# Dr. Phil? Judge Judy? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 22, 2008, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715 "2008-02-22T13:02:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Jinx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Jinx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jinx)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/1 "2008-02-22T13:02:06Z")
What are their qualifications? Are they both shams in the eyes of their respective professions? ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/2 "2008-02-22T13:12:10Z")
You really, really, _really_ need to learn how to [look](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_McGraw) shit [up](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judith_Sheindlin). In short: Phil == Ph.D. in clinical psychology Judy == A former prosecutor and family court judge ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/3 "2008-02-22T13:15:11Z")
[QUOTE=Jinx] What are their qualifications? Are they both shams in the eyes of their respective professions? [/QUOTE] Well, Judge Judy was actually a NYC family court judge for 20 years before she was on TV. Dr. Phil is trained as a psychologist (he has a Ph.D. in psychology). He’s been sanctioned by the Texas State Board of Examiners of Psychologists, though for indiscretions involving a staff member, so I don’t think he can legally practice (in Texas, anyway). Dr. Laura, on the other hand, is a fake…her doctorate is in physiology, not psychology. Her using the “Dr.” is perfectly legal, it’s just misleading and deliberately so, I’d say, as most people are going to assume that her doctorate is in the subject her show is known for, psychology or counselling. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/4 "2008-02-22T15:08:54Z")
[QUOTE=jayjay] Dr. Laura, on the other hand, is a fake…her doctorate is in physiology, not psychology. Her using the “Dr.” is perfectly legal, it’s just misleading and deliberately so, I’d say, as most people are going to assume that her doctorate is in the subject her show is known for, psychology or counselling. [/QUOTE] From Wikipedia: > [@](#): > > Schlessinger received her certification in Marriage, Family, and Child Counseling from the University of Southern California (USC) and lectured at the University of California, Los Angeles (UCLA), the University of California, Irvine, and Pepperdine University. It should be noted, however, that as of January 11, 2008, a search of the roster of professionals licensed by the Board of Behavioral Science Examiners to practice Marriage, Family, and Child Counseling, does not show her to be one so licensed. (Perhaps she let her certification lapse because she no longer practices?) Also, > [@](#): > > Schlessinger has characterized her show as a “moral health program” rather than an “advice program.” I’m not sure what kind of degree does or does not qualify a person to pontificate on morality. Dr. Worm, on the other hand, is not a real doctor, but he is a real worm. And what’s Dr. Demento’s doctorate in? ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/5 "2008-02-22T15:17:42Z")
[QUOTE=jayjay] Well, Judge Judy was actually a NYC family court judge for 20 years before she was on TV. Dr. Phil is trained as a psychologist (he has a Ph.D. in psychology). He’s been sanctioned by the Texas State Board of Examiners of Psychologists, though for indiscretions involving a staff member, so I don’t think he can legally practice (in Texas, anyway)… [/QUOTE] Actually, the indiscrections were with a patient who he later hired. From the Wiki article linked above: > [@](#): > > The Texas State Board of Examiners of Psychologists imposed disciplinary sanctions on McGraw on January 27, 1989 for an inappropriate “dual relationship” reported in 1988 by a therapy client/employee from 1984. McGraw was ordered by the Board to take an ethics class, pass a jurisprudence exam, complete a physical evaluation, undergo a psychological evaluation and have his practice supervised for one year in order to continue his private practice in Texas. McGraw admits to giving the client a “job” at his office (which is not allowed), but denied carrying on a sexual relationship with the 19-year-old, who says their relationship was “sexually inappropriate.”[30][3][12] As of 2008, McGraw has not completed the conditions imposed by the Board of Examiners of Psychologists,and he is not licensed to practice psychology in Texas, California, or anywhere else. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/6 "2008-02-22T15:44:46Z")
