# Downton Abbey S3 - spoiler-free until broadcast in the U.S. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 2, 2013, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791 "2013-01-02T01:45:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 41
**Author:** ![Carousel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@Carousel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carousel)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/801 "2013-02-12T18:29:41Z")
> [@LavenderBlue](#): > > I didn’t the buy the gay storyline at all. They were far too easy on Thomas. The only way I could even remotely see it is just because they knew Thomas and didn’t want to get him into trouble. That I can understand. Most people are probably reluctant to get people they know in trouble unless there’s a real serious crime involved. > > But some real sweetness in this episode. I loved Tom asking Mary to be a godmother. I am surprised it was allowed. My sil is Catholic. She was specifically told I couldn’t be a godmother to one of her kids as I am Jewish. My husband was allowed by the priest because his father is Catholic even though he’s an atheist and was raised as a Methodist. Mary’s clearly a firmly committed Anglican. > > Poor Mosely. He continues to be a sorry little puppy of a person. > > I loved the Dowager Countess in this episode. She was deliciously knowing and devious with regards to Rose. Am I correct in presuming that she tried to push Ethel out of Isobel’s house in part so she could be nearer to Charlie? The SL is very perplexing. Poor Mr. Carson nearly keeled over listening to the details of what happened between Thomas and James, while OTOH, Robert in talking to Bates acts like “what’s the big deal”. Don’t know why Jimmy is letting Obrien force him into pressing charges - he should just be glad that Thomas will be gone. I’m still waiting for the Grantham’s to learn of O’Brien’s part in the miscarriage of their son – want to see her dealt with swiftly. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/802 "2013-02-12T18:33:36Z")
> [@Carousel](#): > > Don’t know why Jimmy is letting Obrien force him into pressing charges - he should just be glad that Thomas will be gone. He was until O’Brien convinced him that if he didn’t try to press charges, everyone would think that he was in on it. ---
**Author:** ![gwendee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/35a633/32.png) [@gwendee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gwendee)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/803 "2013-02-12T18:48:32Z")
> [@Carousel](#): > > The SL is very perplexing. Poor Mr. Carson nearly keeled over listening to the details of what happened between Thomas and James, while OTOH, Robert in talking to Bates acts like “what’s the big deal”. Could that have to do with them having fought in the war and that made them more worldly? ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/804 "2013-02-12T19:23:41Z")
> [@Misnomer](#): > > …Not wanting to repeat a mistake is one thing. She could have resigned via letter or telephone, and simply stated that she’d changed her mind. Or, she could have been less haughty in person. Instead, she went to a great deal of trouble to get on a soapbox. Acting as though you are above the mere suggestion of impropriety – when your prior actions prove otherwise – is practically the definition of “hypocrite” (“[_a person who puts on a false appearance of virtue_](http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/hypocrite)”). Mrs Bird is gone but I’m glad we still have moral guardians among us! ---
**Author:** ![SpoilerVirgin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4491bb/32.png) [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/805 "2013-02-12T19:26:37Z")
> [@AuntiePam](#): > > Wiki says IUD’s were available at that time. I think she got one, and had it removed when she was finally sure she wanted a baby. Thanks – I love this. I have been convinced for most of this season that Mary was secretly using birth control, but couldn’t figure out how that fit into the “minor operation” scene. Your explanation fits both my theory and the storyline. ---
**Author:** ![StGermain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stgermain/32/2868_2.png) [@StGermain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StGermain)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/806 "2013-02-12T19:43:20Z")
I think the difference between the outrage with Edith and the lack thereof with Thomas is that Edith’s “shame” was public. People knew she’d had a bastard and prostituted herself. For members of the household to consort with her would have them tarnished by her shame. Thomas’s peccadillo, OTOH, was private, and as long as Jimmy didn’t make it public it wouldn’t harm the reputation of anyone at the big house. Robert may not have cared so much as long as it remained below stairs. As was mentioned, being a public school boy and a military man might have made him feel like what those in power do to their subordinates is legitimized. StG ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/807 "2013-02-12T20:10:07Z")
> [@StGermain](#): > > I think the difference between the outrage with Edith and the lack thereof with Thomas is that Edith’s “shame” was public. People knew she’d had a bastard and prostituted herself. For members of the household to consort with her would have them tarnished by her shame. Thomas’s peccadillo, OTOH, was private, and as long as Jimmy didn’t make it public it wouldn’t harm the reputation of anyone at the big house. > > Robert may not have cared so much as long as it remained below stairs. As was mentioned, being a public school boy and a military man might have made him feel like what those in power do to their subordinates is legitimized. > > StG Ethel. If Edith became a prostitute and had a bastard, now \*that \*would be a scandal. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/808 "2013-02-12T20:14:27Z")
Carson is always about the reputation of Downton. He told Anna it was better if she left when Bates was convicted because it might reflect badly on the house if she stayed. He was equally aghast at both Ethel and Thomas. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/809 "2013-02-12T20:19:33Z")
I predict that we will eventually find out that Alfred is really O’Brien’s son. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/810 "2013-02-12T20:23:14Z")
> [@TruCelt](#): > > I predict that we will eventually find out that Alfred is really O’Brien’s son. She tearfully reveals: “When I learnt I was pregnant, I tried gettin’ rid of it… I left the soap out on the bathroom fllor I don’t know how many times but never could bring me self to trip on it!” ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/811 "2013-02-12T20:50:47Z")
