# Down Goes Eric Cantor **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [June 11, 2014, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516 "2014-06-11T00:05:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 22
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/421 "2014-06-18T17:20:33Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > And when between now and 2100 would that start happening? Read the bit I linked: Sea-level rise has been happening continuously, and will continue to happen, and is accelerating. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/422 "2014-06-18T17:21:49Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Since climate change competes with issues like economic growth and jobs . . . But, that’s just it, it doesn’t, despite many RW and business-interest lies to the contrary. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/423 "2014-06-18T18:04:27Z")
It does. Raising energy prices reduces economic growth. This is well agreed upon when it’s not intentional, but somehow when it becomes part of the plan some people think it’s different. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/424 "2014-06-18T20:23:26Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Read the bit I linked: Sea-level rise has been happening continuously, and will continue to happen, and is accelerating. The impact will happen even before the storms, as property owners start to figure out that they will have to build expensive walls in order to reduce the chance of losing their property during quite normal storms. It is when once in a century storms become once in a decade - and I think we might be there already. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/425 "2014-06-18T20:26:31Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > It does. Raising energy prices reduces economic growth. This is well agreed upon when it’s not intentional, but somehow when it becomes part of the plan some people think it’s different. Natural disasters undo economic growth. Just thought I should point that out. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/426 "2014-06-18T20:27:09Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > It does. Raising energy prices reduces economic growth. This is well agreed upon when it’s not intentional, but somehow when it becomes part of the plan some people think it’s different. When nothing else changes. However if the expectation of rising energy prices causes the development and purchase of more energy efficient products, we get benefit from increased consumption as people swap out products more quickly, and the impact is reduced because of higher efficiency. My Prius reduces the impact of gas price rises, and if I had an electric car it would be reduced even more. Plus, decreased energy consumption tends to drive down prices, even as environmental regulations tend to drive them up. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/427 "2014-06-18T20:27:40Z")
ANd how much do you have to raise energy prices to actually reduce natural disasters? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/428 "2014-06-18T20:28:52Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > When nothing else changes. However if the expectation of rising energy prices causes the development and purchase of more energy efficient products, we get benefit from increased consumption as people swap out products more quickly, and the impact is reduced because of higher efficiency. My Prius reduces the impact of gas price rises, and if I had an electric car it would be reduced even more. > Plus, decreased energy consumption tends to drive down prices, even as environmental regulations tend to drive them up. This assumes wide adoption of energy efficient measures, like electric cars. I think electric cars are promising, but I’m not yet seeing enough of them on the road to convince me that we’re anywhere near reducing emissions from vehicles on the road. How high do you think gas prices will have to be to encourage wide adoption of electric cars, and will the voters stand for it? ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/429 "2014-06-19T06:15:40Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > If the doomsayers are right, and the general public is seeing the problem the same way they are seeing it, then yes, things will change very fast. > > But as long as it’s just something people read about in the news, it’s not going to resonate. The sense of purpose people get from Newsweek is nothing compared to the sense of purpose people get from the issues their family and friends experience personally. So until coasts have to be evacuated, I just don’t see the average voter prioritizing climate change. Well, I don’t think the coasts are the problem. It’s the persistent drought in America’s Heartland[sup]TM[/sup] that’s the economic killer. In the 1990’s, those of us in the central and western U.S. (I’m including myself in this) _did not take global warming seriously_ because it was presented as a coastal problem, and thus we thought it had nothing to do with us. Our present representatives in Washington are from that era. But rainfall failures over a generation are wrecking our agricultural base. We’re moving toward a 1980’s Ethiopia kind of drought, with the added wrinkle that much of the landscape in the Southwest\* is on fire.\* Now it’s the East Coast that isn’t taking global warming seriously. A few mutters when there’s a bad storm, but little else. And the media and power centers are there. And the old Midwest, between the Mississippi and the Appalachians, aren’t dying from it yet. But anti-environmentalism in Oklahoma, New Mexico, Texas, and Kansas is going to need some really strong disconnection from reality to overcome the experiences of actual ranchers and farmers. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/430 "2014-06-19T06:16:17Z")
