I think the world needs a new food franchise; ‘Mrs Patmore’s Pies’
I don’t think Anna was out of the house long enough to get to London and back, so I don’t see how Bates could suspect her. I guess she could’ve paid someone else to do it, but she hardly seems like someone with the resources to hire an assassin or who would know where to hire one even if she had the money.
The worst pies in Downton,
Even that’s polite!
The worst pies in Downton,
If you doubt it, take a bite!
Two things I didn’t quite understand about why Mr. Bates’ buying the arsenic was so damning, and they’re things I may have just missed from the episode:
-Wasn’t arsenic a fairly common household item?
-In London, how/why would anybody remember a guy coming into a shop to buy arsenic? It’s not like he came in to buy a pistol or to request “the best mallet you have for bludgeoning a woman about so high” but something that was generally available in any drugstore.
Mrs. Bates was also a poorly drawn “and because I’m soooo evil I’m going to kill this bunny rabbit… slowly!” character. I didn’t understand why she was so eager to remain married when she already had his money. They hadn’t lived together in years, she knew he couldn’t stand her, and she didn’t really seem to care that much about him- how happy could their life together have been?
Wasn’t the point just that she was damned if she was going to release him to be happy with Anna? She clearly has the grudge of the century against Bates, and anything that makes his life frustrating and unsatisfying is a good idea in her book.
It would be interesting (but beyond my expectations) if the trial testimony subtly brings out just what it was she had such a grudge about. We know that Bates blames himself or at least has blamed himself in the past for ruining Vera’s life: why?
Perhaps just because of his war injury which left her apparently “tied for life to a pathetic cripple” (discrimination on grounds of physical disability was not as repudiated in Edwardian times as it has since become)? Perhaps his bout with alcoholism had a bad effect on her or led him to do bad things to her? Perhaps he just used to think she was nicer than she was and when she showed her true colors ('scuse me, “colours”) he thought he’d somehow changed her for the worse?
I’d like to know but I kind of doubt Fellowes will tell us.
I think she wanted a meal ticket, and Bates would be expected to support her. She’d have a house, and money for as long as he could work, and would continue to do what she pleased without regard for his feelings. She doesn’t seem the type to ever be happy with someone, but she wanted the social standing and income of a married couple.
And he’d be hers to continue tormenting because she liked to do it, and now had the added pleasure of taunting him about Anna. She was jealous of Anna, seeing Bates truly caring for someone (even though he took the fall for her thievery). She could see Anna truly loved him and wanted to make him happy - something Vera couldn’t/wouldn’t do. She didn’t want him to be happy.
We know from the first season, that he had been an alcoholic and when in his cups had been very cruel to Vera. That is why he covers for her when she steals the regimental silver. Not sure, though, why she stole the silver. Maybe he wasn’t providing for her because he was drinking so much?
And didn’t she go on to say something like “If you can keep me upright, we can avoid it” or something like that? I.e., so she wouldn’t bruise her butt if she fell or something like that.
That’s how I interpreted the exchange.
I’m reasonably certain that mentioning Dame Maggie Smith’s bottom is a sin, if it isn’t an actual crime. Like Kim Jong Il, she has never had a bowel movement, and furthermore any children she has borne were conceived through song and emerged astrally through her exhalation.
Would a real-life Cora had said to Robert about Sibyl, “She’s pregnant” right out like that? Wouldn’t she have used a euphemism or some kind?
That kind of squeamishness is very middle class. Cora isn’t a social climber like Hyacinth Bucket.
Remember back in the very first episode when Mary chided her patents for sharing a bedroom? There was a reason that upper class couples slept apart – because they, both husbands and wives, were often entertaining paramours. This class of people was not dedicated to sexual fidelity.
[QUOTE=Bridget Burke]
Nobody at Downton Abbey is that hip about American dances…
[/QUOTE]
But wasn’t it Thomas who brought it up? And didn’t he have contacts with the black market? So couldn’t he have got hold of some music before it was officially released? See, it’s so obvious if you apply logic. 
[QUOTE=Simplicio]
I’m hoping now that everyones “will they, won’t they” romantic plots seemed to have resolved, part of the focus of next season will be “who killed Vera Bates” and we can see our heroes investigate the murder/suicide.
[/QUOTE]
CSI: Downton!!!