Next you’ll be telling me that the King of Swing wasn’t really of royal blood. ---
**Author:** ![Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f0a364/32.png) [@Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rube_E.Tewesday)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/7 "2008-02-22T15:48:14Z")
[QUOTE=Bricker] Next you’ll be telling me that the King of Swing wasn’t really of royal blood. [/QUOTE] How about the Duke of Ellington? The Count of Baisey? The Earl of Hines? The Cab of Calloway? ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/8 "2008-02-22T15:50:05Z")
Neither are as big a sham as Dr. William H. Cosby. ---
**Author:** ![Ponder\_Stibbons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponder_stibbons/32/343_2.png) [@Ponder\_Stibbons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponder_Stibbons)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/9 "2008-02-22T15:59:58Z")
[QUOTE=Rube E. Tewesday] How about the Duke of Ellington? The Count of Baisey? The Earl of Hines? The Cab of Calloway? [/QUOTE] I think we’re onto something here, people! For example, just how many employees _does_ [the Boss](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce_Springsteen) have, anyway? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/10 "2008-02-22T16:05:41Z")
[QUOTE=Wee Bairn] Neither are as big a sham as Dr. William H. Cosby. [/QUOTE] What are you implying here? The Cos has an Ed.D. from UMass. He wrote his dissertation in _Fat Albert_. ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/11 "2008-02-22T16:06:54Z")
[QUOTE=friedo] He wrote his dissertation in _Fat Albert_. [/QUOTE] Exactly. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/12 "2008-02-22T16:08:14Z")
You may be wooshing me, **Wee** , but what is the sham with old Bill Cosby? He earned a true Doctor of Education (Ed. D) degree from the University of Massachusetts long before any of his honorary doctorates. While you may find him unfunny and while you may find his ‘extracurricular’ activities immoral, **Dr.** Cosby is a highly educated man, a well-regarded collegiate athlete, and a former member of the U.S. Navy. And _Noah_ is the second funniest routine after _Who’s On First_, and I will duel to the death anyone who says otherwise. ETA: That’s because he created Fat Albert, a cartoon with an educational message specifically aimed at black youth, at a time when TV was all but ignoring the non-white population. Plus, despite being aimed at black youth, it had great crossover appeal. It really was ground-breaking for its time. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/13 "2008-02-22T16:12:24Z")
[QUOTE=Ponder Stibbons] I think we’re onto something here, people! For example, just how many employees _does_ [the Boss](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce_Springsteen) have, anyway? :dubious: [/QUOTE] How many people are in the E-Street Band? Or maybe you linked to the wrong [Boss](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Steinbrenner)? ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/14 "2008-02-22T16:12:33Z")
excerpt: \*From a review of the new book “Is Bill Cosby Right? (Or Has the Black Middle Class Lost its Mind?)” by Michael Eric Dyson: Not surprisingly, Dyson says Cosby’s attack on these groups amounts to casting the first stone and seeming not to realize that he lives in a glass castle. He points out that Cosby dropped out of high school after flunking the 10th grade three times, earned his GED after enlisting in the Navy and never finished his work for a bachelor’s degree from Temple University. The degree was eventually bestowed on him because of “life experiences,” Dyson reports, adding that the doctorate Cosby was awarded in education from the University of Massachusetts was not without controversy, either. According to Dyson, one member of Cosby’s dissertation committee, Reginald Damerell, reported that Cosby hardly took a class and claimed Cosby’s degree did not “attest to genuine academic achievement.”\* ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/15 "2008-02-22T16:35:06Z")
