison for contempt of court. Defense lawyer: Objection, your honor! Judge: Let the record show that under our new law, all pleas in an Australia court of law must be given in the form of a question. Defense lawyer: Shuck it, Trebeck. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2012, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745/20 "2012-05-05T17:37:27Z")
A prohibition against double jeopardy is an important protection. There’s always going to be possible new evidence that the government can use so without a prohibition against double jeopardy, the government can target an individual and simply keep prosecuting him over and over again in the hope that it will eventually find a jury that convicts or at least keep the person going through the ordeal of trials for the rest of his life. The prohibition against double jeopardy sets a limit on this - it says the government gets one shot at you so it has to present its best evidence at the first and only trial. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/double-jeopardy-gone/620745.md?page=2)