[QUOTE=Toucanna]
…Why didn’t [Lord G] use the old ploy of saying, “I don’t remember, as I didn’t pay much attention to it” or, “I can’t recall his exact words”?..
[/QUOTE]
I watched the episode again, and dammit, he did say, “I don’t recall”, and then proceeded to give a verbatim account of the conversation. Double argh!
[QUOTE=Toucanna]
…I got the feeling [the Dowager Countess] didn’t know what [Thomas] was talking about and misinterpreted his remark…
[/QUOTE]
SCENE: The Great Hall at Downton Abbey. The Dowager Countess and Lady Mary are in conversation.
The Dowager Countess: I gather Anna isn’t going to America.
Lady Mary: No. But of course, I’m glad for her.
(Lady Mary sees Thomas approach)
Lady Mary, to The Dowager Countess: Uh, oh. Here he comes, to claim his prize.
Thomas, to The Dowager Countess: Your Ladyship, may I have the honor of this dance?
The Dowager Countess: Well, yes, as it is a waltz. I’m far too old for that awful foxtrot.
Thomas: What about “Black Bottom”?
The Dowager Countess: Just…just keep me upright and we’ll try to avoid it.
[QUOTE=MsJinx]
…what accommodations were there for [Bates and Anna], after their one-night honeymoon in the luxury suite?..
[/QUOTE]
Lord Grantham had offered Bates and Anna a cottage on the estate after the married. This was a typical offer made when the lord/lady of the manor wanted to keep two employees on their staff.
[QUOTE=Sampiro]
Two things I didn’t quite understand about why Mr. Bates’ buying the arsenic was so damning…
[/QUOTE]
I had thought arsenic was an unlikely poisoner’s choice for a quick kill, because it was a slow killer. Turns out I was wrong. Arsenic is odorless and colorless; some compounds have a slight odor of garlic. It takes only ~75 mg (~2.6 ounces) to kill an adult human weighing 75 kg (165 pounds). More info at: Wikipedia - Arsenic and Centre for Ecological Sciences, Indian Institute of Science - Arsenic.
It might not have been *quite *so damning, if Bates had not also bought a gun. a noose, a hatchet, a catapult, and an Acme Explodo-Time Bomb as well.
When Robert learned that Hepworth was penniless he said he had no problem with Rosamund marrying him so long as (Robert) first made sure her money was tied up. Earlier it had been made clear the money was left to her by her late husband. While it was a genuine concern, and also not a bad idea (because Hepworth would likely have spent her into the poor house), would Robert as head of the family have any control over tying up her money if his sister did not legally gave him control of her estate?
Perhaps Rosamund could romance Lady Edith’s former suitor (whose name eludes me- 60-ish man with the bad arm). He seems a nice sort, isn’t a golddigger, and while he felt, probably rightly, that he’s too old and infirm for Edith, Rosamund’s a generation older.
Speaking of, when Major Bryant’s parents visited I initially thought his father was played by the actor who plays Onslow. He wasn’t though. (Does that cast get around very much on other shows?)
[QUOTE=Toucanna]
I had thought arsenic was an unlikely poisoner’s choice for a quick kill, because it was a slow killer. Turns out I was wrong. Arsenic is odorless and colorless; some compounds have a slight odor of garlic. It takes only ~75 mg (~2.6 ounces) to kill an adult human weighing 75 kg (165 pounds). More info at: Wikipedia - Arsenic and Centre for Ecological Sciences, Indian Institute of Science - Arsenic.
[/QUOTE]
My understanding is the reason it’s a bad poisoner’s choice is that even in 1919- even in ancient times for that matter- it’s very obvious. The death doesn’t look natural at all- there are lots of tell tale signs.
The following was gleaned from a murder mystery called Strong Poison written by Dorthy L Sayers in 1930:
In England, when you bought poison you had to sign a register (a big book like the ones in old-fashioned hotel lobbies). It might not have been difficult to use another name, but if Bates wasn’t planning on killing Vera he wouldn’t have bothered.
Arsenic was commonly used to kill rats.
Arsenic poisoning can also look like various digestive problems, so unless you were looking for it, it wasn’t totally obvious.
That is very helpful. Thanks.
It also explains why it really was stupid of Bates not to volunteer “I bought arsenic” to the PoPo.
And had Wile E Coyote in his employ.
Ahh, this is fun, a video tribute to Maggie Smith…
Anthony Strallan