# Downton Abbey S3 - spoiler-free until broadcast in the U.S. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 2, 2013, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791 "2013-01-02T01:45:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 36
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/701 "2013-02-07T21:01:48Z")
Of course a lot of the “grunt servants” will be unemployed by the advent of/advances in dishwashers, lawn mowers, vacuum cleaners, washers/dryers, and other labor savers that allow 2 servants to do what used to be a 5 person job. The ones unemployed could probably match the money anywhere since they were probably already near whatever ‘minimum wage’ was for 1920, but they’d lose fringe benefits like free meals and possibly living quarters (which would probably have been a cot somewhere, but still, it’s a cot you didn’t have to pay cash for). ---
**Author:** ![StGermain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stgermain/32/2868_2.png) [@StGermain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StGermain)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/702 "2013-02-07T22:19:49Z")
[Here’s a interesting article](http://www2.ljworld.com/news/2005/jul/24/backstairs_biltmore_house/) about the servants and servant quarters at the Biltmore. Biltmore had 40 servants. The head housekeeper made double the butler and made $300/mo. Servants each had their own rooms and the house had indoor plumbing and baths for the servants. The article references a book called “Millionaire Households and Their Domestic Economy, with Hints Upon Fine Living” StG ---
**Author:** ![kath94](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/67e7ee/32.png) [@kath94](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kath94)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/703 "2013-02-08T01:52:02Z")
> [@well\_he\_s\_back](#): > > Kath94 said “I was just thinking about this. Call the Midwife is based on a nonfiction book. Downton Abbey is based on whatever Julian Fellowes can pull out of his ass.” - > but the Upstairs Downstairs series was original to TV also. You don’t have to be based on a book to be well-plotted. Upstairs Downstairs had good writers. Agreed, but U/D didn’t have extended plotlines that just fizzled out. Most episodes were complete. And anyway, U/D is a **classic**!🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/704 "2013-02-08T01:55:33Z")
> [@Ellen\_Cherry](#): > > What are the duties of a butler?.. He did it. ---
**Author:** ![StGermain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stgermain/32/2868_2.png) [@StGermain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StGermain)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/705 "2013-02-08T02:58:05Z")
The book I referenced above [(Millionaire Households)](http://books.google.com/books?vid=HARVARD:RSLHA5&printsec=titlepage#v=onepage&q&f=false) is available online from the Harvard Open Collections Program. StG ---
**Author:** ![well\_he\_s\_back](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/3ab097/32.png) [@well\_he\_s\_back](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/well_he_s_back)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/706 "2013-02-08T04:08:54Z")
Kath94 - I think we’re both on the same page; my explanation just fizzled out. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/707 "2013-02-08T04:45:16Z")
> [@StGermain](#): > > [Here’s a interesting article](http://www2.ljworld.com/news/2005/jul/24/backstairs_biltmore_house/) about the servants and servant quarters at the Biltmore. > > Biltmore had 40 servants. The head housekeeper made double the butler and made $300/mo. Servants each had their own rooms and the house had indoor plumbing and baths for the servants. I’ve been to Biltmore a couple of times and remember thinking that even for the lower servants the quarters were nice. They looked a bit like hospital rooms, but they were probably nicer than most of the servants from Appalachia had ever lived in, and $300 per month was more than most doctors made. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 7:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/708 "2013-02-08T07:31:22Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > Of course a lot of the “grunt servants” will be unemployed by the advent of/advances in dishwashers, lawn mowers, vacuum cleaners, washers/dryers, and other labor savers that allow 2 servants to do what used to be a 5 person job. The ones unemployed could probably match the money anywhere since they were probably already near whatever ‘minimum wage’ was for 1920, but they’d lose fringe benefits like free meals and possibly living quarters (which would probably have been a cot somewhere, but still, it’s a cot you didn’t have to pay cash for). I’ve done fair amount of research on the period before & after the Great War–mostly in Britain. Mostly inspired by _Parade’s End_–the excellent novels & the upcoming (also excellent) HBO series. Social change had been afoot in the years before the War; it wasn’t a matter of everything being peachy for the benevolent aristos & their faithful retainers until The War Changed Everything. Labor was getting stronger; factory jobs were somewhat less dangerous & exhausting. Public education improved people’s expectations. But the War did accelerate change. For one thing, women took jobs that only men had done previously; that was one reason they were finally granted the vote. Afterwards, the men reclaimed most of their jobs–but women who wanted to work knew they had more options. In the 20’s, labor saving devices were adopted _because_ fewer people wanted to enter service, not so servants could be fired. Some of the old great houses were finally plumbed because emptying the chamber pots of one’s betters or hauling giant pots of hot water upstairs seemed less attractive careers. Downton seems to have plumbing, although we haven’t seen details–but it’s Victorian, not truly ancient. And Robert spoke scornfully of Mary’s nouveau riche fiance’s plans to remodel a neighboring pile–with one bathroom per bedroom! In one book, an old lady reminisced that the Edwardians had not been all that clean…and she was talking about the Quality. ---
