# Dowsing on photos - Test **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [October 6, 2009, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774 "2009-10-06T03:45:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![pramanujan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/91b2a8/32.png) [@pramanujan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pramanujan)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2009, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/81 "2009-10-14T02:27:05Z")
**Irishman** > [@](#): > > I’m sorry this is taking a time, but it is the nature of the beast. We are trying to be rigorous in our test design so that we can be sure the results mean something. Unfortunately, we are left to plan as a committee over the internet, with people posting in bits and spurts as they can. None of us can dedicate the time to this one effort and see in through, we have to squeeze it in to our real lives and commitments. Please be patient. I am getting three holidays here from 17th to 19th. I could use these free time to have the test. So if someone can send the photos by that time, it would be convenient. **RJKUgly** > [@](#): > > Based on the discussion above, we need to establish if will we send scanned pictures via email again, or should this be done with physical pictures through the mail. I think we can use email. What do the rest of you say? Scanned copy by email will be convenient and faster. **zut** > [@](#): > > While you’re waiting for the slow internet discussion to take it’s course, you might be interested in exploring the limitations of “the thing that’s just happening.” For example, try the following unscientific tests: > > 1. What happens when you flip the pictures over? > 2. What happens when you flip the pictures over and randomly mix them so you don’t know which is which? > 3. What happens when you dowse over a blank piece of paper? > 4. What happens if you mix a blank piece of paper in with the upside-down pictures? > 5. What happens if you dowse with your eyes closed? > 6. What happens if someone else sets down a random picture (so you don’t know which one it is) when you’re dowsing with your eyes closed? > 7. What happens if you cover the picture with a blank sheet of paper? > 8. What happens if someone else sets down a random picture (so you don’t know which one it is) and covers it with a blank sheet of paper? Three days from today I am very busy with commitments. Let me use my holidays for this. ---
**Author:** ![JimOfAllTrades](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@JimOfAllTrades](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JimOfAllTrades)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2009, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/82 "2009-10-14T03:13:50Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I ask again that pictures from newspapers that can be accessed via online image searches not be used. I have to agree. Even pictures from dead tree papers might be duplicated online. It would seem that pictures from our own collections would be best. ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2009, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/83 "2009-10-15T02:53:55Z")
Want some pictures of non-famous people? I’ve got some. Maybe somebody could assemble a collection from various sources. ---
**Author:** ![JimOfAllTrades](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@JimOfAllTrades](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JimOfAllTrades)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2009, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/84 "2009-10-15T03:49:15Z")
> [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](#): > > Want some pictures of non-famous people? I’ve got some. Maybe somebody could assemble a collection from various sources. I’d be glad to put some groups together. If you want to email me, we could work things out. ---
**Author:** ![pramanujan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/91b2a8/32.png) [@pramanujan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pramanujan)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2009, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/85 "2009-10-16T03:33:12Z")
> [@](#): > > Quote: > Originally Posted by Hilarity N. Suze View Post > Want some pictures of non-famous people? I’ve got some. Maybe somebody could assemble a collection from various sources. > > RJKUgly said:- > > I’d be glad to put some groups together. If you want to email me, we could work things out. Please work out the things early. I am absolutely free next three days. ---
**Author:** ![pramanujan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/91b2a8/32.png) [@pramanujan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pramanujan)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2009, 10:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/86 "2009-10-17T10:30:50Z")
**RJKUgly** Could you get hold of some more photos? I am waiting. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2009, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/87 "2009-10-17T14:00:21Z")
> [@pramanujan](#): > > **RJKUgly** > > Could you get hold of some more photos? > > I am waiting. Not speaking for **RJKUgly** , but you’re going to have to be patient. Doing this correctly is going to take a little time, not like the quick and sloppy test we first did. ---