> [@SanVito](#): > > …Aristocrats certainly ‘would’ have put someone who actually worked in a profession as below them. Aristocrats played at politics, the military and managing their estates, and that’s about it. Which is why Cousin Shrimpie can both have “a job” and be higher up on the social scale than Robert. And as it’s been pointed out; it would’ve have been a big deal if Matthew was a barrister as opposed to a solicitor since the Bar led to the judiciary & politics. Back in season one Edith even mentioned that their cousin was studing for the Bar. ---
**Author:** ![Misnomer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/misnomer/32/14897_2.png) [@Misnomer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Misnomer)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/812 "2013-02-12T22:01:44Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > Mrs Bird is gone but I’m glad we still have moral guardians among us! Wait…what? 😕 Edith’s behavior struck me as hypocritical. You seemed unsure of the definition of the word – and thought I was somehow criticizing her reluctance to get involved with a married man for a second time – so I clarified. How does that make me a “moral guardian”? ---
**Author:** ![Palo\_Verde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/65b543/32.png) [@Palo\_Verde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palo_Verde)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/813 "2013-02-13T18:57:01Z")
About Mary’s minor surgery. My sister had scar tissue on her cervix and she had a very small procedure to make it possible for her to conceive. Basically they have to stretch the cervix in order to make the scar tissue more flexible. I assumed that Mary caught some STD from the Turkish Gentleman and this caused some internal scarring, which would have been easy to fix in the 1920s. Oh, and by the way, I like seeing the hallboys and some of the minor underservants. There must have been a lot more servants than we normally see. And where did they get cricket uniforms that just happened to fit everyone perfectly? All the male servants from Mr. Carson to tall Alfred had perfect cream colored uniforms. How? ---
**Author:** ![Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a9a28c/32.png) [@Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oslo_Ostragoth)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/814 "2013-02-13T19:36:24Z")
> [@Palo\_Verde](#): > > And where did they get cricket uniforms that just happened to fit everyone perfectly? All the male servants from Mr. Carson to tall Alfred had perfect cream colored uniforms. How? Barrow’s Rent-a-Uniform. ---
**Author:** ![araminty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b5e925/32.png) [@araminty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/araminty)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/815 "2013-02-13T19:46:12Z")
I believe Mr. Pamuk told Mary in no uncertain terms that she would still be a virgin when they were through. I assumed some kind of non-penetrative shenanigans went on, so all this talk of STDs is leaving me slightly baffled. Plus, didn’t he die before much could have occurred? (Yes, I know you can acquire an STI through other forms of sexual contact, but still…) ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/816 "2013-02-13T20:16:20Z")
> [@Palo\_Verde](#): > > About Mary’s minor surgery. My sister had scar tissue on her cervix and she had a very small procedure to make it possible for her to conceive. Basically they have to stretch the cervix in order to make the scar tissue more flexible. I assumed that Mary caught some STD from the Turkish Gentleman and this caused some internal scarring, which would have been easy to fix in the 1920s… The internal scarring could have been fixed but no STD could have been _cured_ in the days before antibiotics. Lord Fellowes just needed a dramatic device to keep Mary & Matthew apart. And to cause suspense, although it really was early for them to worry about sterility and/or barrenness. Lazy writing. Nothing new with this show! Just enjoy the good bits & hope he rewards his loyal cast with better writing this time… ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/817 "2013-02-13T20:33:56Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > Lord Fellowes just needed a dramatic device to keep Mary & Matthew apart. And to cause suspense, although it really was early for them to worry about sterility and/or barrenness. > > Lazy writing. Nothing new with this show! Just enjoy the good bits & hope he rewards his loyal cast with better writing this time… Exactly. It’s just some mystery condition and the writers didn’t have anything specific in mind. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/818 "2013-02-13T20:59:18Z")
> [@araminty](#): > > I believe Mr. Pamuk told Mary in no uncertain terms that she would still be a virgin when they were through. I assumed some kind of non-penetrative shenanigans went on, so all this talk of STDs is leaving me slightly baffled. Plus, didn’t he die before much could have occurred? > > (Yes, I know you can acquire an STI through other forms of sexual contact, but still…) I think he said something like “You can still tell your husband you are a virgin.” which led to Mary’s flustered joke about “him proposing.” I took it that Mr. Pamuk was telling her she could lie about the encounter, not that he wasn’t going in. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/819 "2013-02-13T21:34:13Z")
> [@Palo\_Verde](#): > > …And where did they get cricket uniforms that just happened to fit everyone perfectly? All the male servants from Mr. Carson to tall Alfred had perfect cream colored uniforms. How? Given how seriously Grantham takes the annual cricket game I can see him ensuring that his team had proper fitted uniforms, unlike the village boys. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791/820 "2013-02-13T21:37:30Z")
> [@araminty](#): > > I believe Mr. Pamuk told Mary in no uncertain terms that she would still be a virgin when they were through. I assumed some kind of non-penetrative shenanigans went on, so all this talk of STDs is leaving me slightly baffled. Plus, didn’t he die before much could have occurred? > > (Yes, I know you can acquire an STI through other forms of sexual contact, but still…) That scene was originally written with a line about how Mary could hide a phial of blood under her pillow so she could still seem a virgin for her husband, but it was cut before filming. Fellowes hadn’t realized at the time how the scene, as it plays now, would be misconstrued by a large percentage of the audience who thought Pamuk’s line about remaining a virgin meant they would do something other than PIV sex. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791.md?page=40) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-s3-spoiler-free-until-broadcast-in-the-u-s/645791.md?page=42)