# Downton Abbey-Series 4 has started in the UK \[SPOILERS for those waiting to view on PBS\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 24, 2013, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574 "2013-09-24T12:24:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2013, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/21 "2013-10-01T22:37:03Z")
> [@toast\_pakora](#): > > …You are right, of course. That means Anna is also in this category and yet she seems to defer to Carson quite a bit. And wouldn’t the same be true re: valets? Seems like there is quite a crowd of servants who are not under the purview of Carson or Mrs Hughes. Since Matthew died Bates has been the only valet at Downton; all of the other male staff answer to Carson. Except for Anna & Edna the female staff are under Mrs Hughes purview, except for the kitchen staff who answer to Mrs Patmore. The Butler was the nominal head of the staff, but in practice they formed a triumvirate with the Housekeeper & Cook. Oddly in some of the very, very, grandest of households (ie families with _multiple_ Downtons) the (Head) Housekeeper was _the_ head of staff and even the Butler & Cook reported to the Mistress through her. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2013, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/22 "2013-10-03T18:43:15Z")
> [@toast\_pakora](#): > > oh right. Wasn’t it about this time that the law was changed? Law of Property Act 1925, Section 131. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2013, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/23 "2013-10-07T00:38:12Z")
:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad: Fuck you Julian Fellowes, that was **not OK**! ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2013, 6:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/24 "2013-10-07T06:26:41Z")
> [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](#): > > :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad: > > Fuck you Julian Fellowes, that was **not OK**! I agree. Also, does Edna have something against Anna for some reason? I am not remembering them having any interaction when Edna worked there before., ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2013, 8:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/25 "2013-10-07T08:10:17Z")
> [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](#): > > :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad: > > Fuck you Julian Fellowes, that was **not OK**! Agreed. Found that very hard to stomach. ---
**Author:** ![toast\_pakora](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3ec8ea/32.png) [@toast\_pakora](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/toast_pakora)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2013, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/26 "2013-10-07T14:00:49Z")
And you know that she’ll get pregnant from this. What is Edna’s end game here? I think she thinks she might marry Branson which the family would never allow. Cue endless hand wringing until Branson grows a spine and tells her to faff off. And then she’ll claim that she is pregnant. Dame Kiri was unrecognizable under that awful wig. The best part was Mr Mosley putting on the white gloves. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2013, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/27 "2013-10-07T15:24:09Z")
> [@toast\_pakora](#): > > And you know that she’ll get pregnant from this. Oh God if they go down that route… :mad::mad::mad: Did anyone catch when this episode was supposed to be set, so if Anna does announce she’s pregnant some time in the future, we can tell if it’s Bates’ or… Fellowes just likes to destroy any happiness that is on this show, doesn’t he? Especially between Anna & Bates. Matthew & Sybil’s deaths were horrible, but they had to happen because the actors wanted out. Having \*Anna \*be raped (!!!) is just on another level of nastiness entirely, because it only happened to add drama for drama’s sake! There were plenty of other storylines Fellowes could have written for Anna & Bates if he really felt he must screw with them some more. I want to see Bates grab Green and bash his teeth in. ---
**Author:** ![toast\_pakora](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3ec8ea/32.png) [@toast\_pakora](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/toast_pakora)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2013, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/28 "2013-10-07T16:14:59Z")
I was really enjoying the underplaying of Anna & Bates’ relationship (the valentines). But now we’re in for some Noble Suffering & Misunderstanding followed by Martyrdom. Again. Theoretically, Mrs Hughes would tell Cora who would tell Robert who would tell the rapist’s employer who would probably not do anything about it. ---
**Author:** ![toast\_pakora](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3ec8ea/32.png) [@toast\_pakora](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/toast_pakora)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2013, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/29 "2013-10-07T17:19:43Z")
Wait, was the valet employed by the guy who went riding with Lady Mary? Jeez, lay it on a bit thicker next time, Fellowes. ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2013, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/30 "2013-10-07T17:35:53Z")
> [@toast\_pakora](#): > > I was really enjoying the underplaying of Anna & Bates’ relationship (the valentines). But now we’re in for some Noble Suffering & Misunderstanding followed by Martyrdom. Again. > > Theoretically, Mrs Hughes would tell Cora who would tell Robert who would tell the rapist’s employer who would probably not do anything about it. Considering that Mrs Hughes is always poking her nose into other people’s business, I am pretty sure she won’t stay silent for long. ---
**Author:** ![Dublin11](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Dublin11](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dublin11)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2013, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/31 "2013-10-07T21:54:26Z")
Joanne Froggatt was fantastic in those scenes. When she was hysterical in Mrs Hughes’ room I was blubbering along with her. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2013, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/32 "2013-10-07T23:40:34Z")
> [@toast\_pakora](#): > > Wait, was the valet employed by the guy who went riding with Lady Mary? > > Jeez, lay it on a bit thicker next time, Fellowes. Yep, that’s why he was called “Mr Gillingham” downstairs (visiting servants were called by their employer’s name). Of course he’ll be back. I knew Lord Fellowes did something to piss people off before watching this episode, so naturally I was expecting Mrs Patmore to drop dead as soon as she started having pains. :smack: Did not see the rape coming (though if she had died it’d be interesting to see how they handled the rest of the dinner). I feel bad for Tom, but enough with the whining. Anyone else find it odd that the Granthams seem to reluctantly accepting Michael Gregson as a potential match for Edith; obviously they don’t know he’s married. Edith discovered that with one phone call and one would think Robert have one of his people look into his background. Does Gregson remind anyone else a lot of Sir Anthony Stallan? ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/33 "2013-10-08T17:25:24Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > … Anyone else find it odd that the Granthams seem to reluctantly accepting Michael Gregson as a potential match for Edith; obviously they don’t know he’s married. Edith discovered that with one phone call and one would think Robert have one of his people look into his background. Does Gregson remind anyone else a lot of Sir Anthony Stallan? I could have sworn I posted this last night. I was thinking the same thing, that Gregson looks like a slightly younger version of Strallan. She definitely has a type. ---