**Author:** ![Razncain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9d8465/32.png) [@Razncain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Razncain)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2009, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/88 "2009-10-19T01:05:33Z")
Pramanujan, while you’re waiting on pics, why don’t you go ahead and do at least a single blind test? I suppose you still haven’t done this. Might save everyone involved any future tests with you. It’s been a week since I last wrote Jeff at James Randi, and still no word, so I doubt they are interested, or just don’t have anybody in your area. You might look over this testing of water dowsers, and tell us why you think your fate would be any different. Notice too, many predicted 100% success, some only 80%. They only had to guess which water was going through one pipe out of 10. Despite their utter failure, they still think they had the ability to dowse. It doesn’t matter if it’s water, gold, photos, etc…. [Part I](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JpcFl23dmcQ) [Part II](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hw4EPMkPXFk) [Part III](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUtA7JkuySQ) [Part IV](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53ngwL8GFIQ&feature=related) [Part V](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWkz-4_z-pE&feature=related) ---
**Author:** ![SiXSwordS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/49beb7/32.png) [@SiXSwordS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SiXSwordS)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2009, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/89 "2009-10-19T12:39:22Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Doing this correctly is going to take a little time, not like the quick and sloppy test we first did. I’d just like to add that while the first test was flawed, some aspects of it were very well done including the cropping of the photos and the absence of any clues. The main shortcoming, IMHO, was revealing that most of the people were living. Thanks **RJKUgly**. Maybe a simpler intermediate test could use photos of Indian gods and goddesses mixed with photos of people known to have died. Place the photos in manila envelopes so they are facing east or west and try to distinguish the gods or goddesses from the humans. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2009, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/90 "2009-10-19T18:25:34Z")
That only works if pramanujan knows what reaction pictures of “gods” will give. You’re presuming it would be different than dead people (say dead celebrities - if the test is to put them in envelopes and not look at them during the test, then that would be fine). ---
**Author:** ![SiXSwordS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/49beb7/32.png) [@SiXSwordS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SiXSwordS)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2009, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/91 "2009-10-19T21:23:01Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > That only works if pramanujan knows what reaction pictures of “gods” will give. You’re presuming it would be different than dead people > [@Water Witching](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/water-witching/509722/94): > > The dowsing rod by itself does not have any power. It works with select few people. I am one such person who has been using the dowsing rod. > .. > The dowsing rod also has a very interesting use. .. when the photo of dead person is placed facing south, the dowsing rod indicates positive energy; while in all other directions, it shows negative energy. Similarly, photos of Indian gods and goddesses show positive energy, specially if placed facing east or west. This is part of the claim made in the Water Witching thread. ---
**Author:** ![pramanujan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/91b2a8/32.png) [@pramanujan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pramanujan)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/92 "2009-10-20T16:10:08Z")
**zut** wrote: > [@](#): > > What happens when you flip the pictures over?.. I have tried and here are the results:- 1. What happens when you flip the pictures over? Did you mean “photo turned downwards – i.e. back portion” ? If so, the rod does not react. 1. What happens when you flip the pictures over and randomly mix them so you don’t know which is which? 2. What happens when you dowse over a blank piece of paper? No effect. 1. What happens if you mix a blank piece of paper in with the upside-down pictures? 2. What happens if you dowse with your eyes closed? To hold the rod steady, you need to look at them. With eyes closed, the rods cannot be held steady. 1. What happens if someone else sets down a random picture (so you don’t know which one it is) when you’re dowsing with your eyes closed? Cannot do it with closed eyes. 1. What happens if you cover the picture with a blank sheet of paper? Dowsing rod does not react on blank paper, even if there is a photo behind it. 1. What happens if someone else sets down a random picture (so you don’t know which one it is) and covers it with a blank sheet of paper? Cannot be done with photos covered with blank sheet of paper. ---
**Author:** ![pramanujan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/91b2a8/32.png) [@pramanujan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pramanujan)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/93 "2009-10-20T16:23:06Z")
I had earlier mentioned - > [@](#): > > 1. What happens if you dowse with your eyes closed? > > To hold the rod steady, you need to look at them. With eyes closed, the rods cannot be held steady. This test was slightly extended by me for water divining. Instead of dowsing rod, I usually do this with a coconut too. _Coconut (husk removed) is placed flat on the open palm and I just walk around. When I step on “the underground water stream”, the coconut just rises upright. It falls back to normal flat position when I cross it_. On a trial basis, I tried with closed eyes. Believe me the effect was same, as when you do it with eyes opened. Walking with closed eyes placing a coconut on the palm is possible. But not the dowsing rod, which is very sensitive. ---