**Author:** ![FeAudrey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7feea3/32.png) [@FeAudrey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FeAudrey)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/709 "2013-02-09T01:40:09Z")
From the London _Telegraph_: obituary of a woman who was in service in an assortment of aristocratic houses in the '20s and '30s: > **[Florence Wadlow](https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/obituaries/9858641/Florence-Wadlow.html)** > > Florence Wadlow, who has died aged 100, was one of the last survivors of the pre-war generation which served “below stairs” in the great houses of England. She left service for marriage and children, also doing some custom dressmaking and becoming involved in community activities. In more recent years, she wrote a memoir of downstairs life and was involved in several broadcast documentaries before dying at age 100. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/710 "2013-02-09T05:18:24Z")
Very interesting - thanks! From that article: _During the Abdication crisis of 1936 the Prime Minister, Stanley Baldwin, came to stay for three weeks with his wife. When they left, Mrs Baldwin gave Flo £1, and another £1 to be shared out between the kitchen maid and scullery maid._ I assume that made Mrs. Baldwin a skinflint, even given the stronger pound of the day? ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/711 "2013-02-09T06:22:09Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Very interesting - thanks! From that article: > > _During the Abdication crisis of 1936 the Prime Minister, Stanley Baldwin, came to stay for three weeks with his wife. When they left, Mrs Baldwin gave Flo £1, and another £1 to be shared out between the kitchen maid and scullery maid._ > > I assume that made Mrs. Baldwin a skinflint, even given the stronger pound of the day? That equals £90 for Flo, and £30 for the scullery maid in today’s money. I’d say that’s a reasonable tip. Remember that’s one top of their normal wages, and 2 houseguests really wouldn’t generated that much extra work for them. And they’re 2 of the most junior servants in the house, and most likely never interacted with the Baldwins. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/712 "2013-02-10T15:24:23Z")
I looked at the schedule, and it appears in the US we will have a two-hour season finale tonight. Then, from what others have said, there will be a one-hour Christmas episode next week–is that right? ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/713 "2013-02-10T15:38:48Z")
I think the Christmas episode will last about 90 minutes. But tonight & next Sunday will be the last of _Downton_ in the US until the next series… ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/714 "2013-02-10T16:13:56Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > I think the Christmas episode will last about 90 minutes. But tonight & next Sunday will be the last of _Downton_ in the US until the next series… Tonight’s episode is two hours (according to my DirecTV schedule). And next Sunday is the 90-minute Christmas show? Is that right? ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/715 "2013-02-10T16:45:45Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Tonight’s episode is two hours (according to my DirecTV schedule). And next Sunday is the 90-minute Christmas show? Is that right? Yes. Tonight’s two-hour episode was shown as two episodes over two weeks in the UK. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/716 "2013-02-10T17:28:39Z")
I do remember the guests tipping the butler and the servants in _Gosford Park_. I wonder if that was a perk or a significant part of their income. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/717 "2013-02-11T01:50:36Z")
Several of the DA cast discuss funny encounters with fans: [http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/masterpiece/watch-online/shorts/downton-abbey-fan-encounters/](http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/masterpiece/watch-online/shorts/downton-abbey-fan-encounters/) ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/718 "2013-02-11T04:05:38Z")
Well, there was a two-hour episode tonight, but next week is the season finale. Then there’s a “Christmas episode” after that? Or is that the Christmas episode? They do cover a lot of ground in these! ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/719 "2013-02-11T04:10:23Z")
PBS is calling next Sunday’s show the Season Finale because it’s the end of the “Season” on PBS. I think what we just saw were the last two shows of the Series, as they say over there. Next week we’ll see the 90 minute episode shown in the UK on Christmas–and the last for everybody until the next Season/Series… ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/720 "2013-02-11T04:28:16Z")
I was astonished that Thomas managed to come out on top yet again. He was facing dismissal without a reference and quite possibly prison time and now he’s been promoted to underbutler! I was also surprised that he knew about O’Brien and “her ladyship’s soap”. Season one was so long ago I may have forgotten, but I don’t remember O’Brien telling him about that and it seems unlikely that she would have. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791.md?page=35) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791.md?page=37)