All that needs to be done is to find a way that people like the Koch Bros., Exxon, and BP can continue making humongous amounts of money without getting us all killed. Maybe they can’t promote fossil fuels any more, but we give them a monopoly on tie-dye shirts and hand dipped candles. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 6:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/431 "2014-06-19T06:23:45Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > It does. Raising energy prices reduces economic growth. This is well agreed upon when it’s not intentional, but somehow when it becomes part of the plan some people think it’s different. Growth? Economic growth? You’re still pushing that nonsense? I expect most conservatives don’t even _believe_ in economic growth at this point. Sounds like techno-utopian nonsense. Is the planet going to sprout new continents for us to conquer? Surely the point of most political conservatism, as opposed to the fantastically optimistic capitalist Pollyannery they teach in “business school,” is to hang on like hell to the land and resources you’ve got in a zero-sum war against those outside your in-group. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 11:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/432 "2014-06-19T11:11:28Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > So there’s no possibility of an independent candidate on the ballot in Virginia? The only way to get on the ballot is by nomination from a major party? That’s not correct. Somebody, if they get enough signatures, can get on the ballot as an independent or as a member of a minor party. Eric Cantor just can’t, because of that “sore loser” law. So, he’d have to run a write in campaign (which would probably be doomed, because write in campaigns tend to be). ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/433 "2014-06-19T11:15:03Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Yes, the only way to get your name \*pre-printed \*on the ballot is via party nomination. That’s what all this legal and electoral foofaraw is about - getting your name pre-printed. That’s it. Party nomination is the only way to get party funding and organizational support too, obviously. That’s not true. To get on the Virginia ballot for the House of Representatives race, you either need to be a candidate of a major party, or get a petition with the signatures of 1000 qualified voters. From the law: > [@](#): > > he name of any candidate for any office, other than a party nominee, shall not be printed upon any official ballots provided for the election unless he shall file along with his declaration of candidacy a petition therefor, on a form prescribed by the State Board, signed by the number of qualified voters specified below after January 1 of the year in which the election is held and listing the residence address of each such voter. Each signature on the petition shall have been witnessed by a person who is himself a legal resident of the Commonwealth and who is not a minor or a felon whose voting rights have not been restored and whose affidavit to that effect appears on each page of the petition. . . . > > The minimum number of signatures of qualified voters required for candidate petitions shall be as follows: > > . . . > > 1. For a candidate for the United States House of Representatives, 1,000 signatures; ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/434 "2014-06-19T14:01:39Z")
That sounds more sensible - thanks for the information, **Captain Amazing**. I still find the “sore loser” law to be odd - it does give a political party control over access to the ballot. ---
**Author:** ![SmartAlecCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/67e7ee/32.png) [@SmartAlecCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmartAlecCat)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/435 "2014-06-19T14:09:54Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > I still find the “sore loser” law to be odd - it does give a political party control over access to the ballot. Yeah, I can’t imagine why the legislative representatives of the political parties allowed that to become law… ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/436 "2014-06-19T15:37:00Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Eventually there will be things that can’t be ignored. E.g., right now Texas has been in drought for years and there’s no sign of an end, there’s extreme weather all over the place, etc., etc. When it reaches a certain point, public opinion will flip so hard that the torches and pitchforks will come out. Did you watch the Vice episode about this recently? Texans aren’t ignoring what’s going on; they entirely acknowledge that there is an unprecedented drought. Apparently because god is mad at them and not because of anything having to do with climate change. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/437 "2014-06-19T15:40:46Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > ANd how much do you have to raise energy prices to actually reduce natural disasters? Probably not much, if you do it right. The idea of cap-and-trade, which people like you have decided is _eeeeeeeeviiiiiiil_, is to let the market figure out how to get the most GHG reduction for the least cost. If you use less market-based approaches, like restricting the CO2 emissions a power plant is allowed per kwh of electricity production, then it’ll be more expensive. But the cost of turning western Kansas into a desert is really quite spectacular. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/438 "2014-06-19T15:53:45Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > cap-and-trade, which people like you have decided is _eeeeeeeeviiiiiiil_ It was fine back when it was their own idea. Sound familiar? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/439 "2014-06-19T16:30:31Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > Did you watch the Vice episode about this recently? Texans aren’t ignoring what’s going on; they entirely acknowledge that there is an unprecedented drought. Apparently because god is mad at them and not because of anything having to do with climate change. Now why would God be mad at Texas, I wonder? ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516/440 "2014-06-19T16:51:46Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > This assumes wide adoption of energy efficient measures, like electric cars. I think electric cars are promising, but I’m not yet seeing enough of them on the road to convince me that we’re anywhere near reducing emissions from vehicles on the road. How high do you think gas prices will have to be to encourage wide adoption of electric cars, and will the voters stand for it? Where do you live? Because in the Bay Area we are up to our asses in them. Four people in our 20 person department have electric cars. The cost of a lease for a Leaf from Nissan is very reasonable, and you get a sticker that lets you in the carpool lane. 10 years ago hybrids were just starting and also got a sticker (not any more, alas) and now the Prius is the most common type of car I see. I think it is the best selling car in California, but don’t quote me on that. I have one, and the price premium is small or nil. The infrastructure is coming, as most big companies have charging stations. Most commutes are short enough to make electric cars practical. There are also tons of ads for solar panels, and the roofing companies are getting into the game in a big way. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516.md?page=21) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/down-goes-eric-cantor/690516.md?page=23)