**Author:** ![zut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zut/32/2875_2.png) [@zut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zut)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/94 "2009-10-20T16:41:23Z")
So the conclusion here is that, in order to dowse over photos using rods, you have to actually _see_ the image while dowsing. Or, to put it another way, whatever it is that’s happening with the rods requires that your brain process the image on the photo. Is that a fair statement? Do you think it’s possible coconut dowse using photos? ---
**Author:** ![SiXSwordS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/49beb7/32.png) [@SiXSwordS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SiXSwordS)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/95 "2009-10-20T18:43:35Z")
> [@pramanujan](#): > > 1. What happens… when you’re dowsing with your eyes closed? > > Cannot do it with closed eyes. > > 1. What happens if you cover the picture with a blank sheet of paper? > > Dowsing rod does not react on blank paper, even if there is a photo behind it. Is negative energy (or perhaps just energy in general) blocked by the paper or the closed eyelid? ---
**Author:** ![pramanujan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/91b2a8/32.png) [@pramanujan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pramanujan)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2009, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/96 "2009-10-21T01:01:51Z")
[QUOTE] So the conclusion here is that, in order to dowse over photos using rods, you have to actually _see_ the image while dowsing.QUOTE] What I said was - to keep the rod steady, you need to look at it. > [@](#): > > Do you think it’s possible coconut dowse using photos? I do not consider that this is possible. With the coconut, the method itself is different. It is not the position, like, you hold it close to the chest or with arm fully extended. The location is determined by the place where your foot is on. Move one step forward or backward, the coconut moves. With the rod, you hold the rods parallely, pointing to the photo from a distance of 2-3 feet and move forward closer to the photo. Nearer you go, the rods react. ---
**Author:** ![pramanujan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/91b2a8/32.png) [@pramanujan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pramanujan)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2009, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/97 "2009-10-21T01:57:18Z")
**razncain** wrote- > [@](#): > > You might look over this testing of water dowsers, and tell us why you think your fate would be any different. Notice too, many predicted 100% success, some only 80%. They only had to guess which water was going through one pipe out of 10. Despite their utter failure, they still think they had the ability to dowse. It doesn’t matter if it’s water, gold, photos, etc…. I had seen these videos earlier too. Here the test was to identify the pipes through which water is flowing. I have never claimed any such ability. Through water divining, I can identify only the natural sources of water. Many a times, there were underground pipelines and drainage pipes at the places where I had looked for bore points. But these have never interfered or have been identified as water sources. I do not claim on gold, oil etc. I accidently came upon the effect or to say a particular pattern on photos. My efforts are to look for any truth in this, with the help of people like you. Mind you, it is not a claim at all. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2009, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/98 "2009-10-21T02:54:55Z")
> [@pramanujan](#): > > keep the rod steady, you need to look at it. And, as a side affect, you as the dowser must be able to see the photograph. The fact that an opaque piece of paper or flipping the photograph over eliminates your ability to dowse unfortunately makes it very difficult to separate alleged ability and your need to see the photos. So we’ll have to take extreme steps to ensure that you don’t get any useful clues from the photos. ---
**Author:** ![pramanujan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/91b2a8/32.png) [@pramanujan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pramanujan)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/99 "2009-10-22T14:07:09Z")
I do not see much progress in the matter. I view this page 2 times in a day. It is a waste of time. I shall now confine to looking here once in a while only. In case somebody wants me to read any new post, please let me through email. Address is already available. bye ---
**Author:** ![SiXSwordS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/49beb7/32.png) [@SiXSwordS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SiXSwordS)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774/100 "2009-10-22T15:03:56Z")
> [@Water Witching](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/water-witching/509722/94): > > The dowsing rod by itself does not have any power. It works with select few people. I am one such person who has been using the dowsing rod. … With [it] I am in a position to identify the positive and negative energies at a place or of an object. I have also observed that the dowsing rod when placed before the photos of living persons and that of dead persons react differently. Further, when the photo of dead person is placed facing south, the dowsing rod indicates positive energy; while in all other directions, it shows negative energy. > .. > I can show this to any one. > [@pramanujan](#): > > Mind you, it is not a claim at all. So far as I can see there is no need for a test and no claim to test. The first quoted section above contains an obvious claim which could not withstand even the most flaccid scrutiny. The claim has evaporated and I can’t see a reason for keeping the thread open much less for actually testing a non-existent claim. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dowsing-on-photos-test/512774.md?page=6)