Given your cite, **Wee** , I tried to see if there was anything to Dr. Dyson’s (PhD., religion) accusations, but any negativity towards Mr. Cosby’s educational accomplishments linked back to the single source. Now, I’ll grant that in Dr. Cosby’s old age, he’s suffered some hoof-in-mouth disease, which Dr. Dyson’s strongly disagrees with. However, given Dr. Cosby’s huge popularity, I would expect more than a single source citing his academic shortcomings. Also, while Dr. Dyson spoke out against Dr. Cosby shortly after some 2004 comments by Dr. Cosby, I can find no retaliation. It seems Dr. Cosby did not take Dr. Dyson’s attacks seriously. (note, all my research took 10 minutes top, so I gladly welcome further information that I may have missed) ---
**Author:** ![jali](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecae2f/32.png) [@jali](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jali)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/16 "2008-02-22T16:37:56Z")
So you mean that Dr. Love isn’t…(gasp) Wow. He’s got some ‘splainin’ to do! ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/17 "2008-02-22T16:59:18Z")
[QUOTE=D\_Odds] Given your cite, **Wee** , I tried to see if there was anything to Dr. Dyson’s (PhD., religion) accusations, but any negativity towards Mr. Cosby’s educational accomplishments linked back to the single source. Now, I’ll grant that in Dr. Cosby’s old age, he’s suffered some hoof-in-mouth disease, which Dr. Dyson’s strongly disagrees with. However, given Dr. Cosby’s huge popularity, I would expect more than a single source citing his academic shortcomings. Also, while Dr. Dyson spoke out against Dr. Cosby shortly after some 2004 comments by Dr. Cosby, I can find no retaliation. It seems Dr. Cosby did not take Dr. Dyson’s attacks seriously. (note, all my research took 10 minutes top, so I gladly welcome further information that I may have missed) [/QUOTE] The fact that he failed the 10th grade at least twice is out there even in pro-Cos bios, and the GED thing is out there as well. Of course, the pro Cos sites imply he was doing just great in school but left to join the navy out of civic duty or some such. The idea that someone couldn’t handle the 10th grade but can then _earn_ a doctorate is a bit dubious IMO, especially a guy with one of the busiest entertainment schedules ever, especially in the 70’s. This notion that he’s some mensa candidate is some sort of media concoction, and his blasting of these “shucking and jiving” blacks who rather muck around than hit the books just shows his hypocrisy, and the mainstream media continually fawning over him instead of ever calling him on it is pathetic. Plus I don’t recall any slander lawsuits from Cos against this author, and we know Cos is quick to sue, as he did when someone claimed to be his daughter had the audacity to bring his fidelity into question. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/18 "2008-02-22T19:46:19Z")
You are right, I did see the fact about flunking out of 10th grade (~16 years old) before entering the Navy and earning his GED. However, he earned his masters at 35 and his EdD at 40, so I’ll allow for a bit of growth between 16 and those ages. And I’ve met enough PhDs to know that it doesn’t necessarily equal mensa (my cousin, who has his in some kind of fitness science, is a prime candidate). I do believe that Dr. Cosby’s statements were, kindly put, “senior moments” (or, not so kindly put, idiotic ramblings of a bitter old man). Slander is pretty hard to prove (as The National Enquirer proved over and over), so maybe he listened to his lawyers’ advice? I really don’t know. He is fawned over, but maybe because he is outspoken, well-spoken (for the most part), self-effacing, and he has given tremendously back to the community. For a nearly 40 year career in the spotlight, he’s had very few scandals (of course, 0 would be the perfect amount) and did so in a _mostly_ family-friendly, non-threatening, racial barrier-breaking way. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/19 "2008-02-22T19:51:28Z")
[QUOTE=friedo] You really, really, _really_ need to learn how to [look](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_McGraw) shit [up](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judith_Sheindlin). In short: Phil == Ph.D. in clinical psychology Judy == A former prosecutor and family court judge [/QUOTE] Friedo, Having a PhD does not preclude one from being considered a sham in the eyes of one’s peers. Marc ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715/20 "2008-02-22T20:05:54Z")
**MGibson** , I don’t see where **friedo** was insinuating anything that may be considered acceptance by Dr. Phil’s peers or anyone else. It was just a statement of fact. Dr. Phil has a Ph.D. in clinical psychology. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dr-phil-judge-judy/438715.md?page=2)