**Author:** ![toast\_pakora](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3ec8ea/32.png) [@toast\_pakora](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/toast_pakora)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/34 "2013-10-08T22:13:39Z")
> [@](#): > > Yep, that’s why he was called “Mr Gillingham” downstairs Yes, I saw saw Gosford Park too. My question was, since I wasn’t paying close attention, I didn’t know the name of the fellow she went riding with. But since he’s shown interest in her, he’ll be back and that will folded into the Anna drama. Mary will learn about the rape and demand that Gillingham fire the valet \> he won’t \>end of relationship. The inevitable Anna pregnancy is what I’m dreading… much gnashing of teeth and wringing of hands and a birth in time for the Christmas Special. Gregson _is_ very similar to Strallen. It would be funny if Mary pointed that out to her. ---
**Author:** ![TashaKitty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/d26b3c/32.png) [@TashaKitty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TashaKitty)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2013, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/35 "2013-10-09T17:37:01Z")
What’s to stop Greene from going after Anna AGAIN or going after somebody else? Anna NEEDS to tell somebody what happened, if not for her own sake then for someone else’s. Suppose he went after Daisy? Then “Claire” would shit a brick! On a serious note though, Daisy or Ivy would be easy targets for him. But seriously, if Anna simply told somebody in a position of authority (Mary is by far the most logical choice, seeing as how Anna has been her confidant and friend for over ten years at this point) they could get Greene out of the house and into custody before Bates had the opportunity to make a huge mistake and wind up back on death row. I’m confident that Mary, Cora, Robert, Edith, Violet, Tom, Isobel, Isis…EVERYBODY would have her back and protect her from stigma. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2013, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/36 "2013-10-09T18:50:29Z")
Yeah, Anna screwed herself by swearing Mrs Hughes to secrecy. Reporting him immediately with the backing of the entire household (upstairs & down) is pretty much her one & only chance at getting the authorities on her side. Rape victims (both on screen & IRL) often sabotage their own cases by keeping silent or waiting to long to report it. ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2013, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/37 "2013-10-09T19:13:43Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > Yeah, Anna screwed herself by swearing Mrs Hughes to secrecy. Reporting him immediately with the backing of the entire household (upstairs & down) is pretty much her one & only chance at getting the authorities on her side. Rape victims (both on screen & IRL) often sabotage their own cases by keeping silent or waiting to long to report it. Yes, but this is at least a realistic portrayal. It still happens in this day and age. Even though she said her concern was that Bates would kill the guy, she was probably also ashamed and afraid she would be blamed. She was nice to the guy and may have felt that she would be accused of leading him on. I don’t think you can expect someone to think logically in that situation. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2013, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/38 "2013-10-12T19:26:03Z")
I will be politically incorrect and say that I liked the twist (and please no pregnancy). It was executed brilliantly by the actors and it was something which was common then (and not exactly unknown now). If they do this well, they will have the chance to show a more realistic portrayal of how rape victims deal with the trauma.Confusion, anger, shock, guilt, lashing out. The feeling dirty and the fact that several victims wonder if they were not someway to blame, WTH is with Tom? ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2013, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/39 "2013-10-14T21:53:28Z")
> [@toast\_pakora](#): > > …The inevitable Anna pregnancy is what I’m dreading… much gnashing of teeth and wringing of hands and a birth in time for the Christmas Special… Well at least Braithwaite isn’t pregnant. I loved how Mrs Hughes handled that (& how obvious it was that this isn’t the 1st time she’s dealt with a situation like this). On the other hand Lady Rosamund’s little comment suggests a pregnancy scare for Lady Edith. :eek: I really they took some kind of precaution. As for Anna; is she even aware how much she’s making it look like _Bates_ abused her because that’s certainly what people are going to start thinking. BTW does Michael Gregson have to give up his British citizenship to acquire German citizenship? IIRC at that time British women who married foreigners automatically lost their British citizenship, which could make things quite awkward for the Gregsons in about 10 yrs time. Also was anyone else a little surprised that the writers sent Michael to _Munich_ instead of say Berlin? ---
**Author:** ![toast\_pakora](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3ec8ea/32.png) [@toast\_pakora](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/toast_pakora)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574/40 "2013-10-15T06:01:37Z")
Whew, Edna is out and Tom is safe. That was speedy, I thought it would be milked for another few episodes. Mrs Hughes can sort out Anna/Bates next. And now the previews for next week and the new ladies maid look very interesting. Way to keep us hooked, producers. Another speedy resolution: Lord Gillingham. This one was not well-written. An old family friend [sic] who hasn’t managed a visit to DA in the previous three seasons, shows up and proposes to Mary after a few days re-acquaintance. He was already engaged, or engaged to be engaged and we didn’t really learn much about him. Was his family money all gone? He was so obviously the stopgap suitor to prepare us for the real successor to Matthew. OTOH, the Daisy-other girl-tall footman-cute footman (can never remember their names) quadrangle has been dragging on for at least a season and continues to be a huge time suck; dull characters, boring story, no progress. Get rid of them. When Lady Rosamund (Robert’s sister) speaks, she sounds exactly like Judi Dench. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/downton-abbey-series-4-has-started-in-the-uk-spoilers-for-those-waiting-to-view-on-pbs/669574.md?page=3)